# A big 'ol "Fuck YOU!" to the PETA jackass at the circus **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 25, 2009, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-ol-fuck-you-to-the-peta-jackass-at-the-circus/482945 "2009-01-25T19:54:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![CannyDan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cannydan/32/548_2.png) [@CannyDan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CannyDan)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-ol-fuck-you-to-the-peta-jackass-at-the-circus/482945/241 "2009-01-28T15:18:29Z")
> [@Hostile\_Dialect](#): > > What are those sharp weapons on the bottom of jockeys’ boots for, if not to stab the animals? What are the whips for, if not to beat the animals into doing what the jockey/racer/whatever wants them to do? This is complete and utter nonsense. And it undermines whatever credibility your other statements might have had. Surely there is a continuum from “no interference with the animal” all the way to “constant and damaging physical abuse”. PETA purports to advocate the former. No one defends the later. There is a large but excluded middle. Does abuse occur? Surely it does; there are nasty people in the world. Is it common practice in circuses, dog training, and/or horseback riding (just to use examples already noted)? Hardly. Why? Because it is counter productive. Animals cannot be punished into performing behaviors. Punishment only produces avoidance reactions. Abusive treatment cannot produce a performing animal, whether that be a circus elephant, a field trial retriever or an Olympic dressage competitor. Regardless of the propensities of the human perpetrator, abuse simply does not work as a training technique. Might someone simply get mad and beat their horse, their dog, or even their elephant? Assuredly yes. Would such a person last long as a dog trainer, a horseback rider, or a mahout? Hardly. Animals remember frightening and painful experiences very well. Anticipating additional unpleasantness, they become shy, furtive, uncooperative, even dangerous. Not that systematic abusive treatment of dogs (e.g., Vick) has exactly this result. The dogs are not “trained”. Rather they are simply deranged and pathetic passive - aggressive creatures that can only “perform” one job-- psychotic fighting. It is hardly reasonable to identify an extreme instance, something from the fringe of the bell curve, and use it to paint all and sundry. Still, this is a common and often effective political tool. One that PETA frequently uses, to its advantage. ---
**Author:** ![CannyDan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cannydan/32/548_2.png) [@CannyDan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CannyDan)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-ol-fuck-you-to-the-peta-jackass-at-the-circus/482945/242 "2009-01-28T15:28:10Z")
Damn! Missed the edit window! “Not that systematic abusive…” should read “Note that…” ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-ol-fuck-you-to-the-peta-jackass-at-the-circus/482945/243 "2009-01-28T15:50:25Z")
> [@Jettboy](#): > > And, since an ass-stomping would have been wholly inappropriate, I’d have had the police remove you. For talking to your child? You’ve got to be kidding! Bwahahahahha!!! ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-ol-fuck-you-to-the-peta-jackass-at-the-circus/482945/244 "2009-01-28T16:00:07Z")
> [@Jettboy](#): > > When it’s directed at a _FIVE-YEAR-OLD CHILD_? Fuck yes, that’s harassment. No it’s not. You’re overreacting. ---
**Author:** ![Hostile\_Dialect](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e495f1/32.png) [@Hostile\_Dialect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hostile_Dialect)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-ol-fuck-you-to-the-peta-jackass-at-the-circus/482945/245 "2009-01-28T22:47:43Z")
> [@E-Sabbath](#): > > Dresden had _nothing_ to do with ending _any_ war. I would argue that the taking/destroying of any enemy city has a lot to do with ending the war in question, in the long run. > [@CannyDan](#): > > Does abuse occur? Surely it does; there are nasty people in the world. Is it common practice in circuses, dog training, and/or horseback riding (just to use examples already noted)? Hardly. Why? Because it is counter productive. Animals cannot be punished into performing behaviors. Punishment only produces avoidance reactions. I’m not sure I understand what the spurs and whips are for, then. Hostile Dialect, Hostile Dialect, Narcissist ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-ol-fuck-you-to-the-peta-jackass-at-the-circus/482945/246 "2009-01-28T22:51:59Z")
