Which of course is not true, as you can see just watching the tapes. But let me ask the only relevant question once again:
**Do you have any objective evidence that the World Trade Center was destroyed by demolitions?
Yes or no?**
Actually, you probably couldn’t. Anything burning was pretty well watched that day. Getting stuff out was unlikely, and getting explosives in even less likely. That doesn’t even scratch the effort needed to properly place the explosives.
Now, once again you miss a major stumbling block: If they got all that stuff out, why would they need to blow the building up?
So lack of suspicous happening is evidence of a conspiracy. Gotcha.
No they didn’t. Debris from WTC1 & 2 severely damaged nealy all the buildings nearby, including WTC7. But feel free to keep telling yourself that lie, just don’t expect us to buy it.
Let me understand the logic here. You believe there was a small team of experts who managed to wire two World Trade Center towers completely ignored by thousands of office workers, and who did it with such skill that even planes crashing into the buildings didn’t screw up the job. The evidence of their skill is “nice symmetrical implosions.”
At the same time, the people who designed the plan forgot to hire some geek with an ID that read DATA STORAGE who could copy file and back up hard drives, and had to delay the destruction of the building for seven hours so they could go back and retrieve them.
Or, as an alternate explanation, the people who designed the plan held off destroying WTC 7 to misdirect us, because having a 47-story building crash while two 110-story buildings were crashing only a few hundred yards away would be too suspicious. Better to have it crash hours later and blame it on a fire.
Okay, if you think I’m getting too hung up on minor details, maybe you would consent to answer some of the bigger questions.
Why was it necessary to have both hijacked airplanes and detonations for WTC 1 and 2?
Why was it NOT necessary to crash an airplane into WTC 7?
Why fire a missile into the Pentagon, when they could have crashed flight 77 into it? And what happened to flight 77, if it didn’t crash into the Pentagon?
Why was it decided to shoot down flight 93 over a rural area instead of going ahead and flying it right into the heart of Washington?
Since the government itself admitted it would have shot down flight 93 if it could, what was the benefit of covering it up?
Does the downing of flight 93 and the attack on the Pentagon implicate the military, or exonerate it? Explain.
What was the role of George W. Bush? Was he a willing participant, or was he a clueless puppet?
If the goal of 9/11 was to put a more pliable government in Afghanistan to make possible the building of an oil pipeline, what happened to the pipeline? Have contracts been let? Has the bidding process started? Is there even a design anywhere?
It seems to me that any conspiracy smart enough to hijack airplanes, demolish buildings, fire missiles, shoot down airplanes and find a strawman to blame it on in less than 9 months can get a pipline started more than four years later. Or was the pipeline not the goal?
And you can either answer RickJay in a separate post, or while answering my questions.
So far, I’ve rather enjoyed the discussion. But after 8 pages even my patience is wearing thin. Humor me. Show me how the pieces fit together.
Bring your evidence to the table. Or admit that you don’t have the evidence.
If there was evidence it would be a sign that there was no conspiracy.
No, no, no! WTC7 was blown up 7 hours later only because the plane that was supposed to hit it never showed up! It was supposed to be hit shortly after 1 and 2, but the government chickened out because all air traffic was grounded and it would be too conspicuous. Seven hours later the globalists suddenly remembered that WTC7 hadn’t been hit yet, so instructed Silverstein to “pull it.”
This conspiracy theory stuff is easy! Just come up with crazy-ass sh*t, no evidence required!
I almost hate to admit it, but I don’t think our government is smart enough to truly pull this off, if it were a conspiracy.
After all, look how many theorists already suspect, things don’t add up, etc.
If they were that powerful, no one would’ve suspected.
bigpappadiaz and Sent, if you have a moment, please meander over here.
BTW, an aside to the Dopers. Here’s a pretty good analysis of the passport. For the next time you find yourselves in one of these discussions.
Well, it’s been a few days and I don’t even see a serious attempt to answer my question. If this is what it means when you tell someone “Trust me”, then I figure no-one can.
Hi Straight Dopers, it’s me again. Yes, I am still going to answer those 12 questions I promised, as soon as I go back through and find them again.
It’s time, you guys, to wake up. Your government has been the theorist spinning lies. You think I’m an idiot theorist but I think eventually on this issue you will see for yourselves. Unless you believe in tyranny and mass-murdering your countrymen, then we are on the same side, you just don’t know it yet. There is a greater evil at work here. Here I will show you further evidence. Please, genuinely look at this video slowed down several times. Honestly, truly look at it, and think about it. Unless your vision is poor I think you can see it pretty well. If you have a family, if you care about anything, just look at this for once without thinking about how you are going to “debunk” it. This is not a joke, I don’t come here for the entertainment value (though you’re all quick-witted).
http://www.yourfilelink.com/get.php?fid=74617
Compare visible orange and red flashes going all around the building to this testimony by Captain Karin Deshore of Battalion 46 of the NYC Fire Department who almost died that day:
From page 15 of this interview.
To the best of my knowledge, the video has not been altered in any way, just progressively slowed down. You can see the little flashes of the explosives because the shadow is facing the direction of the camera, whereas in the other videos of bright sunlight you couldn’t see them. It corroborates perfectly with the eyewitness testimonies of numerous firefighters, including Captain Deshore. This is not a joke, or a game.
