# A few more people who deserve to die in the most painful way possible: **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 25, 2003, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-few-more-people-who-deserve-to-die-in-the-most-painful-way-possible/203794 "2003-09-25T17:47:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Clint\_in\_Wichita](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7993a0/32.png) [@Clint\_in\_Wichita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clint_in_Wichita)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-few-more-people-who-deserve-to-die-in-the-most-painful-way-possible/203794/1 "2003-09-25T17:47:39Z")
[http://www.morningsun.net/stories/092503/reg\_20030925040.shtml](http://www.morningsun.net/stories/092503/reg_20030925040.shtml) OLATHE (AP) - Siblings of a 9-year-old boy who suffocated while wrapped mummy-style in duct tape described for a jury how they, too, were sometimes tied up overnight for stealing food and water. Brian Edgar was already dead when his adoptive father, Neil Edgar, brought him from the family’s rented Overland Park home to University of Kansas Medical Center in Kansas City, Kan., early on Dec. 30, 2002. He had vomited while a sock was stuffed in his mouth, witnesses testified last week. Neil Edgar, 47, and family baby sitter Chasity Boyd, 20, are being tried in Johnson County District Court on one count each of first-degree murder and two counts each of felony child abuse. Edgar’s wife, Christy Edgar, pleaded guilty before testimony began Thursday to first-degree murder and child abuse. Brian’s siblings - a 9-year-old girl and two boys, ages 12 and 16 - initially denied to investigators in December that their adoptive parents had disciplined them physically. In later statements to detectives that were played for jurors Monday, the 12-year-old boy and 9-year-old girl said they were tied up, but both said they did not think there was anything wrong with being disciplined that way. “I learned my lesson,” the 12-year-old said about being punished for stealing water from the faucet. He said it happened to him only once, but his little sister described it as an almost nightly occurrence. Brian “had sticky fingers,” the 12-year-old said, and on Dec. 28 and 29, he got in trouble for taking cookies without permission. Witnesses on Tuesday included Chauntel Williams, a former member of the small Kansas City, Kan., church founded and run by the Edgar adults. Neil Edgar served as pastor of God’s Creation Outreach Ministry, according to Williams and other witnesses, while Christy Edgar was known as the evangelist or the prophet. Williams, a 30-year-old mother of nine, said church members believed that God spoke to Christy Edgar and had at one point gave her a new way to discipline children - tying them up. On the morning of Dec. 30, Williams testified, Boyd and Christy Edgar came to her home with a black plastic trash bag and told her to get rid of it. Williams said she and her husband burned the bag’s contents - a one-piece sleeper, some socks and wadded-up duct tape - in their fireplace. Earlier witnesses have said Brian had been dressed in a one-piece sleeper before he was wrapped in duct tape and that the other Edgar children had helped clean up the tape that was removed from his body before he was taken to the hospital. In exchange for Williams’ cooperation in the case, prosecutors agreed to drop a charge against her of aiding a felony. On Monday, the Edgars’ 16-year-old adoptive son gave the following account of Brian’s final days: Christy Edgar and Boyd wrapped Brian in duct tape from his feet to his shoulders on Dec. 28. Neil Edgar saw what was going on but did not participate, the older brother said. The women also placed a sock in Brian’s mouth because he was gnawing at the tape. They left him to sleep in a basement utility room. The next night, after a day at the Kansas City, Kan., church run by the Edgars, Brian again was in trouble, and again Boyd and Christy Edgar wrapped him in duct tape, the older brother said. They ran out of tape when Brian was wrapped up to just above his waist. Neil and Christy Edgar went to get more, and when they returned the women continued to tape Brian, this time wrapping it completely around his head, leaving only an opening for him to breathe through his nose. “Now try to get out of this one,” the 16-year-old testified one of the women told Brian. The next morning, Brian was not breathing. Neil Edgar took him to a hospital. Christy Edgar, Boyd and the other children gathered up the tape and other items that had been used to restrain Brian and took them to another person’s house to be destroyed, the 16-year-old said. He said his mother was very upset and referred to herself as a murderer. The son said he tried to calm her and told her it was an accident. This almost makes me feel ashamed to be a member of the same species as these low-lifes. May they be put to death as soon as possible. ---
**Author:** ![Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hilarity_n.suze/32/6223_2.png) [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hilarity_N.Suze)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-few-more-people-who-deserve-to-die-in-the-most-painful-way-possible/203794/2 "2003-09-25T17:55:07Z")
Good grief. “Stealing” food and water? ---
**Author:** ![Matchka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/77aa72/32.png) [@Matchka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Matchka)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-few-more-people-who-deserve-to-die-in-the-most-painful-way-possible/203794/3 "2003-09-25T18:05:15Z")
In spite of the savagery of the above, I still am opposed to the death penalty. Not for religious reasons, mind you, but for practical and ethical ones. ETHICAL: “Why do we kill people who kill people to show people that killing people is wrong?” PRACTICAL: too expensive to try the case, incarcerate until lights out, and then to pay the technician to swab for the lethal injection…why do they do that anyway; etc… Now, if we could get a finer handle on what exactly was meant by “Cruel & Unusual,” we could have some room to have fun with this kind of trash. “The Running Man” comes to mind… ---