> [@Hostile\_Dialect](#): > > I’m not sure I understand what the spurs and whips are for, then. Let’s keep this on-topic and not discuss my sex life. Please. ---
**Author:** ![Hostile\_Dialect](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e495f1/32.png) [@Hostile\_Dialect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hostile_Dialect)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-ol-fuck-you-to-the-peta-jackass-at-the-circus/482945/247 "2009-01-28T23:00:26Z")
i LOLd. Hostile Dialect, Hostile Dialect, Narcissist ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2009, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-ol-fuck-you-to-the-peta-jackass-at-the-circus/482945/248 "2009-01-28T23:44:45Z")
> [@Hostile\_Dialect](#): > > I’m not sure I understand what the spurs and whips are for, then. > > Hostile Dialect, > Hostile Dialect, Narcissist I don’t really have a dog, or horse, in this fight, but I know that horses are much more thick skinned than humans. Things like whips or spurs that would be terrible painful for us don’t really register for them. Though you can hit a horse hard enough to be abusive, obviously, I don’t think most jockeys are doing that. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2009, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-ol-fuck-you-to-the-peta-jackass-at-the-circus/482945/249 "2009-01-29T01:21:33Z")
> [@Hostile\_Dialect](#): > > I will assume for the sake of argument that PETA has directly destroyed property–it sounds like something that would go along with what they do–but I’ll wait for the cite before I believe that they’ve directly killed people. Non-loony cite, please, and neutral/reliable would be nice. Since anything I post you consider loony and biased simply because it doesn’t agree with your preconcieved ideas, I won’t bother - find it yourself. > [@](#): > > As for destruction of property, I don’t see that as particularly dehumanizing or atrocious by nature. Ah. OK, we’ll just point them at your house and tell them that you are using rape cages and boiling chickens alive. What do you think your opinion would be after they burned your house down? Don’t you think you might view it as a bit atrocious? > [@](#): > > Endangerment of human life? Sounds like a pretty big problem, and a huge moral failing, but the questions in my mind are: > > - Is this behavior systematic? > - Is it a direct goal of the organization or is it incidental to their direct goals? > - Is this behavior part of a widespread policy or is it the result of PETA failing to weed out its more demented activists? The information is out there. > [@](#): > > Distributing propaganda to children? Most major religions do that, and in the case of Judeo-Christian religions in particular, the propaganda is just as gory while being much more morally suspect, IMO. The Judeo-Christian religions have folks approaching children with pamphlets? > [@](#): > > I try not to waste my time on obviously biased cites, since they’re useless for actually proving anything objectively. I did look at it briefly, and it appeared to be a listing of quotations (without any real reason to believe any of them were accurate) thrown together with the intention of riling up people on one side of the debate or another. You see an evil conspiracy; I see a set of political opinions, some of which (at a brief glance) sound reasonable enough to me, and all of which have their own place in the marketplace of ideas just like all the other political opinions out there. So, you think it is reasonable that a multi-million dollar organization is trying to outlaw the owning of pets and the breeding of pets and livestock? As for obviously biased site, I said that this was only a starting place - every one of those quotes had cites which you could have easily looked up if your mind wasn’t rusted shut. > [@](#): > > You’re putting words in my mouth. I never advocated a ban on animal breeding. I just said that the process seems distasteful to me. But am I going to do anything about it any time soon? No. I like chicken too much. I’m not going to play this game with you any more as I have better things to do than go back and show you where you are twisting things around. > [@](#): > > You can choose to disbelieve me, but I know what I’ve seen. One of these people explained to me in a hotel in Garden Grove (or whatever that town next to Anaheim is) that she got her tiny little whateverthefuck dog certified as a “service animal” because it was her “therapy”, and indicated to me that it was all very frivolous, and just a way for her to take her dog everywhere without catching shit for it. And from this one woman, (in Garden Grove? what happened to “rich”?) you decide that _every_ dog claimed as a