# A big middle finger to the people who took advantage to politicize the school shooting **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 19, 2018, 9:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-middle-finger-to-the-people-who-took-advantage-to-politicize-the-school-shooting/809107 "2018-02-19T09:00:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2018, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-middle-finger-to-the-people-who-took-advantage-to-politicize-the-school-shooting/809107/281 "2018-02-21T18:38:22Z")
[ol] [li]It’s not that big[/li][li]And it’s not a finger[/li][li]ewwwwww[/li][/ol] ---
**Author:** ![ausqb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c89c15/32.png) [@ausqb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ausqb)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2018, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-middle-finger-to-the-people-who-took-advantage-to-politicize-the-school-shooting/809107/282 "2018-02-21T21:05:55Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > If the US lapses into tyranny, most of the people will support it. > > There aren’t any dictatorships where the guy on top is opposed by everyone underneath. That may happen in the movies but it doesn’t happen in real life. The Communists were largely supported in the Soviet Union. The Nazis had broad support in Germany. The Fascists had lots of support in Italy. Today’s emerging dictatorships all enjoy wide support. Erdogan? Putin? Popular as hell. > > Your idea that all American gun owners would rise up and oppose a dictatorship is absurd. It’s a preposterous fantasy that ignores the entirety of human history, as ludicrous as thinking the dictatorship would be overthrown by space aliens. It’s true that dictators are popular or they wouldn’t have the capacity to be dictators. However, it’s also true that an armed populace drastically increases the cost of ruling through violence and intimidation. The Warsaw ghetto uprising is frequently cited by gun control fans as an example where armed resistance made no difference. I actually draw the opposite conclusion. If 220 men initially armed mostly with handguns stuck in their belts could hold off the SS for an entire month, how is it that SIX MILLION jews armed with rifles would have made no difference at all? Talk about absurd! What second amendment supporters are pointing to is not some mythical Red Dawn scenario, but a very pragmatic and demonstrable notion that ruling by violence and intimidation is far more costly when the oppressed are armed, thereby requiring government to CONTINUALLY retain a larger degree of consent from the governed. I grant that the right to bear arms is insufficient by itself to stand against tyranny, but it does not follow that it’s unimportant. On the contrary it is indispensable along with freedom of speech/press, due process, etc, and to deny that obvious fact “ignores the entirety of human history” in my opinion. You’re actually the one who seems to imply that there exists some “magic bullet” (no pun intended) to protect fragile human rights in the event of a crisis, but the reality is that it takes a whole basket of complementary protections, among which the right to bear arms is just one. FWIW I’m also troubled by these idiots shooting up schools, but emotional knee jerk reactions seldom make for good national policy. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2018, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-middle-finger-to-the-people-who-took-advantage-to-politicize-the-school-shooting/809107/283 "2018-02-21T21:11:10Z")
> [@ausqb](#): > > It’s true that dictators are popular or they wouldn’t have the capacity to be dictators. > > However, it’s also true that an armed populace drastically increases the cost of ruling through violence and intimidation. > > The Warsaw ghetto uprising is frequently cited by gun control fans as an example where armed resistance made no difference. I actually draw the opposite conclusion. If 220 men initially armed mostly with handguns stuck in their belts could hold off the SS for an entire month, how is it that SIX MILLION jews armed with rifles would have made no difference at all? Talk about absurd! The problem is that most of these people with guns will not be fighting against the govt, but with it, to suppress the minorities that are unwelcome. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2018, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-middle-finger-to-the-people-who-took-advantage-to-politicize-the-school-shooting/809107/284 "2018-02-21T21:28:05Z")
> [@Derleth](#): > > Especially since the kinds of people who own the most guns are precisely the kinds of people who’d institute a dictatorship once it became clear that they couldn’t gerrymander their way into owning the place: Conservative White Evangelicals morally opposed to gays, trans people, brown people, and any religion other than Moral Majority Deficit Hawk. > > In other words, the kinds of people who are at the wrong end of the demographic and cultural shift, who can no longer simply assume their ideas will be taken seriously, and, because they couldn’t form a cogent argument in favor of those ideas if you held a gun to their heads, are at increased risk of holding a gun to everyone else’s. > [@Luciano700](#): > > You forgot male, able-bodied, neurotypical, adult and fit. And YOU forgot that we’re onto you, troll. Not much point in you continuing your already pathetic attempts at rhetorical jujitsu. Personally, my only motivation to return to this thread is to see if there’s any new mocking at your expense being generated. At this point, you’d be better off cutting your losses and fucking off to some site where the netizens are a bit slower on the uptake. > [@](#): > > Anyways, why would they want to start a dictatorship? Why indeed? It appears to be spontaneously arising without any “starting” being needed. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2018, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-middle-finger-to-the-people-who-took-advantage-to-politicize-the-school-shooting/809107/285 "2018-02-21T22:26:40Z")