**Author:** ![cuauhtemoc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ecb155/32.png) [@cuauhtemoc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cuauhtemoc)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-few-more-people-who-deserve-to-die-in-the-most-painful-way-possible/203794/4 "2003-09-25T18:07:42Z")
You posted the whole article. **Coldfire** will be along to yell at you shortly. But seriously, this is an awful story. I don’t know how people could treat children like that. ---
**Author:** ![Ryle\_Dup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Ryle\_Dup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ryle_Dup)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-few-more-people-who-deserve-to-die-in-the-most-painful-way-possible/203794/5 "2003-09-25T18:13:25Z")
When quoting an article, remember you shouldn’t have over 30% of the original article, either just take an exerpt or leave just a link. ---
**Author:** ![kung\_fu\_lola](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/f4b2a3/32.png) [@kung\_fu\_lola](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kung_fu_lola)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-few-more-people-who-deserve-to-die-in-the-most-painful-way-possible/203794/6 "2003-09-25T18:13:30Z")
I’m with **Cicada**. Who cares is a child needs some water from the faucet? Isn’t it free? Or are they just control freaks? :checks story: Oh, yeah, religious fanatics. Control freaks. Uh-huh. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-few-more-people-who-deserve-to-die-in-the-most-painful-way-possible/203794/7 "2003-09-25T18:15:39Z")
> [@](#): > > Witnesses on Tuesday included Chauntel Williams, a former member of the small Kansas City, Kan., church founded and run by the Edgar adults. Neil Edgar served as pastor of God’s Creation Outreach Ministry, according to Williams and other witnesses, while Christy Edgar was known as the evangelist or the prophet. I am **Gobear** ’s lack of surprise. Why is it that one of the hallmarks of the screaming loony fringe of the already unbalanced fundie wing of Christianity is cruelty to children? So often when one reads horrific stories of child abuse one finds that the excuse given for the beatings and eventual death is to “beat the Devil out of the child,” or “to expel evil spirits.” If they have to be barking mad religious fanatics, why can’t they be nice ones? [sub]P.S. The comments above are **NOT** to be construed as a criticism of all Christians or as a generalization about Christianity at large. Anyone who contends otherwise is going to get such a _zetz_ in the _tuchis_![/sub] ---
**Author:** ![fushj00mang](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d26b3c/32.png) [@fushj00mang](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fushj00mang)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-few-more-people-who-deserve-to-die-in-the-most-painful-way-possible/203794/8 "2003-09-25T18:19:50Z")
> [@](#): > > Now, if we could get a finer handle on what exactly was meant by “Cruel & Unusual,” we could have some room to have fun with this kind of trash. “The Running Man” comes to mind… To paraphrase one of my favorite authors, I see nothing wrong with cruel and unusual. It must be cruel enough to cause a deterrant to the individual to refrain from such behavior and to punish such behavior, and it must be unusual enough to stick in everyone elses mind as a supremely unplesant thing. As far as these two individuals go, this is murder. I’d say, if not the death penalty (which I do support in cases of true vileness, such as this one) then at least life imprisonment without the possibilty of parole. ---
**Author:** ![Matchka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/77aa72/32.png) [@Matchka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Matchka)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-few-more-people-who-deserve-to-die-in-the-most-painful-way-possible/203794/9 "2003-09-25T18:29:41Z")
fushj00mang, Not to put too fine a point on it, I agree that the movement of these individuals needs to be restricted, but I don’t want to pay for the to just sit in a cell and get a law degree…or find God or something. I want them to be provided with an opportunity to make amends by either 1) using the box cutter provided to them by The Supreme Council for Homeland Security, Corrections Division to slice their own/each other’s throats or 2) performing the least pleasant, but necessary tasks required by our society. If it displaces someone who is gainfuly employed, they get that time off as paid leave until such time as the prisoners select item 1) above. Just cuz they’re scum don’t mean we still can’t use the functioning body–and who realy cares about their minds at this point? They are NOT human because they lack the behavior necessary to produce viable offspring to the point at which those offspring can do the same. (Thus, they are a subspecies at best). I wonder if we could use their organs for someone…possibly a surviving child abuse victim? See where I’m going? You wouldn’t throw away 150 pounds of ham from your Christmas feast just because it didn’t get eaten, you’d find a good use for the LEFTOVERS! ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Ashtar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ea924/32.png) [@Lord\_Ashtar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Ashtar)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-few-more-people-who-deserve-to-die-in-the-most-painful-way-possible/203794/10 "2003-09-25T18:32:59Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by gobear \* > **I am Gobear’s lack of surprise.** Nice. 😉 I say we tie the parents in the OP’s article up for a few weeks to see how they like it. ---