service dog (which actually, she didn’t do since there is a huge difference between a service dog and a therapy dog) must be a cheat? And it will crap on the floor? > [@](#): > > I think what you mean to say is that there are laws on the books which support business owners’ rights to be far more restrictive on service animals than babies. In general, I doubt most business owners would see fit to interrogate people who appear to have service animals. I found out when I worked retail back in the day that more businesses allow animals (service or not) than you’d think, though. Borders, for example. No, what I said was that everyone, including businesses, is allowed to restrict pets due to the odd notion that dog in shop must equal crap on the floor. Yet even at PetCo, where dogs are encouraged, there is far less mess than what is created by children in the average grocery store. No matter what businesses actually do in practice, the fact remains that they do have a legal ability to bar a service dog but essentially none to bar unruly children or women who think diapers should be changed on tables at McDonalds. > [@](#): > > My problem is with the way the law can be exploited, not the animals themselves, who I’m sure are the nicest dogs around. They’d pretty much have to be, right? Why do you care if the law is exploited? How does it impact you in any way? > [@](#): > > I feel I’ve used misleading language again. By “constant discipline”, I mean that the animal can never ever eat a soda can or shit on the floor and get away with it. Of course, I wouldn’t argue that people shouldn’t be allowed to train their dogs to have decent manners. Far from it! The only dogs I can stand are very well-trained ones. I just think it’s an interesting thing to ponder from the dog’s perspective. I don’t know enough about dog consciousness to say whether they feel like prisoners, of course. My perception of well-trained dogs is that they seem to be happy with their living situation. This sounds like serious back pedaling. > [@](#): > > I didn’t say that the dogs are supposed to recreate human behaviors, I said that their behaviors are supposed to become _more_ human-like–i.e., eat, drink, and poop in what humans consider the right places, greet humans in ways that humans are comfortable with (i.e., not so much of the butthole sniffing), etc. And you think dogs care? > [@](#): > > What are those sharp weapons on the bottom of jockeys’ boots for, if not to stab the animals? What are the whips for, if not to beat the animals into doing what the jockey/racer/whatever wants them to do? Jockeys don’t wear spurs. The whips are to excite the horse into running faster, to become more competitive. You cannot “beat” a horse into winning a race, particularly not a horse as they tend to be very reactive to anything painful. If the race horses were hurt by the whips they’d freak out, not run, but since horses have thicker skins than humans and are generally whipped on the huge butt muscles, and it’s done during times of high adrenaline, some times the horses don’t even feel it. You just cannot go about giving human feelings and reactions to animals, they aren’t the same. > [@](#): > > I’ve already volunteered several times in this thread that I have serious moral issues with the way PETA does its job; I’m not sure how you can equate that to “swallow[ing] whole everything that PETA tells you” with a straight face. Because you keep quoting them. ---
**Author:** ![Hostile\_Dialect](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e495f1/32.png) [@Hostile\_Dialect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hostile_Dialect)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2009, 9:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-ol-fuck-you-to-the-peta-jackass-at-the-circus/482945/250 "2009-01-29T09:47:17Z")
> [@Freudian Slit](#): > > I don’t really have a dog, or horse, in this fight, but I know that horses are much more thick skinned than humans. Things like whips or spurs that would be terrible painful for us don’t really register for them. So…what’s the point? > [@curlcoat](#): > > Since anything I post you consider loony and biased simply because it doesn’t agree with your preconcieved ideas, I won’t bother - find it yourself. No, I consider your paranoid delusions loony, and I consider your cites biased because, well, _they are_. You should take a critical thinking class sometime and learn how to analyze cites for bias. > [@curlcoat](#): > > Ah. OK, we’ll just point them at your house and tell them that you are using rape cages and boiling chickens alive. What do you think your opinion would be after they burned your house down? Don’t you think you might view it as a