> [@crowmanyclouds](#): > > Given the _quality_ of Russian Troll™ we’re getting . . . we clearly _aren’t_ important enough to rate having one! ☹ > > CMC fnord! We obviously get the ones that aren’t good enough for the New York Times, or even the Arkansas Democrat-Gazette. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2018, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-middle-finger-to-the-people-who-took-advantage-to-politicize-the-school-shooting/809107/286 "2018-02-21T22:26:43Z")
> [@Luciano700](#): > > Ugh, this is probably the 100th time I mention and it will probably the last time I do so, but I have a learning/thinking disability. So? Not our problem. ---
**Author:** ![Not\_Carlson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bc79bd/32.png) [@Not\_Carlson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Not_Carlson)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2018, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-middle-finger-to-the-people-who-took-advantage-to-politicize-the-school-shooting/809107/287 "2018-02-21T22:56:31Z")
> [@Not\_a\_Platypus](#): > > I genuinely wasn’t trying to be a dick > [@Derleth](#): > > No hard feelings. Alright then. Off to the pub! ---
**Author:** ![Not\_Carlson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bc79bd/32.png) [@Not\_Carlson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Not_Carlson)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2018, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-middle-finger-to-the-people-who-took-advantage-to-politicize-the-school-shooting/809107/288 "2018-02-21T22:57:36Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > [ol] > [li]It’s not that big[/li][li]And it’s not a finger[/li][li]ewwwwww[/li][/ol] Winz! ---
**Author:** ![apLundell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aplundell/32/14656_2.png) [@apLundell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/apLundell)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2018, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-middle-finger-to-the-people-who-took-advantage-to-politicize-the-school-shooting/809107/289 "2018-02-21T23:05:13Z")
> [@Luciano700](#): > > I literally heard more gun debate talk than prayers. Only one of those things might actually accomplish something. So let’s do that one. ---
**Author:** ![Not\_a\_Platypus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/d26b3c/32.png) [@Not\_a\_Platypus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Not_a_Platypus)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2018, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-middle-finger-to-the-people-who-took-advantage-to-politicize-the-school-shooting/809107/290 "2018-02-21T23:05:58Z")
> [@Derleth](#): > > No hard feelings. > [@Not\_Carlson](#): > > Alright then. Off to the pub! Cheers! ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2018, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-middle-finger-to-the-people-who-took-advantage-to-politicize-the-school-shooting/809107/291 "2018-02-22T00:37:06Z")
Here is someone actually politicizing the shooting. [Congresswoman claims most mass shooters are Democrats](https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/congresswoman-claims-most-mass-shooters-are-democrats/ar-BBJqSIr?li=BBnb7Kz) > [@](#): > > “It’s interesting that so many of these people that commit the mass murders end up being Democrats,” Tenney said. “But the media doesn’t talk about that.” Just once, JUST ONCE the follow up question should be _‘Are you fucking serious???’_ ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2018, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-middle-finger-to-the-people-who-took-advantage-to-politicize-the-school-shooting/809107/292 "2018-02-22T00:50:31Z")
> [@Typo\_Negative](#): > > Here is someone actually politicizing the shooting. > > [Congresswoman claims most mass shooters are Democrats](https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/congresswoman-claims-most-mass-shooters-are-democrats/ar-BBJqSIr?li=BBnb7Kz) > > Just once, JUST ONCE the follow up question should be _‘Are you fucking serious???’_ From your link: > [@](#): > > CNN followed up for clarification from her office and asked specifically what statistics she was referring to, and has not heard back. I know: not the phrasing you were hoping for, but still. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2018, 5:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-middle-finger-to-the-people-who-took-advantage-to-politicize-the-school-shooting/809107/293 "2018-02-22T05:42:23Z")
> [@ausqb](#): > > FWIW I’m also troubled by these idiots shooting up schools, but emotional knee jerk reactions seldom make for good national policy. You may be onto something. And “_blah-de-blah-de-blah-de-COLD DEAD HANDS!!!1!!ELEVEN_” is an emotional knee-jerk reaction if I ever heard one. ---
**Author:** ![DWMarch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dwmarch/32/1010_2.png) [@DWMarch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DWMarch)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2018, 8:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-middle-finger-to-the-people-who-took-advantage-to-politicize-the-school-shooting/809107/294 "2018-02-22T08:48:52Z")
Alright, despite my suspicions about the OP, I’ll respond sincerly. Back when I was a teenager I wanted to believe in God. The reason for this was because I knew that I was a thing that had an end date on it and when that date came I would no longer be a part of this world. Because I am selfish, I do not want that. I want to continue on forever, in the company of all the people I care about and troubled by none of the people or situations that have caused me dismay. So religion was a good fit for those selfish desires. As I have matured into adulthood, I now know that the Abrahamic God is an absurd construct, a cheap attempt at social control, an attempt at explaining why there is weather and disease and lights in the sky. Even a quick perusal of the Wiki articles on the Nicene Creed or the writing of the King James Bible will show that there was not even a hint of divinity around these events but rather partisan politics that would be right at home in the US House of Representatives right now. The stories of Christianity don’t make sense, the God that is supposed to be perfect is rather forward with His flaws and the Bible as an instruction manual for life sure includes a lot of this-begat-that fluff that helps no one. Nonetheless. I have dusted off what little remains of my own personal “faith” and I have said a sincere prayer, aimed in the direction of God as Christians understand Him. My prayer was short and simple, along these lines: Dear God, Please stop the gun violence in the United States by whatever means is necessary. In the name of Jesus, the Holy Spirit and anything else that is important to you, amen. So there you go. A Canadian agnostic has submitted a sincere prayer to an indifferent God. But perhaps this God has His own version of Facebook and he will not even consider the request until sufficient prayers have been submitted. He’s got mine now so I am assuming the gun violence in the US will be stopping forwith. Yep, any day now… just waiting on those last few prayers. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2018, 8:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-middle-finger-to-the-people-who-took-advantage-to-politicize-the-school-shooting/809107/295 "2018-02-22T08:50:22Z")
> [@Luciano700](#): > > If the US government lapses into treasonous tyranny The US government _is_ lapsing into treasonous tyranny, you clod, and there are tens of millions of Americans celebrating the downfall of the Republic by strolling around with their MAGA hats and blathering about how happy they are that “libs” are “triggered” by it. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2018, 11:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-middle-finger-to-the-people-who-took-advantage-to-politicize-the-school-shooting/809107/296 "2018-02-22T11:16:09Z")
What happens if the US lapses into tyrannous treasony? ---
**Author:** ![Luciano700](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Luciano700](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Luciano700)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2018, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-middle-finger-to-the-people-who-took-advantage-to-politicize-the-school-shooting/809107/297 "2018-02-22T13:59:45Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > The US government _is_ lapsing into treasonous tyranny, you clod, and there are tens of millions of Americans celebrating the downfall of the Republic by strolling around with their MAGA hats and blathering about how happy they are that “libs” are “triggered” by it. Are you literally acting as if the other side doesn’t do the same thing? ---
**Author:** ![Luciano700](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Luciano700](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Luciano700)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2018, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-middle-finger-to-the-people-who-took-advantage-to-politicize-the-school-shooting/809107/298 "2018-02-22T14:02:30Z")
> [@DWMarch](#): > > Alright, despite my suspicions about the OP, I’ll respond sincerly. > > Back when I was a teenager I wanted to believe in God. The reason for this was because I knew that I was a thing that had an end date on it and when that date came I would no longer be a part of this world. Because I am selfish, I do not want that. I want to continue on forever, in the company of all the people I care about and troubled by none of the people or situations that have caused me dismay. So religion was a good fit for those selfish desires. > > As I have matured into adulthood, I now know that the Abrahamic God is an absurd construct, a cheap attempt at social control, an attempt at explaining why there is weather and disease and lights in the sky. Even a quick perusal of the Wiki articles on the Nicene Creed or the writing of the King James Bible will show that there was not even a hint of divinity around these events but rather partisan politics that would be right at home in the US House of Representatives right now. The stories of Christianity don’t make sense, the God that is supposed to be perfect is rather forward with His flaws and the Bible as an instruction manual for life sure includes a lot of this-begat-that fluff that helps no one. > > Nonetheless. I have dusted off what little remains of my own personal “faith” and I have said a sincere prayer, aimed in the direction of God as Christians understand Him. My prayer was short and simple, along these lines: > > Dear God, > Please stop the gun violence in the United States by whatever means is necessary. In the name of Jesus, the Holy Spirit and anything else that is important to you, amen. > > So there you go. A Canadian agnostic has submitted a sincere prayer to an indifferent God. But perhaps this God has His own version of Facebook and he will not even consider the request until sufficient prayers have been submitted. He’s got mine now so I am assuming the gun violence in the US will be stopping forwith. Yep, any day now… just waiting on those last few prayers. You have to understand if the discussions were MORE serious and civil, then I could take it more serious. And the who hell cares which party commits more shootings. Right because affiliation is so important and not the shooter him or herself. ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2018, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-middle-finger-to-the-people-who-took-advantage-to-politicize-the-school-shooting/809107/299 "2018-02-22T14:22:32Z")
> [@Luciano700](#): > > Are you literally acting as if the other side doesn’t do the same thing? Yes. Because they don’t, at least not anyone with any influence. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2018, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-middle-finger-to-the-people-who-took-advantage-to-politicize-the-school-shooting/809107/300 "2018-02-22T14:37:23Z")
> [@Luciano700](#): > > Are you literally acting as if the other side doesn’t do the same thing? With every post you give further lie to your claims of thoughtfulness. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-middle-finger-to-the-people-who-took-advantage-to-politicize-the-school-shooting/809107.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-middle-finger-to-the-people-who-took-advantage-to-politicize-the-school-shooting/809107.md?page=16)