# A big eye roll for the New York Times **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 31, 2005, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-eye-roll-for-the-new-york-times/319470 "2005-08-31T19:25:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Absolute](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b2d939/32.png) [@Absolute](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Absolute)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2005, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-eye-roll-for-the-new-york-times/319470/1 "2005-08-31T19:25:02Z")
From an editorial in today’s edition ([http://www.nytimes.com/2005/08/31/opinion/31wed1.html](http://www.nytimes.com/2005/08/31/opinion/31wed1.html)): > [@](#): > > But this seems like the wrong moment to dwell on fault-finding, or even to point out that it took what may become the worst natural disaster in American history to pry President Bush out of his vacation. All the focus now must be on rescuing the survivors. :rolleyes: If it’s the wrong moment to mention it, then why did you? The hypocrisy is what bothers me, not the jab at Bush itself. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2005, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-eye-roll-for-the-new-york-times/319470/2 "2005-08-31T19:43:06Z")
They said it only _seems_ like the wrong moment, not that it _isn’t_ the wrong moment. There’s never a wrong moment to find facts and therefore find fault, or to point out flaws in the leadership performance of persons elected to be leaders. ---
**Author:** ![Earthworm\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f07891/32.png) [@Earthworm\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earthworm_Jim)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2005, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-eye-roll-for-the-new-york-times/319470/3 "2005-08-31T19:47:10Z")
I’m with you on the hypocrisy, but I have to wonder - what other events did the author feel Bush should have returned from his vacation for? Or is he just mad that Bush was on vacation in principle? Honestly, I’m no W fan; but I just don’t get this “Bush was on vacation when the hurricane hit!” thing. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2005, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-eye-roll-for-the-new-york-times/319470/4 "2005-08-31T19:54:12Z")
It’s not hypocrisy. It’s paralipsis. Big difference. ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2005, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-eye-roll-for-the-new-york-times/319470/5 "2005-08-31T20:04:11Z")
> [@Absolute](#): > > If it’s the wrong moment to mention it, then why did you? I thought it was a Bush apologist’s pre-emptive strike against George’s critics, myself. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2005, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-eye-roll-for-the-new-york-times/319470/6 "2005-08-31T20:15:52Z")
> [@Earthworm Jim](#): > > I’m with you on the hypocrisy, but I have to wonder - what other events did the author feel Bush should have returned from his vacation for? Anything. Everything. Nothing. It is roughly similar to post-9/11. No matter what Bush did, someone was going to fault him for it. If he jumps up and runs from the class room, he is panicking. If he stays for seven minutes after hearing the news, he froze. It might be interesting to hear what the NY Times editorial writer believes Bush could have done to prevent the disaster by not going on vacation. It’s the Farenheit 9/11 school of criticism - “the President should have done something” where “something” is left undefined. Then, no matter what he does, it was wrong. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2005, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-eye-roll-for-the-new-york-times/319470/7 "2005-08-31T20:19:18Z")
Leaders are supposed to provide leadership. To most of us, that’s obvious. To a reflexive apologist, obviously not :wally: ---
**Author:** ![DMark](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@DMark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMark)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2005, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-eye-roll-for-the-new-york-times/319470/8 "2005-08-31T20:24:33Z")
How dare the New York Times insinuate Bush isn’t providing top notch leadership. ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2005, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-eye-roll-for-the-new-york-times/319470/9 "2005-08-31T20:25:32Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > It might be interesting to hear what the NY Times editorial writer believes Bush could have done to prevent the disaster by not going on vacation. It’s the Farenheit 9/11 school of criticism - “the President should have done something” where “something” is left undefined. It would be equally interesting to hear what Bush could do in Washington that he couldn’t (according to the administration’s previous claims) have done equally well in Crawford. From [Salon](http://www.salon.com/politics/war_room/): > [@](#): > > So Bush heads back to Washington today – and soon, to the scene of the disaster in Louisiana – but for what? What can Bush do for the people of New Orleans that isn’t being done already? What can he do that he couldn’t do in Crawford? Scott McClellan didn’t have much of an answer yesterday. Throughout the president’s vacation – as American soldiers were killed and the political progress faltered in Iraq – the White House insisted that Bush had all the powers of the modern presidency in his command down in Crawford. So why does Bush have to go back to Washington now? Isn’t it just symbolic, like standing on that fire truck and shouting in a bullhorn after 9/11? > > “No, I think – no, I disagree,” McClellan said yesterday. “Like I said, this is one of the most devastating storms in our nation’s history, and the president, after receiving a further update this morning, made the decision that he wanted to get back to D.C. and oversee the response efforts from there.” Pressed on what Bush could do in Washington that he couldn’t do in Crawford, McClellan said: “We’ll talk to you all later. We’ve got to go. Thank you.” ---
**Author:** ![THespos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8c91f0/32.png) [@THespos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/THespos)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2005, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-eye-roll-for-the-new-york-times/319470/10 "2005-08-31T20:31:13Z")
Reminds me of those people who start sentences with “I don’t want to complain, but…” and then they proceed to complain. That aside, I’m personally miffed that Shrub seems to have had another “My Pet Goat” moment when he should have been getting his butt back to Washington to show some leadership and help deal with this crisis. I’m not up in arms, but I think it’s monumentally stupid to pick up a guitar when something this devastating happens. ---
