# A close family member plans to engage in actual voter fraud... **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 25, 2008, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-close-family-member-plans-to-engage-in-actual-voter-fraud/469471 "2008-10-25T03:26:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![atomicbadgerrace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8e7dd6/32.png) [@atomicbadgerrace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/atomicbadgerrace)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2008, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-close-family-member-plans-to-engage-in-actual-voter-fraud/469471/21 "2008-10-25T13:47:03Z")
I can’t see the Great Debate here. Tell him you disapprove and that you will turn him in if he doesn’t take care of it himself. If he scoffs, turn him in. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2008, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-close-family-member-plans-to-engage-in-actual-voter-fraud/469471/22 "2008-10-25T13:59:02Z")
> [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > If you had a family member doing this, what would YOU do? I would call the RNC, and ask them to pay me $10,000 for all the details. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2008, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-close-family-member-plans-to-engage-in-actual-voter-fraud/469471/23 "2008-10-25T14:06:43Z")
Remind him that as a lawyer, you’re an officer of the court and all that, and unlike a layman, you can’t just sit idly by if he goes through with this stunt. I have no idea whether that’s true, not being a lawyer myself, but I bet you could make it _sound_ convincing. ---
**Author:** ![hawthorne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@hawthorne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hawthorne)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2008, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-close-family-member-plans-to-engage-in-actual-voter-fraud/469471/24 "2008-10-25T14:10:50Z")
You’re a lawyer, aren’t you **Drain Bead**? Surely you’re ethically bound here. [eta]I hadn’t seen RTF’s post. I dunno about jurisdiction, but here my wife is punctilious about anything that violates her duties [sub]or would get her struck off.[/sub] ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2008, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-close-family-member-plans-to-engage-in-actual-voter-fraud/469471/25 "2008-10-25T14:30:57Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > I assume there other crimes that you could have foreknowledge of that you would respond to … oh a murder for an easy example. As a matter of ethics, where do you draw the line? Personally, I try to weigh things against the harm they are causing to others. While every vote counts, his one vote is not going to swing the election. Voter fraud is very serious, but it’s more serious when it’s an organized thing, not one yahoo. In any case, I don’t think it’s something I’d be willing to send someone I knew to prison for. I don’t think that would really improve the world. Really, I would tell him in stern words that you are on to him and that you absolutely demand that he stop. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2008, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-close-family-member-plans-to-engage-in-actual-voter-fraud/469471/26 "2008-10-25T14:44:03Z")
> [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > But I don’t want to turn him in and get him in trouble, especially since it’ll be damned obvious that I am the one who did it. Ugh. Dude, right is right and wrong is wrong. Make the call and have his ass busted. He’s breaking the law. ---
**Author:** ![Clu-Me-In](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dfb087/32.png) [@Clu-Me-In](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clu-Me-In)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2008, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-close-family-member-plans-to-engage-in-actual-voter-fraud/469471/27 "2008-10-25T14:48:49Z")
> [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > I have a close family member who lives in NYC and has for the past 4 years, but I just found out is using my address to vote here in Ohio, because it has a better chance to make a difference seeing as he’s a Republican. > > If you had a family member doing this, what would YOU do? And party affiliation make a difference? I’m also kinda pissed that he’s voting on all our local issues as well, since he doesn’t even freakin’ live here, and hasn’t lived in my city since 1996. But I don’t want to turn him in and get him in trouble, especially since it’ll be damned obvious that I am the one who did it. Ugh. If you let him do what he plans to do, you are an accessory before the fact and therefore would be a criminal. Now, how dumb would that be?:smack::dubious: ---
**Author:** ![imthjckaz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/imthjckaz/32/3223_2.png) [@imthjckaz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/imthjckaz)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2008, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-close-family-member-plans-to-engage-in-actual-voter-fraud/469471/28 "2008-10-25T14:58:09Z")
I have to agree with **RTFirely** and **hawthorne** here. Libby, as an officer of the court with prior knowledge of a crime to be committed, aren’t you required to report that crime? Try talking to him and explaining that if he goes ahead with this, you have no choice but to report it. You have worked so hard to get where your at in your career, and with your prior knowledge of this fraud, that career could go down the tubes. [sub]_On preview I see that Clu-Me-In went along the same lines as I._[/sub] ---
**Author:** ![Gozu](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gozu/32/6615_2.png) [@Gozu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gozu)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2008, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-close-family-member-plans-to-engage-in-actual-voter-fraud/469471/29 "2008-10-25T15:26:48Z")
> [@even\_sven](#): > > Personally, I try to weigh things against the harm they are causing to others. While every vote counts, his one vote is not going to swing the election. Voter fraud is very serious, but i **t’s more serious when it’s an organized thing, not one yahoo.** In any case, I don’t think it’s something I’d be willing to send someone I knew to prison for. I agree with Sven. I’d like to add that a lot of individuals commit voter fraud. Voters who move to new districts prior to an election will often vote in their old district rather than not vote at all (not reigstered in the new district). Perhaps it is a matter of laziness or convenience but it’s technically fraud and a felony all the same. Sure as heck not something I would rat someone for and risk making them a felon, an enemy and a resentful family member. ---
**Author:** ![CalD](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7feea3/32.png) [@CalD](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalD)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2008, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-close-family-member-plans-to-engage-in-actual-voter-fraud/469471/30 "2008-10-25T15:48:34Z")
> [@Gozu](#): > > Do nothing. You have no good options. I second that. ---
