# 9-11 Hijackers **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 8, 2002, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/9-11-hijackers/113036 "2002-06-08T23:44:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 5\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![jb\_farley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9d8465/32.png) [@jb\_farley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jb_farley)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2002, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/9-11-hijackers/113036/1 "2002-06-08T23:44:02Z")
how did we know the identities of the 19 9-11 hijackers [almost immediately](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/nation/attacked/transcripts/muellertext_091401.html) after the bombing? i mean, their names did not appear on [passenger manifestos](http://geocities.com/mknemesis/passengers.html). and they were carrying [fake identification](http://www.nandotimes.com/special_reports/terrorism/investigation/story/272309p-2494736c.html), which they used to board the planes. especially since, contrary to early reports of documents and jihad manuals found in suitcases and car trunks, [no paper trail has or had been established](http://www.fbi.gov/pressrel/speeches/speech041902.htm). i don’t know what to make of this. on one hand, I don’t want to come across as Alex Jones, weaving huge webs of conspiracy out of a handful of documented facts. on the other, out-of-hand dismissals of alternate conspiracies is as anti-intellectual as an unthinking embrace of conspiracy. jb ---
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2002, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/9-11-hijackers/113036/2 "2002-06-09T00:44:43Z")
“…their names did not appear on passenger manifestos…” > [@](#): > > [Hijacker had Logan ‘ramp pass’](http://www.telegram.com/news/page_one/ramppass.html) > > Thursday, September 13, 2001 > > The Boston Globe > > …The names of the 12 men with Arabic surnames were not on a passenger list made public yesterday by American Airlines and United Air Lines, whose planes were hijacked Tuesday morning. But The Boston Globe obtained the complete list, and law enforcement sources confirmed that they were focusing on up to a dozen of the Arabic men as they piece together how the two Boston flights were hijacked… > > Acccording to the manifest, Atta was assigned seat 8D in business class on Flight 11… > > The passenger list for Flight 175 shows that Marwan Alshehri got on the plane that left Boston and slammed into one of the Manhattan skyscrapers 15 minutes after Flight 11… “…they were carrying fake identification…” > [@](#): > > [The Hijackers We Let Escape](http://www.msnbc.com/news/760647.asp?0nw=n2d) > > June 10, 2002 > > Newsweek > > …Alhazmi and Almihdhar lived openly in the United States, using their real names, obtaining driver’s licenses, opening bank accounts and enrolling in flight schools—until the morning of September 11, when they walked aboard American Airlines Flight 77 and crashed it into the Pentagon. “…no paper trail has or had been established…” What the FBI director was saying in that speech was that the hijackers left no paper trail in the sense of documents saying “The Chairman has decided that The Day will come on September 11. Allah be with you!” They _did_ leave a paper trail of attending flight school, rooming together in the same motels, buying tickets for the flights which were hijacked on September 11, and boarding those flights. ---
**Author:** ![jb\_farley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9d8465/32.png) [@jb\_farley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jb_farley)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2002, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/9-11-hijackers/113036/3 "2002-06-09T01:23:13Z")
wow. sweet, mr. **buckner**. good research, dude. also, i just realized that my manifesto cite specifically says “No Arab or Hijacker Names included”. has whoever released the edited passenger manifesto given the reason that some names were withheld? what i mean is, did they remove _ **all** _ Arabic-sounding names? or only the names of the suspected terrorists? if the latter, how could they tell the difference so quickly between mere Arab-sounding names and true-blue terrorists? and also if the latter, had there been any change, i.e. “whoops, that guy’s not a terrorist- let’s take him off our terrorist list and put his name back in the manifesto list”. and in all due respect, **MEBuckner** , your second cite only states that Alhazmi and Almihdhar used their real names. that leave 17 other quick identifications to make ASAP post-911. all i am saying is that, needing a quick answer real soon, mightn’t those heading our intelligence agencies want to jump on the most probable answer? and seeing as how we had two known al-Qaeda members on the manifesto (and therefore the flight), coupled with the human propensity to overvalue evidence which reinforces our perceptions (and conversely ignore evidence which contradicts them), mightn’t intelligence higher-ups have stuck with their first hunch? now, this makes me think of two questions. If their hunch was so strong, why hadn’t that hunch (again, this is the higher-ups, not local agents) been acknowledged before? and if it was not a hunch but reliable evidence, why (!!!) hadn’t this evidence been acted upon before? my whole point is that whenever i hear an administration official speak about Terrorist Threats, i almost invariably smell a rat at some point. i know i am being lied to, but i can’t tell where. now, don’t get me wrong. i understand that i will not hear most info until FOIA gives it to me. like, some of the stuff i’m being lied to about, i’m being lied to because it’s sensitive security data. i’m cool with that. i don’t like it, but i’m cool with it. but there is a definite rat smell. the speedy identification of the hijackers (as well as Bush administrationaries not flying commercial flights after a warning in August) leads me to think that a lot more was known beforehand. either that, or the quick identification and the al-Qaeda angle was a whole lot of bullshit. jb ---
**Author:** ![JDM](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/90db22/32.png) [@JDM](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JDM)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2002, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/9-11-hijackers/113036/4 "2002-06-09T20:20:54Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by MEBuckner \* > \*\*Acccording to the manifest, Atta was assigned seat 8D in business class on Flight 11… \*\* You mean if I were a terrorist I’d get to fly business class?? Great- you tell me that now, after I deleted that Al Quaeda sign up email with the free 100 long distance minutes!!! JDM ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2002, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/9-11-hijackers/113036/5 "2002-06-09T22:06:06Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by JDM \* > You mean if I were a terrorist I’d get to fly business class? Only if you were well-funded, and wanted to sit near the front of the airplane so it’d be easier to take the cockpit and herd the passengers to the rear.