**Author:** ![Necros](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/necros/32/11086_2.png) [@Necros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Necros)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2005, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-eye-roll-for-the-new-york-times/319470/11 "2005-08-31T20:36:12Z")
As for what you can do from DC that he couldn’t do from Crawford, the answer as I see it is: Keep up appearances. He can’t actually perform any additional tasks in Washington, aside from maybe sitting down with FEMA officials as opposed to having a conference call with them, but it is, I think, important for him to be SEEN doing something. Even if he was coordinating the Red Cross personally from his ranch, the hue and cry you would hear rising would go something like: “Bush is on vacation while New Orleans floods! On VACATION! Why doesn’t he get to work while all these people are suffering?!” I think most people in the country aren’t used to the idea of telecommuting, let alone the idea of a president doing it. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2005, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-eye-roll-for-the-new-york-times/319470/12 "2005-08-31T20:39:12Z")
Not hypocrisy, just a cheap political shot clothed in false “we’re above that sort of thing” language. Obviously, Bush should have rushed to the spot before the storm hit to hold back the wind and waves by sheer force of personality. This is good too:“People who think of that graceful city and the rest of the Mississippi Delta as tourist destinations must have been reminded, watching the rescue operations, that the real residents of this area are in the main poor and black. The only resources most of them will have to fall back on will need to come from the federal government.” Guess the local and state leaders didn’t do more to ensure the city’s ability to handle a category 4 hurricane (or have any interest in providing relief efforts) because they’re elitist and racist. And if the Administration doesn’t come through with the aid the Times feels is warranted, they’re set up for similar charges. ---
**Author:** ![THespos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8c91f0/32.png) [@THespos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/THespos)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2005, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-eye-roll-for-the-new-york-times/319470/13 "2005-08-31T20:47:03Z")
> [@Necros](#): > > As for what you can do from DC that he couldn’t do from Crawford, the answer as I see it is: Keep up appearances. He can’t actually perform any additional tasks in Washington, aside from maybe sitting down with FEMA officials as opposed to having a conference call with them, but it is, I think, important for him to be SEEN doing something. I think it’s more than just keeping up appearances. It’s just inappropriate to goof off when a major disaster like this hits. ---
**Author:** ![Maeglin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@Maeglin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maeglin)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2005, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-eye-roll-for-the-new-york-times/319470/14 "2005-08-31T20:51:33Z")
Hypocrisy? I think you misspelled “rhetoric”. ---
**Author:** ![Necros](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/necros/32/11086_2.png) [@Necros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Necros)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2005, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-eye-roll-for-the-new-york-times/319470/15 "2005-08-31T21:18:51Z")
> [@THespos](#): > > I think it’s more than just keeping up appearances. It’s just inappropriate to goof off when a major disaster like this hits. Well, that was my point. He wasn’t goofing off in Crawford, he was coordinating the administration response from there. It’s just the people would perhaps perceive that, because he was in Crawford, he was goofing off. That’s why he went to Washington. He may be sitting in the Oval Office playing XBox, but because he’s in Washington, people think he’s Doing Something. even if what he’s doing is nothing different than what he did in Crawford. ---
**Author:** ![THespos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8c91f0/32.png) [@THespos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/THespos)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2005, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-eye-roll-for-the-new-york-times/319470/16 "2005-08-31T21:42:30Z")
> [@Necros](#): > > That’s why he went to Washington. He may be sitting in the Oval Office playing XBox, but because he’s in Washington, people think he’s Doing Something. even if what he’s doing is nothing different than what he did in Crawford. We’re talking about two different things. When I said “goofing off” I was referring to him playing guitar with a country music artist in San Diego, not vacationing in Crawford. ---
**Author:** ![Necros](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/necros/32/11086_2.png) [@Necros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Necros)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2005, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-eye-roll-for-the-new-york-times/319470/17 "2005-08-31T21:44:06Z")
Ahh, my bad. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2005, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-eye-roll-for-the-new-york-times/319470/18 "2005-08-31T21:46:03Z")
I think the point they’re trying to make is not “wow, the president was vacationing when a natural disaster happened to happen. How foolish of him.” It was “ahh, so THAT’s what it takes to make him stop vacationing… you might THINK that an ongoing war in Iraq, plus all the other crises going on right now, would keep him from vacationing. But they didn’t. But New Orleans destroyed? THAT does it. Good to know that SOMETHING will.” Which is, while not necessarily a Provably Correct viewpoint, a lot less silly than “how DARE he be on vacation when a natural disaster occurs”. ---
**Author:** ![THespos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8c91f0/32.png) [@THespos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/THespos)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2005, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-eye-roll-for-the-new-york-times/319470/19 "2005-08-31T21:57:07Z")
> [@Necros](#): > > Ahh, my bad. :smack: No prob. BTW, my office mates think I’m crazy because I’m giggling over here envisioning Dubya playing XBox. ---
**Author:** ![Absolute](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b2d939/32.png) [@Absolute](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Absolute)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2005, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-eye-roll-for-the-new-york-times/319470/20 "2005-08-31T22:22:51Z")
I think hypocrisy is the perfect word for it. From the OED: “hypocrisy: The practice of claiming to have moral standards or beliefs to which one’s own behavior does not conform.” They pretend that they are above pointing fingers and taking cheap political shots in a crisis like this, and then include a cheap political shot in the very same sentence. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-eye-roll-for-the-new-york-times/319470.md?page=2)