I’m sorry that you still don’t seem to get it but, while its no joke and no game it also doesn’t constitute physical evidence. Its just the same old thing served up in a slightly different way. You still haven’t answered any of the questions I and others have asked. You still haven’t provided us with anything remotely like physical proof. Hell, you still haven’t even showed a theoretical model for how the towers MIGHT have been brought down via explosives, what it would have taken, how many floors would or were effected and how many LBM per floor were (or needed to be) taken out to meet your theory.
I don’t know what more to tell you. Not many people on this board are going to take you remotely seriously without something other than a subjective video that could be showing anything…or nothing. Not without SOME kind of proof to back it up. Which, to date, you have yet to provide.
-XT
Is there anyone else among you who can SEE the tiny flashes I am talking about? Honestly. If you’re trying to not see them, I guess you won’t. Explain to me, scientifically, what these flashes are. They are not sunlight, the sunlight is not hitting the building.
Shouldn’t be too hard to find them on this board. After all, it’s not like the posts are disappearing.
Care to provide evidence that “we guys” are asleep?
Care to provide evidence that:
(a) shows the government is spinning lies,
and
(b) shows what the motive would be for spinning such lies?
Actually, I don’t think you’re a theorist at all. I think you’re just regurgitating stuff you think sounds cool. No doubt, you’re stunned that “we guys” aren’t buying that “cool” trash.
What will we see for ourselves? You have yet to provide any actual evidence to support your claims.
Point the First: There is no tyranny in the United States of America. It’s amazing to me that you can even assert that when we have, in the US, free elections, free courts, and a free press.
Point the Second: The charge of mass murder is a very serious charge. If there really were such a tyranny as you postulate, why would you think it safe to make such a claim against someone in the government? More to the point, upon what actual evidence do you base that charge?
What evil would that be? And greater than what?
Further implies that you have shown us any evidence. As you and your fellow conspiracy buff have been repeatedly reminded, you have yet to present any actual evidence.
What does whether someone cares about his or her family or not have to do with the validity of evidence?
Actually, I think the attacks on September 11, 2001 were neither jokes nor games. That’s why I’m so puzzled that you feel the need to toss out charges such as “mass murder” absent any actual evidence. I’m also puzzled why you are jumping feet first into the game of baseless charges and blind acceptance of conpsiracy buff stories (I refuse to call them theories).
Best explanation: what you see is material on fire being expelled and snuffed at the same time by the colossal pancaking.
Sent,
I refer you to Post #118 in the Pit thread linked above.
It has to do with the fact that people go onto message boards in different moods. Some people just like to argue for the sake of arguing. Other people have a purpose in what they are doing. I’m not just words on a page, I am person. So I am trying to call you out as a person, not a post on a message board. Particularly those of you who are Americans and value this country and the freedoms you currently enjoy. To me, I have seen enough evidence to show me that I am being lied to about the events of that day, so I am looking at everything I can find trying to determine for myself, from square one, what did happen. Not just scientific papers but what happened, and who said what, and why I believed what I believed about what was happening in the world and in my country. I don’t really need to tell you how it would effect your life, or anyone you care about, if I am right. It would indeed be a road to tyranny. I am using what free speech I still have in the way that it is supposed to be used, to stop the loss of freedoms that we currently still enjoy as of this day. I don’t believe that freedom is a given, I think people have to be vigilant in keeping it or else it can be lost because of those who are basically psychopaths but appear to me normal people.
You don’t really know me. I don’t change my opinions easily, I am a skeptic. I believed the official account for almost 4 years. I thought that people who were questioning it were doing it because they just didn’t like the President (can’t say I ever liked the guy either but I was not about to even consider that someone in office would go that far). Certain unanswered questions led me to do more and more of my own research on various subjects related to the events of 9/11. The more I’ve been reading, the more I can see that I was greatly deceived. For example, are you aware of the EPA cover-up that is going to result in probably more deaths from toxic dust than there were total deaths on 9/11? The people of New York were lied to and now many people will die because of it. This is only scratching the surface. If you know anyone who worked there, you should implore them to research what happened so they can get medical attention, and join the lawsuit.
For me it is no longer a matter of finding out whether there has really been government complicity, but of finding out what exactly did happen and how did they do it. I of course realize what the implications of this are for me personally and everyone in this country, so that is why I am through various means trying to alert people to what I believe is happening. For example I’ve written to every major news outlet in this country imploring them to reexamine what they’ve been told about that day, and giving them the evidence I had at the time. I am doing the work of a researcher, or someone gathering evidence for a case. I know the basics of what didn’t happen but I’m not as clear on the details of what did. I’m pooling resources with others, sharing information and ideas.
Any of those people competent in what they’re doing?
Yes, some of them are. It’s an organic thing that happens…everybody just does whatever they can do. You get different people from different backgrounds to whom certain things do not add up. People in NYC who witnessed things that contradicted the official narrative of events. Pilots who know about flying planes. Metal workers who know about metal. Someone who used to work on building steel-frame skyscrapers. A few scientists few and far between willing to question their basic assumptions. Many people who are obsessed with collecting vast quantities of news and trying to make sense of contradictions they find. Not an organized structure of people per se, a grassroots movement. Some organization is starting to happen though. Unfortunately, it is very hard to get people to be critical of their cherished ideas, things that they thought over for years and believed they had all the answers to. It’s hard to get people to go into uncomfortable territory, especially when you don’t have the resources and you’re stonewalled and ridiculed at every turn.
What link are you referring to?
Ah, scientists who reject science. Thanks.
Scroll up to post #388.