bit atrocious? Atrocious arson or absurd example? Such a tough decision. > [@curlcoat](#): > > The Judeo-Christian religions have folks approaching children with pamphlets? Maybe, maybe not, but there’s plenty of indoctrination of children wherever their parents go to church. > [@curlcoat](#): > > So, you think it is reasonable that a multi-million dollar organization is trying to outlaw the owning of pets and the breeding of pets and livestock? As for obviously biased site, I said that this was only a starting place - every one of those quotes had cites which you could have easily looked up if your mind wasn’t rusted shut. Yeah, I’m going to spend hours and hours verifying _your_ claim, because I have just nothing better to do with your life. Whatever, man. > [@curlcoat](#): > > I’m not going to play this game with you any more Fine by me. > [@curlcoat](#): > > And from this one woman, (in Garden Grove? what happened to “rich”?) The _hotel_ was in Garden Grove. > [@curlcoat](#): > > you decide that every dog claimed as a service dog (which actually, she didn’t do since there is a huge difference between a service dog and a therapy dog) must be a cheat? No, you’re putting words in my mouth again. I’ve read up on the phenomenon, but since we’re just telling each other to do our own research, I’ll go ahead and take that option here. > [@curlcoat](#): > > No matter what businesses actually do in practice, the fact remains that they do have a legal ability to bar a service dog but essentially none to bar unruly children or women who think diapers should be changed on tables at McDonalds. Well, I’m not a fan of unruly children or their feces, so I’d support legislation aimed at giving stores more power over them. It’s interesting that only women change diapers in your world, though. > [@curlcoat](#): > > Why do you care if the law is exploited? How does it impact you in any way? It doesn’t and I don’t. Why do you care if circuses are outlawed? > [@curlcoat](#): > > The whips are to excite the horse into running faster, to become more competitive. Ah. That sounds much more pleasant. ---
**Author:** ![CannyDan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cannydan/32/548_2.png) [@CannyDan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CannyDan)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2009, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-ol-fuck-you-to-the-peta-jackass-at-the-circus/482945/251 "2009-01-29T14:44:23Z")
> [@Hostile\_Dialect](#): > > \ I’m not sure I understand what the spurs and whips are for, then. > > Hostile Dialect, > Hostile Dialect, Narcissist Cripes, you really don’t know anything at all about actual live animals, do you? As explained by several of us above, animals cannot be coerced to perform human-desired actions by abuse. Spurs and whips are communication tools, not instruments of torture. Can they be abused? Certainly. Deliberate misuse can, and probably does, sometimes occur. This is the case for virtually every object in the world, but not a justification for banning the proper application of that object. I’ll note that, in the wrong hands, a violin can inflict agony on a captive audience. But this isn’t used to justify banning childrens’ recitals. My wife and her horses “do” dressage. Without belaboring the details, suffice it to say that subtle cues are given by the rider, requesting the horse to perform a variety of actions. Watch this [link](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G41ceMSMQ7Q) to get an idea. (No, that isn’t our horse. Wish it was!) Note that the rider wears spurs and carries a whip. The actions the horse takes are complex, but the cues from the rider are subtle. For example but by no means a comprehensive list, weight in the rider’s “seat” can be left, right, centered, forward, or back. Each may cue the horse to modify his action. Meanwhile the rider’s thigh muscles communicate something to the horse, as do the rider’s calf muscles. The rider’s foot may be at the girth, in front of the girth, or behind the girth. In any of those positions the rider may touch or press the horse with her toe, with her instep, or with her heel. The spur is used to clarify this particular cue, since it can be hard for the horse to differentiate between pressure from the instep or the heel. The whip can be used to tell the horse “I want impulsion from your big butt muscles _now_… and _now_… and _now_…”. A smart response (meaning swift and immediate) is required to keep cadence, so a generalized pressure is not adequate communication. The rider swats the horse with the whip, but would be horrified at the idea of actually causing pain, let alone raising a welt. To call this a “beating” is