# A flaming Florida first responder flag: A Maga Story **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [August 12, 2023, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-flaming-florida-first-responder-flag-a-maga-story/988435 "2023-08-12T01:10:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2023, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-flaming-florida-first-responder-flag-a-maga-story/988435/1 "2023-08-12T01:10:39Z")
So, I have this friend. She is a lovely person: wicked smart, quite successful, and exceedingly kind. But she lives in Hernando County, Florida, a location that is right in the heart of deepest red Maga country. Not just Maga, but _klan_ maga. She’s in a community right near Brooksville, a town named after an antebellum senator most famous for having beat an abolitionist colleague on the floor of congress. Incidentally, he wasn’t from Florida, and to my knowledge had no affiliation with the town. They just saw fit to honor his legacy just the same. It’s sketchy enough that her group, the Democratic Club of Hernando County, have stickers on their cars that just say “HCDC”, because use of the full name would cause vandalism. And her son who just got a job doing sales was told that they have to be careful about sending darker skinned people door to door. In this town, my friend is unfortunately neighbors with a classic maga moron. The guy has an extensive criminal record, and a wife who credits him with healing her by a laying of faithful hands, and seized on every opportunity to terrorize her (what set him off? She was wearing a mask during COVID; incidentally, her husband has a bad immune system). He’s the type who hung some huge obnoxious trump flag in his yard well after donald had been proven a loser. My friend is even more unfortunate to live in a neighborhood with a thriving homeowners association, complete with all of the abuses of power you might imagine arise when pathetic peons perceive some semblance of power. So she’s been dodging fines for having the wrong mulch (why is it wrong when at least 3 other houses have the same choice?), or for not having shrubs with the right pedigree. And meanwhile, maga moron (who forced a recall so he could worm his way into hoa politics) skates by with impunity. My friend has endured two (!) frivolous lawsuits because her son was supposedly driving too fast past the neighbor, had her efforts at a sale thwarted by periodic nuisance noise making, and can’t go out onto her back porch without being stared at. For the last several months, maga has been flying a big ole blue lives matter flag in his front yard. Friend, sick of any cowering at all (and planning a re-listing in 2024) decided she’d respond by getting her own flagpole and putting up a nice rainbow gay rights flag. Cue HOA, which has demanded she remove her improper display. And, for added intrigue, the land of Florida. It seems that neighbor can keep up his big ole blue lives matter flag _regardless_ of the HOA, unlike my friend, because ron desantis signed a law that says that flags that honor first responders can never be forced to be removed. Gay rainbow flags? Not so much. And that leads us here. My friend was told she had to remove her rainbow flag because it’s not a first responder flag. Her emailed reply > [@](#): > > I have researched in an honest effort to honor first responders, as this statute clearly empowers me to do and, as far as I can tell, this flag meets every requirement of that statute. Please tell me if I am mistaken, and if so, how. > > I support my neighbors right to hang his flag, just as I believe in my right to hang my flag. We are both trying to honor first responders; it is simply my choice to be more inclusive in the first responders I choose to honor. We are all trying to make America great again by honoring the many different people that make our country great. > > Before I make any decision about my flag, I will wait for your response as to how I am not in compliance with laws of our state. I want to work together to be in compliance with HOA regulations and superseding state laws. > > Standing proud for the United States of America, > > _Moriarty’s friend_ > > P.S. There is not an official first responder flag. This link may help: > > [What Are The Rules To Honor And Raise The First Responder Flag?](https://awesomejelly.com/what-are-the-rules-to-honor-and-raise-the-first-responder-flag/) > > I’ve attached samples of various first responder flags, showing the colors/service it supports. I’ve also attached my flag where I’ve photoshopped the word of the appropriate first responder colors. > > [Links removed since they show my friend’s name. It turns out, every color honors a particular first responder, from firefighters to police to ems to security guards. A rainbow flag, then, honors _all_ first responders, not just one group. > > Your move HOA. Are you going to challenge the meaning of a rainbow of first responder honorifics] Here’s a more conventional one. My friend’s is just more _pastel_. [![](https://i.ibb.co/Fk1rHBt/D5-CC5499-8-A82-4761-9-C0-D-17-A0-EB84-B117.jpg) ](https://i.ibb.co/Fk1rHBt/D5-CC5499-8-A82-4761-9-C0-D-17-A0-EB84-B117.jpg) And here is the pertinent text of the new law. I don’t see a spot where the specific colors are mandated. It looks to me like Florida ought to be awash in rainbow first responder flags. They can operate like the ok symbol for white supremacists (a dog whistle). > [@](#): > > a) If any covenant, restriction, bylaw, rule, or requirement of an association prohibits a homeowner