# A&E suspends Phil Robertson over anti-gay remarks **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 19, 2013, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747 "2013-12-19T18:37:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/161 "2013-12-20T16:59:59Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > I have no doubt you are down with that. And it tickles me that you are so proud of this examplary nugget of logic and tolerance of others that you share it so proudly. **Mr. Natural** certainly seems to have been implying that all people who talk about “faith” and “family” probably share Robertson’s views. ---
**Author:** ![Karrius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/71c47a/32.png) [@Karrius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Karrius)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/162 "2013-12-20T17:00:07Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > I have no doubt you are down with that. And it tickles me that you are so proud of this examplary nugget of logic and tolerance of others that you share it so proudly. > > Well done. I don’t claim to be tolerant. I don’t view tolerance as a virtue. You are tolerant of racists and bigots - I’m not. I’m not “tolerant” of other races, ethnicity, or orientations. Tolerant implies I am somehow finding them distasteful and choose to ignore it. There is nothing I have to “tolerate” about gay people, or black people. I don’t tolerate my close friends. I accept them, and support them. ---
**Author:** ![Falchion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a88e57/32.png) [@Falchion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Falchion)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/163 "2013-12-20T17:00:26Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Those people should probably address their concerns to situations where someone’s religious views are relevant, then. Robertson didn’t just advocate a Biblical view of sexual relations. He also implied that Jim Crow laws should be brought back and called atheists to Nazis. Well, I don’t see how he implied Jim Crow law should be brought back at all, but that’s besides the point. A&E _specifically_ explained that he was being suspended becuase of his “anti-gay” comments. [The A&E statement](http://www.cnn.com/2013/12/18/showbiz/duck-dynasty-suspension/) said: “His personal views in no way reflect those of A+E Networks, who have always been strong supporters and champions of the LGBT community. The network has placed Phil under hiatus from filming indefinitely.” It certainly sounds like me like he got suspended for expressing a biblical view of sexual relations. Unless the “B” now stands for “black.” I’m not saying they did violate his civil liberties. And I’m not even suggesting that firing a person for his religion ought to be considered a civil liberties issue. I’m just saying that people can quite honestly (and correctly) view such a thing as a civil liberties issue. ---
**Author:** ![Antinor01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecae2f/32.png) [@Antinor01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antinor01)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/164 "2013-12-20T17:01:23Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > Well there’s egg on my face. Apparently Paglia is a gay, atheist feminist. Which does somewhat beg the question of how the hell she was that disgustingly wrong on this issue. I guess she’s not evil, just stupid. I stand by my statement WRT Jindal, though. Paglia has been saying stupid things for years now. I’ve read some of her columns from the mid 90’s and she has…interesting views to say the least. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/165 "2013-12-20T17:05:50Z")
> [@Falchion](#): > > A&E _specifically_ explained that he was being suspended becuase of his “anti-gay” comments. [The A&E statement](http://www.cnn.com/2013/12/18/showbiz/duck-dynasty-suspension/) said: “His personal views in no way reflect those of A+E Networks, who have always been strong supporters and champions of the LGBT community. The network has placed Phil under hiatus from filming indefinitely.” > > It certainly sounds like me like he got suspended for expressing a biblical view of sexual relations. Unless the “B” now stands for “black.” > > I’m not saying they did violate his civil liberties. And I’m not even suggesting that firing a person for his religion ought to be considered a civil liberties issue. I’m just saying that people can quite honestly (and correctly) view such a thing as a civil liberties issue. Okay, I’ll concede that it’s _arguable_. ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/166 "2013-12-20T17:06:14Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > A Muslim woman is told she can’t wear a hijab while waiting on customers at the upscale clothing boutique which employs her. They suspend her for refusing to follow this directive. > > What is your position on this hypothetical issue? If they have a dress code that isn’t religion-specific (i.e. no headcoverings at all, face must be shown at all times, etc) then I don’t really have a problem with it. Assuming that face-to-face contact is a legitimate part of the job (which in high-end sales it would be). A government ban on head coverings is obviously a different matter. In the Duck Dynasty situation A&E is pretty explicitly paying Robertson to be a public figure that the masses want to watch and listen to. They don’t think that his latest (and past) comments fit with that image, so they suspend him. I only think civil liberties come in to it if A&E (or the hypothetical retailer) are making either (a) rules that don’t actually pertain to the job at hand (e.g. if Robertson were just a lighting grip or the hijab wearer were a stocker) or (b) rules that are specifically directed at a particular religious practice but not others (e.g. no crosses on jewelry but stars of David are OK). Being anti-guy is not specific to Christianity, and I would have to assume that if Robertson were Muslim or even athiest and said the same things he would have still been suspended. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/167 "2013-12-20T17:07:41Z")
