# A Fellowship of Hobbits? The venereal crisis in Fantasy/SF
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-fellowship-of-hobbits-the-venereal-crisis-in-fantasy-sf/290303
**Category:** Cafe Society
**Created:** [February 16, 2005, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-fellowship-of-hobbits-the-venereal-crisis-in-fantasy-sf/290303 "2005-02-16T02:39:11Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Terrifel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terrifel)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2005, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-fellowship-of-hobbits-the-venereal-crisis-in-fantasy-sf/290303/1 "2005-02-16T02:39:11Z")
So anyway. I’m at work, trying to do whatever it is I do there that makes them give me more money, and one of my fellow inmates asks me to settle an argument about what the proper term is for a group of rats. The only thing they could think of was “herd,” which didn’t sound right to them (_“Look out! Someone’s spooked the herd while trying to rustle a few head o’ rat! STAMPEDE!”_) , so they decided to get me to arbitrate based on the well-known fact that my skull is crammed with a lifetime of worthless trivia rather than actual knowledge. I was immediately able to offer up “plague” or “swarm” as possibilities, or “pack” as an alternative, depending on whether Dino and Sammy are involved.
But this got me to thinking: it seems as though history has seen fit to saddle most of the more popular animals with a highly specific group name. Some of these are well known (shoal of fish, pride of lions), some are descriptive (business of ferrets, raft of ducks), some historically obscure (dray of squirrels, bale of turtles), and some downright odd (_smack_ of jellyfish?!). These collective nouns are referred to as “terms of venery.” Years ago I read an interesting little book on the topic, _ **An Exaltation of Larks** _, which I highly recommend for the trivially inclined. The author is James Lipton–yes, the _Inside the Actors’ Studio_ guy, although the book predates that phase of his career by many years, and I never made the connection until I looked the book up again online.
Why give every type of animal its own unique collective term, you may ask? Rest assured, our ancestors had very sound practical reasons for doing so, although I have no idea what any of those reasons were. Lipton would probably know. Presumably in days of yore, such terms had enormous survival value: for example, if you were on the night watch, walking the battlements of the castle, and one of the other guards cried out, “Hark! Yonder approaches a bunch of–” and then he suddenly died from the Black Plague or the Spanish Inquisition or something, you would have no idea whether he had been warning against an invasion of tigers or grapes. But if he managed to get the words out, “'Ware! 'Ware! 'Tis a hover of–” before he cacked, you would know that the castle was being attacked by trout.
It occurs to me that, with very few exceptions, mythological and fantastic creatures have not been accorded the same courtesy. The only notable example that I can think of offhand is Anne McCaffrey’s “_Weyr_ of dragons,” and since that seemingly applies only to the dragons of Pern, it couldn’t hurt to have a few other such terms in use (“scourge of–?” “quest of–?”) The rest of the fantasy and science fiction bestiaries are no better off. How does one distinguish a group of trolls from a group of ogres? Is a family of hippogriffs considered a pride, a herd or a flock? What terms of venery would be appropriate for the many and diverse species found in Fantasy/SF? What about:
–a smithy of dwarves?
–a rossum of robots?
–an antiquity of elves?
–an exsanguination of vampires?
–an ululation of Wookies?
–a lunacy of lycanthropes?
–a cathedral of gargoyles?
–a shamble of zombies?
–a prophecy of centaurs?
–a spiegel of doppelgangers?
–a pandering of Ewoks?
–a holocaust of Balrogs?
–a subtlety of Istari?
–a harryhausen of living skeletons?
–a cower of Puppeteers?
–a pod of Body Snatchers?
–a macgonagall of Vogons?
–a seduction of succubi?
–a trident of merfolk?
–a magnitude of giants?
Ideas? Substitutions? Anyone know of other terms of venery for fictional creatures?
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### Author:  [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2005, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-fellowship-of-hobbits-the-venereal-crisis-in-fantasy-sf/290303/2 "2005-02-16T03:14:40Z")
Suggestions: An ugliness of orcs, a horror of hobgoblins, and a foundry (not smithy) of dwarves.