**Author:** ![SanibelMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e4f/32.png) [@SanibelMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanibelMan)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-few-more-people-who-deserve-to-die-in-the-most-painful-way-possible/203794/11 "2003-09-25T18:44:32Z")
Are these people any relation to the other Johnson County freak? You know, the guy that took in single monthers supposedly to care for them, but then raped them, killed them, buried them in barrels at the bottom of a lake, and then sent their families postcards from overseas saying they’d decided to move out of the country? As I recall, that guy was a religious nut too. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-few-more-people-who-deserve-to-die-in-the-most-painful-way-possible/203794/12 "2003-09-25T18:52:37Z")
Truly sickening. However, for those that believe that all fundie wackos from Olathe are horrible child beaters, please know that my fundie wackos from Olathe aunt and uncle never once hit their kids. In fact, they were more guilty of underdiscipining them. SO there is a tiny ray of hope there. > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Matchka \* > **PRACTICAL: too expensive to try the case, incarcerate until lights out, and then to pay the technician to swab for the lethal injection…why do they do that anyway; etc…** Maybe I can shed some light on that – imagine for a moment that you are convicted for a murder you did not commit. You are strapped down to the table with the needle in your arm. Then at the last minute, you get a full reprieve from the governor. You are sent home as a free person, having the rest of your life to look forward to. A week later, you die of an infection, caused by that dirty needle. What sort of moral and legal questions would that raise? ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-few-more-people-who-deserve-to-die-in-the-most-painful-way-possible/203794/13 "2003-09-25T18:53:59Z")
Anything with a headline like [Dad, 16, may be charged as adult](http://www.belleville.com/mld/newsdemocrat/6853689.htm) can’t be good. > [@](#): > > The father was babysitting while his 18-year-old girlfriend, the child’s mother, was at work. The couple live together. On three previous occasions, the baby either saw a doctor or was taken to the emergency room for questionable injuries, Granite City Police Maj. Rich Miller said. > > “There is no speculation that this was an accident, based on the severity,” Ruebhausen said. “There is evidence the baby had been battered since she was only a week old.” Someone, perhaps _several_ someones, has some 'splainin to do. ---
**Author:** ![GLWasteful](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f05b48/32.png) [@GLWasteful](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GLWasteful)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-few-more-people-who-deserve-to-die-in-the-most-painful-way-possible/203794/14 "2003-09-25T21:45:59Z")
Originally posted by **SanibelMan** : > [@](#): > > \*\*Are these people any relation to the other Johnson County freak? You know, the guy that took in single monthers supposedly to care for them, but then raped them, killed them, buried them in barrels at the bottom of a lake, and then sent their families postcards from overseas saying they’d decided to move out of the country? As I recall, that guy was a religious nut too. \*\* Ah, John Robinson. No, they’re just your average idiots who killed an adopted child. And our Mr. R didn’t (as I recall) sink any of the barrels. Instead he kept them in storage units and at a rural property that, I believe, he owned. And he wasn’t a religious nut. Just a schmuck. -Waste Flick Lives! ---
**Author:** ![bizzwire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/958977/32.png) [@bizzwire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bizzwire)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2003, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-few-more-people-who-deserve-to-die-in-the-most-painful-way-possible/203794/15 "2003-09-25T23:49:31Z")
Don’t we (the Us, that is) still own lots of real estate in the form of swampish, fever-ridden islands in the south pacific? Why not bring back banishment for those people who obviously can’t obey even the most fundamental of human behaviours? Give 'em a couple of packets of Burpee seeds, a hand trowel, a copy of “War and Peace,” and drop them on a flyspeck island inhabited by people with similar backgrounds and interests. A potential paradise in the making if everyone pulls together. Or “Lord of he Flies” revisited if not. It’s their choice. It’s cheap, it’s easy, and, in the case of a wrongful conviction, readily reversable. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2003, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-few-more-people-who-deserve-to-die-in-the-most-painful-way-possible/203794/16 "2003-09-26T03:04:47Z")
Naming your child “Chasity” should also be grounds for punishment. I recommend a day in the stocks. ---
**Author:** ![Zenster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/cdc98d/32.png) [@Zenster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zenster)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2003, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-few-more-people-who-deserve-to-die-in-the-most-painful-way-possible/203794/17 "2003-09-26T03:51:11Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Clint in Wichita \* > … stealing water from the faucet … EOD