# A&E suspends Phil Robertson over anti-gay remarks **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 19, 2013, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747 "2013-12-19T18:37:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/141 "2013-12-20T16:01:39Z")
> [@Falchion](#): > > That’s the curious thing to me. He doesn’t even make any references to “black folks in general.” Every statement that he makes on the subject (that is reported, at least) claims to be a direct observation: "_I never, with my eyes, saw"_ and “\*I never heard \*”. It strikes me as unusually careful given his apparently rambling elsewhere in the interview. I suppose we can conclude that he’s implying that racism was not a hugely serious problem where he lived, but that’s speculative. (I find the notion that this is either racist or is advocating repealing the civil rights acts to be downright bizarre). Fair point, I took the sentence “Pre-entitlement, pre-welfare, you say: Were they happy? They were godly; they were happy; no one was singing the blues”, which is separated from the story about walking to the fields and hoing cotton by ellipsis, as a broader statement disconnected from his direct observations, but on re-read it’s not that clear. It’s pretty hard to get anything definite out of the statement, between not knowing the question, the ellipsis, and the urge to bring in one’s own biases and observations, such as **JohT** ’s “having been around people like this for much of my life, there’s little doubt in my mind what he was saying”. Robertson could be one of those “people like this”, or he could not be. As you say, it’s speculative. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/142 "2013-12-20T16:04:24Z")
> [@Mr.Natural](#): > > I’ve never seen the show, but I don’t necessarily think that, either, and didn’t say that. Go back and read my first post in this thread. My whole point is about the hypocrisy of it all. Either you don’t understand what hypocrisy is or you don’t understand what civil liberties are. This is your first post: > [@Mr.Natural](#): > > Well, I’m not reading all these comments, and I’ve never watched the goofy program and don’t intend to. What comments I have read, though, it seems that many want civil liberties for most, but this yahoo Robertson fellow, and his fans, shouldn’t be allowed their own. > > Seems hypocritical to me. > > I haven’t called my gay niece or my gay nephew, to get their opinion about it, but knowing them as I do, they probably don’t much give a leap about it all. Who is demanding that Robertson’s civil liberties be curtailed, exactly? Has anyone demanded that the government censor his interview? Bar his show from the airwaves? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Natural](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a9adbd/32.png) [@Mr.Natural](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Natural)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/143 "2013-12-20T16:15:41Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Either you don’t understand what hypocrisy is or you don’t understand what civil liberties are. This is your first post: > > Who is demanding that Robertson’s civil liberties be curtailed, exactly? Has anyone demanded that the government censor his interview? Bar his show from the airwaves? Good lord. Some of you people just like to read your own posts, nevermind if you actually have a valid point. I’ve already posted this, but if you have a problem with the definition of “civil liberty” then tell it to Merriam Webster… civil liberty noun (Concise Encyclopedia) “Freedom from arbitrary interference in one’s pursuits by individuals or by government.” That aside- it isn’t just about one man’s (Robertson) opinion or even one man’s liberty to have that opinion and to live that sort of lifestyle. To think that it’s only about this one man and a cable tv network is, well, it’s thick headed. I don’t agree with all this guy says, either, but he does make a few valid points that are relevant to this discussion… [http://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2013/12/19/duck-dynasty-bible-religion-palin-robertson-column/4124181/](http://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2013/12/19/duck-dynasty-bible-religion-palin-robertson-column/4124181/) ---
**Author:** ![Falchion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a88e57/32.png) [@Falchion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Falchion)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/144 "2013-12-20T16:21:03Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Who is demanding that Robertson’s civil liberties be curtailed, exactly? Has anyone demanded that the government censor his interview? Bar his show from the airwaves? There are people who would think that having your employment status affected by your religion (or religious views) would implicate your civil liberties. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/145 "2013-12-20T16:25:49Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Either you don’t understand what hypocrisy is or you don’t understand what civil liberties are. This is your first post: > > Who is demanding that Robertson’s civil liberties be curtailed, exactly? Has anyone demanded that the government censor his interview? Bar his show from the airwaves? A Muslim woman is told she can’t wear a hijab while waiting on customers at the upscale clothing boutique which employs her. They suspend her for refusing to follow this directive. What is your position on this hypothetical issue? ---
**Author:** ![Karrius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/71c47a/32.png) [@Karrius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Karrius)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/146 "2013-12-20T16:28:28Z")
> [@Mr.Natural](#): > > Good lord. Some of you people just like to read your own posts, nevermind if you actually have a valid point. > > I’ve already posted this, but if you have a problem with the definition of “civil liberty” then tell it to Merriam Webster… To be fair, the first time you posted it, you didn’t even include the “by individuals” part, so maybe you should read your own posts a bit more? A little proofreading goes a long way! > [@](#): > > I don’t agree with all this guy says, either, but he does make a few valid points that are relevant to this discussion… Way to dive right onto the persecuted christian