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### Author:  [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2005, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-fellowship-of-hobbits-the-venereal-crisis-in-fantasy-sf/290303/3 "2005-02-16T04:03:24Z")
an abomination of demons
an unobtanium of unicorns
a nubility of nymphs
an orgy of satyrs
a shitstorm of pegasi
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### Author:  [@toadspittle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/toadspittle)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2005, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-fellowship-of-hobbits-the-venereal-crisis-in-fantasy-sf/290303/4 "2005-02-16T04:36:38Z")
I like the proper name ones (Rossum, Harryhausen), but they sound more like SI units than terms of venery (500 Rossums of robots, etc.)
Wookiees: A shag of wookiees
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### Author:  [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2005, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-fellowship-of-hobbits-the-venereal-crisis-in-fantasy-sf/290303/5 "2005-02-16T04:41:06Z")
A quarry of Trolls
A cauldron of Harpies
A swamp of Goblins
A throat of Vampires
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### Author:  [@Terrifel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terrifel)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2005, 4:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-fellowship-of-hobbits-the-venereal-crisis-in-fantasy-sf/290303/6 "2005-02-16T04:49:46Z")
> [@toadspittle](#):
>
> I like the proper name ones (Rossum, Harryhausen), but they sound more like SI units than terms of venery (500 Rossums of robots, etc.)
But surely that would be 5 hectarossums, or .5 kilorossum?
> [@](#):
>
> Wookiees: A shag of wookiees
Yeah, baby…_YEAH!_
I am so ashamed.
A couple others, for your consideration…
–an honor of Klingons
–a scald of firedrakes
–an ogle of cyclopes
…?
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### Author:  [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2005, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-fellowship-of-hobbits-the-venereal-crisis-in-fantasy-sf/290303/7 "2005-02-16T05:00:55Z")
I’m not sure that the question properly applies to humanoids (though I must admit I like “an antiquity of Elves”). After all, is there a term of venery as applied to humans? I’m therefore quite comfortable with a tribe, army, band, or platoon of orcs, trolls, hobgoblins, or Hobbits.
On the ones you list, I believe that “pod” is already the proper term for body-snatchers, and the proper term for a Puppeteer is “herd”. Yes, that’s shared, but then, one can have a herd of cattle, bison, wildebeests, or zebras, as well, and nobody complains about the degeneracy there.
And, of course, some fantastical creatures are rare enough, or even unique, that no venereal term is needed. There are only five Istari, for instance, and the total number of Balrogs is generally supposed not to be much above a dozen.
With that said, let me nominate:
A gustation of spoo (this also applies to schmooen)
A rampage of Grendels
A tribulation of tribbles
An incendiary of salamanders
A drift of tauntauns
A contentment of flatcats
An armada of starseeds
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### Author:  [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2005, 7:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-fellowship-of-hobbits-the-venereal-crisis-in-fantasy-sf/290303/8 "2005-02-16T07:26:25Z")
A [Lloyd](http://thebestofusa.com/thrutheyears/SouthWest/California/hollywood.html) [of Gungans](http://www.insuranceconsultingcompany.com/lloyds.htm). (Yes, I’m horribly ashamed.)
A eureka of Moties.
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### Author:  [@picunurse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/picunurse)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2005, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-fellowship-of-hobbits-the-venereal-crisis-in-fantasy-sf/290303/9 "2005-02-16T13:18:25Z")
I’m confused by the title of this thread. **Terrifel** , do you know the definition of “venereal”? You might want to look it up… I’m just saying…
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### Author:  [@Snickers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snickers)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2005, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-fellowship-of-hobbits-the-venereal-crisis-in-fantasy-sf/290303/10 "2005-02-16T13:26:05Z")
> [@Chronos](#):
>
> A rampage of Grendels
Silly - that should be an _appendage_ or Grendels. Honestly.
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### Author:  [@Snickers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snickers)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2005, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-fellowship-of-hobbits-the-venereal-crisis-in-fantasy-sf/290303/11 "2005-02-16T13:28:55Z")
Or an appendage _of_ Grendels, even.