from displaying flags permitted under this paragraph, the Any homeowner may still display one portable, removable United States flag or official flag of the State of Florida in a respectful manner up to two of the following, and one portable, removable flags official flag, in a respectful manner, not larger than 41/2 feet by 6 feet:, which represents > 1 > CODING: Words stricken are deletions; words underlined are additions. > > Ch. 2023-64 LAWS OF FLORIDA Ch. 2023-64 > > 1. The United States flag. > 2. The official flag of the State of Florida. > 3. A flag that represents the United States Army, Navy, Air Force, > Marine Corps, Space Force, or Coast Guard., or > 4. A POW-MIA flag. > 5. A first responder flag. A first responder flag may incorporate the design of any other flag permitted under this paragraph to form a combined flag. For purposes of this subsection, the term “first responder flag” means a flag that recognizes and honors the service of any of the following: > a. Law enforcement officers as defined in s. 943.10(1). > b. Firefighters as defined in s. 112.191(1). > c. Paramedics or emergency medical technicians as those terms are defined in s. 112.1911(1). > d. Correctional officers as defined in s. 943.10(2). > e. 911 public safety telecommunicators as defined in s. 401.465(1). > f. Advanced practice registered nurses, licensed practical nurses, or registered nurses as those terms are defined in s. 464.003. > g. Persons participating in a statewide urban search and rescue program developed by the Division of Emergency Management under s. 252.35. > h. Federal law enforcement officers as defined in 18 U.S.C. s. 115(c)(1), regardless of any covenants, restrictions, bylaws, rules, or requirements of the association. ---
**Author:** ![DCnDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dcndc/32/2842_2.png) [@DCnDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DCnDC)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2023, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-flaming-florida-first-responder-flag-a-maga-story/988435/2 "2023-08-12T01:23:59Z")
> [@Moriarty](#): > > My friend is even more unfortunate to live in a neighborhood with a thriving homeowners association, complete with all of the abuses of power you might imagine arise when pathetic peons perceive some semblance of power. Yeah, that’s all you need to say. Tiny fiefdoms run by tiny tyrants, those HOAs. I’ve heard shockingly few _good_ stories about them. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2023, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-flaming-florida-first-responder-flag-a-maga-story/988435/3 "2023-08-12T01:30:32Z")
> [@Moriarty](#): > > Brooksville, a town named after an antebellum senator most famous for having beat an abolitionist colleague on the floor of congress. Holy crap. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2023, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-flaming-florida-first-responder-flag-a-maga-story/988435/4 "2023-08-12T01:32:11Z")
If you are lucky, all they will do is steal it or burn it and, if you complain, you will be accused of doing it yourself to get attention. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2023, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-flaming-florida-first-responder-flag-a-maga-story/988435/5 "2023-08-12T01:35:14Z")
Your friend’s flag probably also has the benefit of not being a violation of the US Flag Code, as most of the “First Responder Flags” are. Sheesh, you’d think that the party that’s always humping the flag would know the proper way to respect it. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2023, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-flaming-florida-first-responder-flag-a-maga-story/988435/6 "2023-08-12T01:35:50Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > > [@Moriarty](#): > > > > Brooksville, a town named after an antebellum senator most famous for having beat an abolitionist colleague on the floor of congress. > > Holy crap. The honorable Preston Brooks of South Carolina. (Although I must confess error. Although this happened on the floor of the senate, he was but a representative. The victim was a Senator). > **[U.S. Senate: The Caning of Senator Charles Sumner](https://www.senate.gov/artandhistory/history/minute/The_Caning_of_Senator_Charles_Sumner.htm)** > > 1851: Caning of Senator Charles Sumner -- May 22, 1856 Immortalized here: [![](https://i.ibb.co/0J4cDVD/2861-A760-341-B-43-AA-BCDA-84-FEA46-F972-D.jpg) ](https://i.ibb.co/0J4cDVD/2861-A760-341-B-43-AA-BCDA-84-FEA46-F972-D.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2023, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-flaming-florida-first-responder-flag-a-maga-story/988435/7 "2023-08-12T01:41:09Z")
Yeah, I knew about the incident; I was just shocked that, in this day and age, we have a town name “honoring” him. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2023, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-flaming-florida-first-responder-flag-a-maga-story/988435/8 "2023-08-12T01:44:57Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > I was just shocked that, in this day and age, we have a town name “honoring” him. Well, it was apparently named for him around the time of the incident. (And you can just imagine the freak out now if we even discussed it, let alone suggested it be revised). ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2023, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-flaming-florida-first-responder-flag-a-maga-story/988435/9 "2023-08-12T01:51:09Z")