bandwagon! Yes, not being able to spread bigoted, hateful viewpoints proves that Christians are hated and that the majority religion of the country isn’t allowed to express their viewpoints. Way to link somebody who immediately goes into the bullshit “natural” argument about homosexuality which is both incredibly dumb (you do all sorts of “unnatural” stuff) and provably untrue. Yes, the article you linked says that Christians are having a non-Christian agenda pushed onto them, ignoring the fact that Christians are trying to keep others from marrying for no other reason than “because I said so”. That’s not pushing your religion on others at all. Let’s not forget when this happened with Chik Fil A, and christians threw a baby fit over the fact that people wanted to boycott a company that donated money to a group that’s partially responsible for getting gay people _killed_. They didn’t call for government action, they just said not to give money to a violent group, and the Christian response was whining about freedom of speech in a perfect show of hypocracy from the “free market” people. Sorry, I’m pretty sure “freedom of speech” doesn’t mean I have to give money to groups that want to kill my best friend - even though that’s what Christians said I had to do. Sorry, Christians, but give it up. You aren’t oppressed, no matter how much you really, really want to be. You are the oppressors. Admit it and fix it, or keep being viewed as the bad guys. Seriously, even though the argument you’re trying to make is “Liberals are mean and nasty”, the argument you’re _really_ making is “It’s justified to assume all Christians are evil”. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/147 "2013-12-20T16:28:43Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > A Muslim woman is told she can’t wear a hijab while waiting on customers at the upscale clothing boutique which employs her. They suspend her for refusing to follow this directive. > > What is your position on this hypothetical issue? The employer should be sentenced to watching every episode of _Duck Dynasty_… with commercials! ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Natural](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a9adbd/32.png) [@Mr.Natural](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Natural)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/148 "2013-12-20T16:31:49Z")
> [@Karrius](#): > > To be fair, the first time you posted it, you didn’t even include the “by individuals” part, so maybe you should read your own posts a bit more? A little proofreading goes a long way! > > . Do I have to spell out, word for word, the point? I can do that if necessary. I did raise two children. Get it, or not. Probably not. ---
**Author:** ![Karrius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/71c47a/32.png) [@Karrius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Karrius)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/149 "2013-12-20T16:34:06Z")
> [@Mr.Natural](#): > > Do I have to spell out, word for word, the point? I can do that if necessary. I did raise two children. Get it, or not. Probably not. If you say “This dictionary definition says I’m right”, and the definition you quote proves you WRONG, you probably do need to spell it out, especially when you try to act all superior to people who respond to the line you actually quoted. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Natural](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a9adbd/32.png) [@Mr.Natural](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Natural)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/150 "2013-12-20T16:37:04Z")
> [@Karrius](#): > > If you say “This dictionary definition says I’m right”, and the definition you quote proves you WRONG, you probably do need to spell it out, especially when you try to act all superior to people who respond to the line you actually quoted. ok then. Just for you. Again… Good lord. Some of you people just like to read your own posts, nevermind if you actually have a valid point. I’ve already posted this, but if you have a problem with the definition of “civil liberty” then tell it to Merriam Webster… civil liberty noun (Concise Encyclopedia) “Freedom from arbitrary interference in one’s pursuits by individuals or by government.” ---
**Author:** ![Karrius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/71c47a/32.png) [@Karrius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Karrius)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/151 "2013-12-20T16:39:59Z")
> [@Mr.Natural](#): > > ok then. Just for you. Again… > > Good lord. Some of you people just like to read your own posts, nevermind if you actually have a valid point. > > I’ve already posted this, but if you have a problem with the definition of “civil liberty” then tell it to Merriam Webster… > > civil liberty > noun (Concise Encyclopedia) > > “Freedom from arbitrary interference in one’s pursuits by individuals or by government.” Again, I’m making fun of the fact that you’re blaming people for “Reading their own posts” too much, when the first time you quoted the dictionary, _this_ is what you quoted: > [@Mr.Natural](#): > > Dostoyevsky, indeed. har har har. > > If you have a problem with it, then take it up with Merriam Webster… > > civil liberty > noun > > : the right of people to do or say things that are not illegal without being stopped or interrupted by the government > > [http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/civil%20liberty](http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/civil%20liberty) Get it? You then tried to tut-tut me about “missing this part” on a part you didn’t even quote. What I’m saying is, maybe you should read your OWN posts, just to make sure you know what you’re saying. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/152 "2013-12-20T16:41:51Z")
> [@Mr.Natural](#): > > Do I have to spell out, word for word, the point? I can do that if necessary. I did raise two children. Get it, or not. Probably not. May I suggest teaching calculus to your cat. You’ll be more successful. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Natural](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a9adbd/32.png) [@Mr.Natural](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Natural)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/153 "2013-12-20T16:44:37Z")