to re-define the word. Let us not even mention the complex cues communicated by the arms and hands through that big hunk of metal, the bit. (Actually probably two bits, in the double bridle typically used for higher levels of dressage.) Is any of this torture? Can it be construed as cruelty? Well, my word is my cite, but our horses willingly accept the bit, perform happily, then enjoy a bath and brushing before relaxing in their stalls. It is impossible for me to interpret this as cruelty. All of this requires almost endless repetition and practice. The horse must be an active and willing participant, not a coerced and abused conscript. Again, as in any other human endeavor, abuses may be perpetrated by certain individuals. This though is not sufficient reason to re-define “training” as “cruelty”. In this, PETA is simply and demonstratively wrong. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-ol-fuck-you-to-the-peta-jackass-at-the-circus/482945/252 "2009-01-30T00:53:53Z")
> [@Hostile\_Dialect](#): > > No, I consider your paranoid delusions loony, and I consider your cites biased because, well, _they are_. Because _you_ could not be bothered to look past that site. I’m not going to spoon feed you here. > [@](#): > > Atrocious arson or absurd example? Such a tough decision. If you would bother to look into this thing, you would find out that it isn’t absurd. > [@](#): > > Maybe, maybe not, but there’s plenty of indoctrination of children wherever their parents go to church. Ah. Parents taking children to church is the same thing as some scruffy guy foisting gory pamphlets at a circus. Riiiight. > [@](#): > > Yeah, I’m going to spend hours and hours verifying _your_ claim, because I have just nothing better to do with your life. Whatever, man. Obviously you have no desire to spend 10 minutes finding out that you are completely wrong. Not that I blame you, but you could just give up and go away instead of trying to pretend you know what you are talking about. > [@](#): > > The _hotel_ was in Garden Grove. And? You are trying to say you met a real live honest to god rich white woman at a hotel in Garden Grove? Uh huh. > [@](#): > > No, you’re putting words in my mouth again. I’ve read up on the phenomenon, but since we’re just telling each other to do our own research, I’ll go ahead and take that option here. You have read up on masses of rich white women taking dogs into stores that are not service or therapy dogs, and these dogs go on to crap on the floor? > [@](#): > > Well, I’m not a fan of unruly children or their feces, so I’d support legislation aimed at giving stores more power over them. It’s interesting that only women change diapers in your world, though. Orange county is a strange place. However, I didn’t say that only women change diapers - they just seem to be the only ones who cannot be bothered to properly dispose of the thing. > [@](#): > > It doesn’t and I don’t. You don’t care and it doesn’t impact you, but you are going to “read up on it” and then use it as an example why PETA should be allowed to exist. O kay > [@](#): > > Why do you care if circuses are outlawed? Don’t like having their foot in my door. > [@](#): > > Ah. That sounds much more pleasant. You wouldn’t know, would you? ---
**Author:** ![Hostile\_Dialect](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e495f1/32.png) [@Hostile\_Dialect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hostile_Dialect)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 7:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-ol-fuck-you-to-the-peta-jackass-at-the-circus/482945/253 "2009-01-30T07:51:18Z")
Thanks for all the new info, **CannyDan**. It was an interesting read. > [@curlcoat](#): > > You don’t care and it doesn’t impact you, but you are going to “read up on it” and then use it as an example why PETA should be allowed to exist. Hang on a second. I wasn’t going to play your game anymore, but this part fascinates me. Are you really advocating that PETA should be outlawed? Feet in doors, indeed. > [@curlcoat](#): > > You wouldn’t know, would you? I must admit that I’ve never been spurred or whipped. Hostile Dialect, Hostile Dialect, Narcissist ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 7:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-ol-fuck-you-to-the-peta-jackass-at-the-circus/482945/254 "2009-01-30T07:58:48Z")
> [@Hostile\_Dialect](#): > > Hang on a second. I wasn’t going to play your game anymore, but this part fascinates me. Are you really advocating that PETA should be outlawed? Feet in doors, indeed. Uh huh > [@](#): > > I must admit that I’ve never been spurred or whipped. Neither have you ever been a horse. ---