> [@Karrius](#): > > Yes, where it was said: > > I am apparently an extremely immoral person. I am apparently a more immoral person than somebody wh Do you question the veracity of the statement you quoted? And not sure what you mean by “wh”. > [@Karrius](#): > > If “don’t say racist and homophobic things” and “don’t lie about facts in order to support your homophobia” is oppressing of your ‘christian religion’, then your religion sucks. If “Faith and family” really means “Dislikes and wants to tear down the family of others, imposing your faith on others”, then I will proudly stand against both. Not seeing how this applies to your original statement. ---
**Author:** ![Karrius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/71c47a/32.png) [@Karrius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Karrius)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/168 "2013-12-20T17:14:49Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > Do you question the veracity of the statement you quoted? And not sure what you mean by “wh”. Should have read my own post more. Gaudere’s law strikes again, as I forgot to fully delete a snippy reply. I don’t question the veracity that homosexuality is “natural” - I know it is false. There’s no questioning involved in it. I don’t think these are “simple truths” that it’s immoral to have sex outside of marriage, or that it’s somehow fundamental to western civilization to not be gay or have sex outside of marriage. I think that’s pretty damn out there as a statement goes. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Natural](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a9adbd/32.png) [@Mr.Natural](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Natural)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/169 "2013-12-20T17:15:40Z")
Is Duck Dynasty still being aired on A&E? I clicked on their website, and it’s still there. Some folks probably need me to spell out how this, too, is hypocritical, but I’m just going to leave it to them to think for themselves. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/170 "2013-12-20T17:21:05Z")
> [@Antinor01](#): > > Paglia has been saying stupid things for years now. I’ve read some of her columns from the mid 90’s and she has…interesting views to say the least. [How about this article](http://dish.andrewsullivan.com/2013/12/19/ae-cannot-bear-very-much-reality/) by another homosexual. Does his disagreeing with your take on things render his comments “stupid”, too? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/171 "2013-12-20T17:21:36Z")
> [@Jas09](#): > > If they have a dress code that isn’t religion-specific (i.e. no headcoverings at all, face must be shown at all times, etc) then I don’t really have a problem with it. Assuming that face-to-face contact is a legitimate part of the job (which in high-end sales it would be). A government ban on head coverings is obviously a different matter. > > In the Duck Dynasty situation A&E is pretty explicitly paying Robertson to be a public figure that the masses want to watch and listen to. They don’t think that his latest (and past) comments fit with that image, so they suspend him. Sure – and in my ideal world, they have every right to do so. And in my ideal world, the boutique has every right to require no hijab. The problem is that the boutique exists in real life, and doesn’t have that right. ---
**Author:** ![Cyros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a698b9/32.png) [@Cyros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyros)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/172 "2013-12-20T17:29:30Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Sure – and in my ideal world, they have every right to do so. > > And in my ideal world, the boutique has every right to require no hijab. > > The problem is that the boutique exists in real life, and doesn’t have that right. An important difference would be that while it may be a religious requirement to wear a hijab, I am not aware that there is a religious requirement to tell people that you feel homosexuality is a sin. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/173 "2013-12-20T17:36:25Z")
> [@Karrius](#): > > Should have read my own post more. Gaudere’s law strikes again, as I forgot to fully delete a snippy reply. > > I don’t question the veracity that homosexuality is “natural” - I know it is false. There’s no questioning involved in it. I don’t think these are “simple truths” that it’s immoral to have sex outside of marriage, or that it’s somehow fundamental to western civilization to not be gay or have sex outside of marriage. I think that’s pretty damn out there as a statement goes. You’re focusing on just part of the statement. Here is the statement you shared: > [@](#): > > In an interview with GQ, Robertson plainly repeated simple truths that are fundamental to western civilization — the Bible calls all sexual activity outside of holy matrimony sin and immoral, and it’s natural for a man to be attracted to a woman. You know, the birds and the bees. The person who wrote that is Margaret Croft. so you might not agree with her. But hat Roberston said, which she was relating, was what the bible says. That it: “calls all sexual activity outside of holy matrimony sin and immoral, and it’s natural for a man to be attracted to a woman. You know, the birds and the bees.” So while you may no doubt disagree with the bible, and with Croft, and not like the views of Robertson, what he said in this regard is correct and hardly news. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/174 "2013-12-20T17:38:05Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > The problem is that the boutique exists in real life, and doesn’t have that right. Are you implying that A&E doesn’t either? Do you think A&E would be within its rights to terminate the contract of an actress who refused to remove a burka for a role? ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/175 "2013-12-20T17:39:19Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > [How about this article](http://dish.andrewsullivan.com/2013/12/19/ae-cannot-bear-very-much-reality/) by another homosexual. Does his disagreeing with your take on things render his comments “stupid”, too? No, because his disagreement is not based on paranoid delusionist ranting and horrible false equivocation. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/176 "2013-12-20T17:44:15Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > The person who wrote that is Margaret Croft. so you might not agree with her. But hat Roberston said, which she was relating, was what the bible says. That it: “calls all sexual activity outside of holy matrimony sin and immoral, and it’s natural for a man to be attracted to a woman. You know, the birds and the bees.” > > So while you may no doubt disagree with the bible, and with Croft, and not like the views of Robertson, what he said in this regard is correct and hardly news. He specifically distinguished between adultery and homosexuality. > [@](#): > > “Start with homosexual behavior and just morph out from there. Bestiality, sleeping around with this woman and that woman and that woman and those men,” he says. Then he paraphrases Corinthians: “Don’t be deceived. Neither the adulterers, the idolaters, the male prostitutes, the homosexual offenders, the greedy, the drunkards, the slanderers, the swindlers—they won’t inherit the kingdom of God. Don’t deceive yourself. It’s not right.” > > Read More [http://www.gq.com/entertainment/television/201401/duck-dynasty-phil-robertson#ixzz2o2QlqfUe](http://www.gq.com/entertainment/television/201401/duck-dynasty-phil-robertson#ixzz2o2QlqfUe) ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/177 "2013-12-20T17:48:12Z")
[Posted without comment](http://www.complex.com/pop-culture/2013/12/duck-dynasty-phil-robertson-anti-gay-comments-2010-speech?utm_campaign=complexpop+socialflow+12+2013&utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=social): > [@](#): > > In a clip (uncovered by TMZ) from a speech Robertson gave at a 2010 Wild Game Supper event at the Berean Bible Church in Pennyslvania, Robertson not only bashes gay people, but he also wastes no time calling them “heartless,” “faithless” individuals who “invent ways of doing evil.” It’s pretty shocking, really, on top of disgusting and offensive—even after reading Robertson’s comments in GQ. > > A portion of the speech, via Business Insider: > > “…women with women, men with men, they committed indecent acts with one another, and they received in themselves the due penalty for their perversions,” Robertson said in the 2010 speech. “They’re full of murder, envy, strife, hatred. They are insolent, arrogant, God-haters. They are heartless, they are faithless, they are senseless, they are ruthless. They invent ways of doing evil. That’s what you have 235 years, roughly, after your forefathers founded the country.” ---
**Author:** ![Antinor01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecae2f/32.png) [@Antinor01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antinor01)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/178 "2013-12-20T17:57:12Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > [How about this article](http://dish.andrewsullivan.com/2013/12/19/ae-cannot-bear-very-much-reality/) by another homosexual. Does his disagreeing with your take on things render his comments “stupid”, too? My comment about Paglia wasn’t specific to that article, but about her writing career as a whole. She has had a lot of really odd things to say, as I mentioned. From that article, his comments seem perfectly reasonable to me. He wonders why they would suspend someone for saying things that they probably should have expected. That’s perfectly rational. I do like this paragraph from his article; > [@The Dish link](#): > > This is a fascinating glimpse into the fundamentalist mind. You’ll notice that, for the fundamentalist, all sin – when it comes down to it - starts with sex. This sexual obsession, as the Pope has rightly diagnosed it, is a mark of neurotic fundamentalism in Islam and Judaism as well as Christianity. And if all sin is rooted in sex, then the homosexual becomes the most depraved and evil individual in the cosmos. So you get this classic statement about sin: “Start with homosexual behavior and just morph out from there.” ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/179 "2013-12-20T17:59:09Z")
For the record, I tend towards the opinion that the suspension was a bit of an overreaction (or the culmination of a series of events that pissed off A&E.) ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2013, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747/180 "2013-12-20T18:01:34Z")
> [@Mr.Natural](#): > > It’s all on the same page, at the same link, fellow. Most reasonable and intelligent men, though, don’t have to depend on a website to define for them what is simple and clear. But if you must, then read it all, not just part of it… > > [http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/civil%20liberty](http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/civil%20liberty) That link takes me to a definition that says nothing about rights denied by anyone other than the government. Did you actually lie and insert words (“individual”) just to suit your idea of what the definition should say, or is this the wrong link? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-e-suspends-phil-robertson-over-anti-gay-remarks/676747.md?page=10)