> [@Karrius](#): > > Again, I’m making fun of the fact that you’re blaming people for “Reading their own posts” too much, when the first time you quoted the dictionary, _this_ is what you quoted: > > Get it? You then tried to tut-tut me about “missing this part” on a part you didn’t even quote. What I’m saying is, maybe you should read your OWN posts, just to make sure you know what you’re saying. It’s all on the same page, at the same link, fellow. Most reasonable and intelligent men, though, don’t have to depend on a website to define for them what is simple and clear. But if you must, then read it all, not just part of it… [http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/civil%20liberty](http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/civil%20liberty) ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Natural](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a9adbd/32.png) [@Mr.Natural](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Natural)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/154 "2013-12-20T16:45:57Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > May I suggest teaching calculus to your cat. You’ll be more successful. ehheh. Good point, and I’m starting to get that. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/155 "2013-12-20T16:47:00Z")
> [@Mr.Natural](#): > > Good lord. Some of you people just like to read your own posts, nevermind if you actually have a valid point. > > I’ve already posted this, but if you have a problem with the definition of “civil liberty” then tell it to Merriam Webster… > > civil liberty > noun (Concise Encyclopedia) > > “Freedom from arbitrary interference in one’s pursuits by individuals or by government.” What do you think _arbitrary_ means? Do you think public figures should be free to say whatever they want without consequences? > [@Falchion](#): > > There are people who would think that having your employment status affected by your religion (or religious views) would implicate your civil liberties. Those people should probably address their concerns to situations where someone’s religious views are relevant, then. Robertson didn’t just advocate a Biblical view of sexual relations. He also implied that Jim Crow laws should be brought back and called atheists to Nazis. > [@Bricker](#): > > A Muslim woman is told she can’t wear a hijab while waiting on customers at the upscale clothing boutique which employs her. They suspend her for refusing to follow this directive. > > What is your position on this hypothetical issue? My position is that the law of the jurisdiction prescribes whatever accommodations an employer must make to accommodate its employees’ religious practices. However, I would generally be on the side of the employer in this instance, assuming the requirement is part of a general uniform policy. ---
**Author:** ![Karrius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/71c47a/32.png) [@Karrius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Karrius)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/156 "2013-12-20T16:48:17Z")
> [@Mr.Natural](#): > > It’s all on the same page, at the same link, fellow. Most reasonable and intelligent men, though, don’t have to depend on a website to define for them what is simple and clear. But if you must, then read it all, not just part of it… > > [http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/civil%20liberty](http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/civil%20liberty) You’re the one who quoted part of it. You really need to try to work on your comprehensibility, because it’s not very high. Also, the definition you link includes the word “arbitrary”. The dictionary you keep quoting defines arbitrary as: > [@](#): > > : not planned or chosen for a particular reason Are you now claiming all of this is over no reason at all, they just decided to do it randomly? Because if it’s not arbitrary, that definition you keep quoting doesn’t apply! ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/157 "2013-12-20T16:50:44Z")
> [@Karrius](#): > > Way to link somebody who immediately goes into the bullshit “natural” argument about homosexuality which is both incredibly dumb (you do all sorts of “unnatural” stuff) and provably untrue. Which link was that? The USA Today one? > [@Karrius](#): > > Seriously, even though the argument you’re trying to make is “Liberals are mean and nasty”, the argument you’re _really_ making is “It’s justified to assume all Christians are evil”. Can you supply a thread of logic that gets you from A to B? ---
**Author:** ![Karrius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/71c47a/32.png) [@Karrius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Karrius)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/158 "2013-12-20T16:54:50Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > Which link was that? The USA Today one? Yes, where it was said: > [@](#): > > In an interview with GQ, Robertson plainly repeated simple truths that are fundamental to western civilization — the Bible calls all sexual activity outside of holy matrimony sin and immoral, and it’s natural for a man to be attracted to a woman. You know, the birds and the bees. I am apparently an extremely immoral person. I am apparently a more immoral person than somebody wh > [@](#): > > Can you supply a thread of logic that gets you from A to B? If “don’t say racist and homophobic things” and “don’t lie about facts in order to support your homophobia” is oppressing of your ‘christian religion’, then your religion sucks. If “Faith and family” really means “Dislikes and wants to tear down the family of others, imposing your faith on others”, then I will proudly stand against both. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/159 "2013-12-20T16:57:08Z")
> [@Karrius](#): > > Are you suggesting that I should assume anyone who claims to be Christian is a racist, xenophobic, homophobic jerk? Because if so I’m down for that. I have no doubt you are down with that. And it tickles me that you are so proud of this examplary nugget of logic and tolerance of others that you share it so proudly. Well done. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/160 "2013-12-20T16:58:11Z")
I just have to get this off my chest: Robertson tried to defend his views on homosexual preferences based on “logic”. I hate to break it to you, dude, but if you prefer the vagina because it’s “logical”, you’re bisexual. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747.md?page=9)