**Author:** ![Hostile\_Dialect](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e495f1/32.png) [@Hostile\_Dialect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hostile_Dialect)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 8:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-ol-fuck-you-to-the-peta-jackass-at-the-circus/482945/255 "2009-01-30T08:01:47Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Uh huh OK, I’ll bite. Which political organizations should be outlawed, Kommissar, and why? > [@curlcoat](#): > > Neither have you ever been a horse. That’s also true. Hostile Dialect, Hostile Dialect, Narcissist ---
**Author:** ![CannyDan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cannydan/32/548_2.png) [@CannyDan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CannyDan)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-ol-fuck-you-to-the-peta-jackass-at-the-circus/482945/256 "2009-01-30T14:01:14Z")
> [@Hostile\_Dialect](#): > > Thanks for all the new info, **CannyDan**. It was an interesting read. \ Ignorance fought? Or just something to read and reject? ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [January 30, 2009, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-ol-fuck-you-to-the-peta-jackass-at-the-circus/482945/257 "2009-01-30T18:55:35Z")
> [@Hostile\_Dialect](#): > > OK, I’ll bite. Which political organizations should be outlawed, Kommissar, and why? You can bite whatever you want, I don’t have time for your wild jumps to erroneous conclusions anymore. ---
**Author:** ![Hostile\_Dialect](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e495f1/32.png) [@Hostile\_Dialect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hostile_Dialect)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2009, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-ol-fuck-you-to-the-peta-jackass-at-the-circus/482945/258 "2009-01-31T05:58:30Z")
> [@CannyDan](#): > > Ignorance fought? Or just something to read and reject? Why should I feed your ego again when you’re being such a dick about it? Do you act this way whenever anyone says something nice to you? > [@curlcoat](#): > > You can bite whatever you want, I don’t have time for your wild jumps to erroneous conclusions anymore. Er…what? What exactly does “why PETA should be **allowed** to **exist** ” mean to you? ---
**Author:** ![CannyDan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cannydan/32/548_2.png) [@CannyDan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CannyDan)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2009, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-ol-fuck-you-to-the-peta-jackass-at-the-circus/482945/259 "2009-01-31T18:53:35Z")
> [@Hostile\_Dialect](#): > > Why should I feed your ego again when you’re being such a dick about it? Do you act this way whenever anyone says something nice to you?.. I thought it was a perfectly valid question, and am surprised at the venom of your response. Your thanks for the “new info” are accepted. I was inquiring whether or not you had thereby gained any new insights into the issues, or continued to labor under your old preconceptions. So bite my head off. (No puns intended.) ---
**Author:** ![DellieM](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/cdc98d/32.png) [@DellieM](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DellieM)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2009, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-ol-fuck-you-to-the-peta-jackass-at-the-circus/482945/260 "2009-01-31T23:41:00Z")
As an aside to the whole circus argument - my husband and I have returned from the Gold Coast where we visited Sea World and saw _shock horror_ trained dolphins and sea lions perform for the entertainment of the audience. Now with all the touchy feely about how downtrodden and beaten into submission our intelligent species animal friends are - does what I witness also fall into the category of elephants in the circus? And if someone ever had spoken to my son at 5 years with their beliefs about a circus I had shelled out money to take him to, whether it be about the elephants, the monkeys or poodles, he/she would’ve copped a mouthful too. Let kids be kids - they work out their own belief system without it being pushed on them by dickheads like PETA (who are now infiltrating our primary schools to teach them that having pets is immoral and that fish and eggs and milk is not only bad for you, but also immoral). Won’t somebody please think of the EGGS??? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-ol-fuck-you-to-the-peta-jackass-at-the-circus/482945.md?page=12) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-big-ol-fuck-you-to-the-peta-jackass-at-the-circus/482945.md?page=14)