I would suggest your friend (and kudos for their bravery), if they haven’t already, invest in a reasonably high resolution interior or inaccessible rear digital camera to catch evidence of the inevitable vandalism. I strongly suspect local Law Enforcement will drag their feet on it, then reporting that failure, or, as it common these days, putting it up online for the whole world to view (depending on local legislation) may be worth considering. Of course, that’s all easy for me to say, as it would nearly certainly end up as an escalation, but… your friend is brave, and appears ready to make a stand. Please feel free to pass on my heartfelt respect. Because, TBH, I’d run as soon as I could manage. I have distant, deceased family that didn’t get out of Europe early enough prior to WW2. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2023, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-flaming-florida-first-responder-flag-a-maga-story/988435/10 "2023-08-12T01:55:17Z")
> [@ParallelLines](#): > > I would suggest your friend (and kudos for their bravery), if they haven’t already, invest in a reasonably high resolution interior or inaccessible rear digital camera to catch evidence of the inevitable vandalism. Oh there’s cameras. Plenty of cameras. On both houses - among the indignities that she’s endured has been cameras focused directly on her driveway. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2023, 1:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-flaming-florida-first-responder-flag-a-maga-story/988435/11 "2023-08-12T01:59:28Z")
> [@Moriarty](#): > > My friend is even more unfortunate to live in a neighborhood with a thriving homeowners association, complete with all of the abuses of power you might imagine arise when pathetic peons perceive some semblance of power. I don’t have any sympathy for her. It was her choice to live in a neighborhood with a homeowners association–probably because she wanted to live in a neighborhood with “standards”–and now she is whining because the rules also apply to her. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2023, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-flaming-florida-first-responder-flag-a-maga-story/988435/12 "2023-08-12T02:02:51Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > now she is whining You misspelled _winning_. ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2023, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-flaming-florida-first-responder-flag-a-maga-story/988435/13 "2023-08-12T02:04:14Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > I don’t have any sympathy for her. It was her choice to live in a neighborhood with a homeowners association–probably because she wanted to live in a neighborhood with “standards”–and now she is whining because the rules also apply to her. I find this to be the least generous possible interpretation. Sure, it _can_ happen, I don’t deny it, but if you (speaking from experience) have to move for work, you often don’t have a lot of time to carefully pick and choose all your living arrangements. You often pick the option that gets you the best combination of space, commute, cost, possible schools, and go, hoping that it’ll workout or expect to move again later. Which seems to be what the friend wanted to do, but having issues listing the property if I’m reading properly. Your comment reflects more on your assumptions than the friends actions. Granted I don’t -know- the exact circumstances EITHER, but assuming the worst again is all about you. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2023, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-flaming-florida-first-responder-flag-a-maga-story/988435/14 "2023-08-12T02:05:49Z")
I’d be interested in hearing more about Moriarty’s friend … from you … being as specific as possible. Y’know: before I form an opinion about the OP. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Beckdawrek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beckdawrek/32/3647_2.png) [@Beckdawrek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beckdawrek)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2023, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-flaming-florida-first-responder-flag-a-maga-story/988435/15 "2023-08-12T02:14:21Z")
I’d be moving as soon as I could. She suffered to much to call that home anymore. That’s a real shame. ---
**Author:** ![filmore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7993a0/32.png) [@filmore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/filmore)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2023, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-flaming-florida-first-responder-flag-a-maga-story/988435/16 "2023-08-12T02:20:52Z")
She really should not be playing this game with the HOA. This is real life with real, legal consequences. I’m not sure she understands how it’s going to proceed with the HOA and what consequences she may face. Here’s how it will likely go down. The HOA will have a lawyer write a cease and desist letter, then they’ll take her to court, and she’ll likely lose. Even if the law doesn’t state what exactly a “first responder flag” is, the judge will interpret it to mean what a FRF is reasonably understood to be. A blue lives matter flag is understood to be a FRF flag. A rainbow gay rights flag is not. I’m guessing she’s the first person to make the argument that it’s a FRF flag–and her argument is pretty weak. If she wants to fight this by saying the rainbow flag is a FRF because