**Author:** ![Brad\_the\_Impaler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8dc957/32.png) [@Brad\_the\_Impaler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brad_the_Impaler)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2008, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-close-family-member-plans-to-engage-in-actual-voter-fraud/469471/31 "2008-10-25T16:11:13Z")
Are you still a practicing attorney? If the relative got caught, could this harm your career? ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2008, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-close-family-member-plans-to-engage-in-actual-voter-fraud/469471/32 "2008-10-25T16:37:30Z")
I’d do nothing. Family loyalty trumps non-violent crimes. I have a brother whom I utterly despise, and I can imagine him doing this, but I’d still do nothing. ---
**Author:** ![Clu-Me-In](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dfb087/32.png) [@Clu-Me-In](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clu-Me-In)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2008, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-close-family-member-plans-to-engage-in-actual-voter-fraud/469471/33 "2008-10-25T17:18:02Z")
**[Accessory (legal term) from Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accessory_before_the_fact)** > [@](#): > > In some jurisdictions, an accessory is distinguished from an accomplice, who normally is present at the crime and participates in some way. An accessory must generally have knowledge that a crime is being, or will be committed. A person with such knowledge may become an accessory by helping or encouraging the criminal in some way, **or simply by failing to report the crime to proper authority.** The assistance to the criminal may be of any type, including emotional or financial assistance as well as physical assistance or concealment. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2008, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-close-family-member-plans-to-engage-in-actual-voter-fraud/469471/34 "2008-10-25T18:30:19Z")
> [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > I have a close family member who lives in NYC and has for the past 4 years, but I just found out is using my address to vote here in Ohio, because it has a better chance to make a difference seeing as he’s a Republican. I’d point him to [votepair.org](http://votepair.org/), he might be the only Republican on it mind you 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![descamisado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e480ec/32.png) [@descamisado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/descamisado)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2008, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-close-family-member-plans-to-engage-in-actual-voter-fraud/469471/35 "2008-10-25T19:16:12Z")
> [@hawthorne](#): > > You’re a lawyer, aren’t you **Drain Bead**? Surely you’re ethically bound here. > > [eta]I hadn’t seen RTF’s post. I dunno about jurisdiction, but here my wife is punctilious about anything that violates her duties [sub]or would get her struck off.[/sub] What if he did this and it’s found out later, including the use of your address? You could probably be found complicit in the fraud. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2008, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-close-family-member-plans-to-engage-in-actual-voter-fraud/469471/36 "2008-10-25T19:40:41Z")
Just tell him you don’t care what he does as long as he does not include you in his fraud. Tell him unequivocally that he is not allowed to use your home for such shenanigans. Absent another option he will likely desist. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2008, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-close-family-member-plans-to-engage-in-actual-voter-fraud/469471/37 "2008-10-25T19:43:55Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > I’d do nothing. Family loyalty trumps non-violent crimes. I have a brother whom I utterly despise, and I can imagine him doing this, but I’d still do nothing. Finally a voice of reason amongst all the, “Go ahead tear your family apart, it’s the prinicple of the thing!”, arguments. ---
**Author:** ![hawksgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ed655f/32.png) [@hawksgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hawksgirl)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2008, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-close-family-member-plans-to-engage-in-actual-voter-fraud/469471/38 "2008-10-25T20:13:14Z")
Sorry, for me ethics trump blood ties. I would tell them that I know and warn them against it first, of course. I doubt it would “tear [my] family apart,” but the possibility of my being implicated shows that they have no respect for me or the results of their actions. In that case, people get what they deserve. And if the rest of my family wants to side with someone with no scruples like that, then at least I have my self-respect. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2008, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-close-family-member-plans-to-engage-in-actual-voter-fraud/469471/39 "2008-10-25T20:56:47Z")
> [@mswas](#): > > Just tell him you don’t care what he does as long as he does not include you in his fraud. Tell him unequivocally that he is not allowed to use your home for such shenanigans. Absent another option he will likely desist. This is the only thing you can say. I’m not even that close to my family but what closeness I have I’d like to keep. If I brought something like this into the public arena, hell yeah I’d be yelled at every time I saw them. I would just talk to the relative privately and tell him to LEAVE ME OUT. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2008, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-close-family-member-plans-to-engage-in-actual-voter-fraud/469471/40 "2008-10-25T22:59:07Z")
> [@](#): > > I’d do nothing. Family loyalty trumps non-violent crimes. I have a brother whom I utterly despise, and I can imagine him doing this, but I’d still do nothing. > [@](#): > > Finally a voice of reason amongst all the, “Go ahead tear your family apart, it’s the prinicple of the thing!”, arguments. This guy is already tearing the family apart. He’s forfeited any familial privilege he might have had. Had he been planning this using some apartment he used to live in, or the like, then conceivably there might be an argument for “family first”. But he’s actually using the OP, a member of his own family, to facilitate this crime. **Drain Bead** doesn’t have the option of simply not getting involved: The loser has already gotten her involved. The question now is just whether she’s going to get _un_involved, and the only way to do that is by turning the loser in. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-close-family-member-plans-to-engage-in-actual-voter-fraud/469471.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-close-family-member-plans-to-engage-in-actual-voter-fraud/469471.md?page=3)