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### Author:  [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2005, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-fellowship-of-hobbits-the-venereal-crisis-in-fantasy-sf/290303/12 "2005-02-16T13:48:04Z")
A _ **Pack** _ of lycanthropes. Wolves are, after all, _wolves_, were- or otherwise.
A _ **Collective** _ of cyborgs.
All large numbers of Undead, in any mixture of types, are called an _ **Army of Darkness** _, without further differentiation.
Large numbers of Succubi are called an _ **Orgy** _.
Large numbers of Satyrs are more correctly referred to as a _ **Locker Room** _ of Satyrs.
A _ **Xerox** _ of Doppelgangers.
The term for clones depends on whether or not permission to use the DNA of the original was obtained prior to cloning.
With permission–a _ **Dolly** _ of Clones.
Without permission–a _ **Rip-Off** _, or a _ **Pirate** _ of Clones applies.
An _ **Expeditionary Force** _ of Klingons.
Large numbers of Vampires are called an _ **Audit** _, as are large numbers of Tax Collectors, there being no practical need to differentiate between the two.
To the best of my knowledge, no two examples of the Loch Ness Monster have ever been seen together at the same time. However, I propose the term :
A _ **Fujiko** _ of Nessies. [CITE](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=187891&highlight=Fujiko)
😃
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### Author:  [@Uvula\_Donor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uvula_Donor)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2005, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-fellowship-of-hobbits-the-venereal-crisis-in-fantasy-sf/290303/13 "2005-02-16T14:18:10Z")
> [@picunurse](#):
>
> I’m confused by the title of this thread. **Terrifel** , do you know the definition of “venereal”? You might want to look it up… I’m just saying…
Quite so.
The word “venery” means “game animal”. “Terms of venery” isn’t the same as “venereal terms”.
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### Author:  [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2005, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-fellowship-of-hobbits-the-venereal-crisis-in-fantasy-sf/290303/14 "2005-02-16T14:25:10Z")
An Order (or a Vosh) of Vorlons
A Chaos of Shadows
An Annoyance of Ferengi
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### Author:  [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2005, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-fellowship-of-hobbits-the-venereal-crisis-in-fantasy-sf/290303/15 "2005-02-16T14:26:55Z")
> [@kidchameleon](#):
>
> An Annoyance of Ferengi
No-no-no.
A _ **Encorporation** _ of Ferengi.
🙂
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### Author:  [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2005, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-fellowship-of-hobbits-the-venereal-crisis-in-fantasy-sf/290303/16 "2005-02-16T15:43:12Z")
> [@Bosda Di'Chi of Tricor](#):
>
> No-no-no.
>
> A _ **Encorporation** _ of Ferengi.
>
> 🙂
A Scam of Ferengi?
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### Author:  [@Enola\_Straight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enola_Straight)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2005, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-fellowship-of-hobbits-the-venereal-crisis-in-fantasy-sf/290303/17 "2005-02-16T15:54:19Z")
Madelene L’Engle came up with a Drove of Dragons.
A Pern Weyr is merely a cave or set of caves the dragons live.
An ejaculation of dickheads and a proctologue of assholes. :wally
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### Author:  [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2005, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-fellowship-of-hobbits-the-venereal-crisis-in-fantasy-sf/290303/18 "2005-02-16T16:17:28Z")
> [@Enola Straight](#):
>
> An ejaculation of dickheads and a proctologue of assholes. :wally
Sadly, you are off topic, as _those_ monsters are not muthical, nor fictional.
How about a _ **Gallery** _ of Gorgons?
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### Author:  [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2005, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-fellowship-of-hobbits-the-venereal-crisis-in-fantasy-sf/290303/19 "2005-02-16T16:18:32Z")
I meant “mythical”. :smack:
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### Author:  [@OtakuLoki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OtakuLoki)
#### Post date: [February 16, 2005, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-fellowship-of-hobbits-the-venereal-crisis-in-fantasy-sf/290303/20 "2005-02-16T16:25:36Z")
Not precisely _fantasy_ terms, but:
An Embarassment of Sailors
A Riot of Marines
A Vanity of Officers
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