it has colors, it will likely end up going through many appeals. She may understand she’ll incur legal costs for her fight, but she might not understand she’ll have to pay the HOA costs if she loses. Typically, the HOA is authorized to recover from the homeowner any legal fees incurred when trying to get a homeowner to comply. So not only will she have to pay her own legal fees, but she’ll have to pay the HOAs as well. If she doesn’t, the HOA will put a lien on her house. Furthermore, she should not be playing this game with a MAGA nutter. He probably loves this kind of fight and will relish in ways to escalate it. It’s not like he’s going to see the rainbow flag and then take down all his MAGA stuff. He’ll ramp it up by going into MAGA overdrive with spotlights on the flag and Trump inflatables in the yard. What she should probably do is replace the rainbow flag with that official FRF flag. I’m sure the MAGAs and HOA will think it’s some kind of gay rainbow USA flag because of the colors and tell her to take it down. That request she should fight since she’d probably win. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2023, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-flaming-florida-first-responder-flag-a-maga-story/988435/17 "2023-08-12T02:22:13Z")
> [@ParallelLines](#): > > You often pick the option that gets you the best combination of space, commute, cost, possible schools, and go, hoping that it’ll workout or expect to move again later. > > Which seems to be what the friend wanted to do, but having issues listing the property if I’m reading properly. It’s one of the nicest neighborhoods in the area. It abuts a nature preserve, so there are rules about development, but there are frequent sightings of animals like deer. She loved it. She’s a rules person, and had no qualms about following them. She delighted in maintaining a community facebook page which posted of picture of local animal sightings. Things changed during the 2020 election. Her neighbor moved in and, finding her wearing a mask during the early Covid outbreak (as I noted already, her husband is sickly) asked her “you’re not one of those liberals, are you?” Among the rules was one about political flags. You could post them within a certain amount of time of the election. She had a modest Biden flag. Her neighbor had a big Trump/Pence sign on a flagpole. Which he kept up after donald lost in November. And kept up into January. She _only_ complained when, after January 6, he crossed out Pence’s name. Shortly thereafter, it was a full on assault. Her newly born grand baby died within hours of birth, but she was getting written complaints that her family was driving too fast through the neighborhood. When she tried to explain the family tragedy, the neighbor’s wife said on the community Facebook page she was using the baby’s death as an excuse. That set off her teenage son, who would rev his engine when he drove by the neighbor. _That_ led to the first of two lawsuits for stalking (cue me, and two consecutive dismissals). And so it goes. (That neighborhood Facebook page, for example, is now private. My friend isn’t allowed on it. Some anonymous person named “Justa Citizen” frequently slanders her there). She tried to sell the house once, but the neighbor did what he could to make noise anytime there was a showing. Plus, it wasn’t a good market for a house approaching a million dollars in this part of Florida. So for now it’s just focusing on the newly born grandbaby (the second time was the charm), since her daughter lives in the cottage behind the house, with plans to try moving next year. There hasn’t been much whining. Just frustration. And now a pretty first responder flag. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2023, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-flaming-florida-first-responder-flag-a-maga-story/988435/18 "2023-08-12T02:31:16Z")
> [@filmore](#): > > She really should not be playing this game with the HOA. This is real life with real, legal consequences. You’re no fun. She sent them an email. Their move. We aren’t at litigation stage yet. > [@filmore](#): > > The HOA will have a lawyer write a cease and desist letter And if she wants to take it down, she will. But not before she lets them stew. (And I _know_ their HOA lawyer. His brother is an award winning Broadway playwright who has been acclaimed for a play about gay people. Not everybody here is deranged) > [@filmore](#): > > He’ll ramp it up by going into MAGA overdrive with spotlights on the flag and Trump inflatables in the yard. You mean, unambiguous violations of the HOA rules? Unlike the wooden thing he laughably attributed to sukkot (consistency be damned) ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2023, 5:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-flaming-florida-first-responder-flag-a-maga-story/988435/19 "2023-08-12T05:40:39Z")
@Moriarty Your friend should also mention she’s honoring the Gay first responders. ---
**Author:** ![Beckdawrek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beckdawrek/32/3647_2.png) [@Beckdawrek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beckdawrek)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2023, 5:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-flaming-florida-first-responder-flag-a-maga-story/988435/20 "2023-08-12T05:48:25Z")
Fun is fun. But a lawsuit and costly fines wouldn’t be. Over a flag? Nope. IMHO [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-flaming-florida-first-responder-flag-a-maga-story/988435.md?page=2)