# A four thousand dollar trip to Europe for a fourteen year old? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 25, 2015, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-four-thousand-dollar-trip-to-europe-for-a-fourteen-year-old/715939 "2015-03-25T14:11:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2015, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-four-thousand-dollar-trip-to-europe-for-a-fourteen-year-old/715939/161 "2015-03-26T22:30:37Z")
> [@Dorjan](#): > > If I set up a GoFundMe to finish my degree, can I count on y’all? :rolleyes: It’s a more worthy cause, in actuality. ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2015, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-four-thousand-dollar-trip-to-europe-for-a-fourteen-year-old/715939/162 "2015-03-26T22:34:49Z")
> [@RobDog](#): > > Sure, but how engaging is that for a 14/15 year old? I grant you some 14/15 year olds might find that fascinating, but I think it’s far more likely they’ll be bored shitless. Exactly. It doesn’t sound much more exciting than if her parents were to drag her around with them. I honestly don’t see how this is so enriching. She won’t be studying; she won’t be living/assimilating with a family. The money would be better spent on education or tourism here in the US. ---
**Author:** ![buddy431](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6a8cbe/32.png) [@buddy431](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buddy431)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2015, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-four-thousand-dollar-trip-to-europe-for-a-fourteen-year-old/715939/163 "2015-03-26T22:52:02Z")
> [@Rilchiam](#): > > Okay, I looked at the details of this if-this-is-Tuesday-it-must-be-Belgium tour, and I noticed that one of the fabulous things Emily gets to see is the Arc de Triomphe. Except, you don’t need a tour guide to see the Arc de Triomphe. It’s just sitting there in the middle of downtown Paris. Correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe anyone can walk up to it and go in. Sheesh. It’s like people who come to L.A. and say “I want to see the Hollywood sign!” Well, there it is. Look all you like. And you can go in the Arc de Triomphe. There’s a museum I think in it, plus a good view of the city from the top. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2015, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-four-thousand-dollar-trip-to-europe-for-a-fourteen-year-old/715939/164 "2015-03-26T23:19:36Z")
> [@RobDog](#): > > Sure, but how engaging is that for a 14/15 year old? I grant you some 14/15 year olds might find that fascinating, but I think it’s far more likely they’ll be bored shitless. > > Far better to do something (for the London days for example) like setting them loose in the Science Museum or the Natural History Museum where there’s loads of really great interactive stuff for kids, for FREE. Then there’s heaps of really good guided historical walks, they could have a picnic in St. James’s Park, the London Eye, and on and on and on. > > It’s this lack of imagination in the itinerary that would stop me paying to send my kids on this trip, let alone anyone else’s. Having just spent two days in London with EF Tours, that was pretty much what they did. There was a half day bus tour of drive around the city, get out at Westminster and Buckingham Palace to ohh and ahh, see look, the tower and the tower bridge, there is Big Ben and Piccadilly, etc. Did the London Eye. Then there was a day and a half of "well, if you want to do the optional (and additional) trip to Windsor, we meet here, otherwise, see you at dinner - meet here. Kids buddied off and went. Students who had Moms (it was all Moms on our trip) went off with Mom. Younger students went with chaperones from school. We saw the collections room at the British Library, spent a bunch of time in the British Museum and spent half a day at the Tower. (To me, the most disappointing thing was how much shopping people did with their free time. We did almost no shopping at all). And yes, some kids were bored out of their mind for the whole trip and were obviously there because Parent Unit(s) wanted to force the “opportunity” down their throat. My son hates that type of trip, skipped this one in preference for baseball, for which I wasn’t sorry. Other kids eat it up. Each city was similar - some time seeing something with EF Tours that was included in the cost of the trip (Edinburgh castle, the Book of Kells), the rest of the day on your own or with an optional tour. ---
**Author:** ![lisiate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f05b48/32.png) [@lisiate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lisiate)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2015, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-four-thousand-dollar-trip-to-europe-for-a-fourteen-year-old/715939/165 "2015-03-27T01:00:29Z")
Anyone care to speculate whether psychonaut and Penfeather’s perfectly reasonable inquiries will be answered by the OM (‘Original Moocher’) in the main thread? I don’t think she will either. ---
**Author:** ![Penfeather](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penfeather/32/384_2.png) [@Penfeather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Penfeather)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2015, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-four-thousand-dollar-trip-to-europe-for-a-fourteen-year-old/715939/166 "2015-03-27T01:14:25Z")
> [@Rilchiam](#): > > Except, you don’t need a tour guide to see the Arc de Triomphe. It’s just sitting there in the middle of downtown Paris. Correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe anyone can walk up to it and go in. Oh yeah? You know who else [just walked up to the Arc de Triomphe and went in?](http://www.learnnc.org/lp/media/uploads/2009/10/arc_de_triomphe.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![buddha\_david](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ee7513/32.png) [@buddha\_david](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buddha_david)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2015, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-four-thousand-dollar-trip-to-europe-for-a-fourteen-year-old/715939/167 "2015-03-27T05:05:05Z")
> [@Penfeather](#): > > Oh yeah? You know who else [just walked up to the Arc de Triomphe and went in?](http://www.learnnc.org/lp/media/uploads/2009/10/arc_de_triomphe.jpg) An air-conditioned bunny? ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2015, 11:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-four-thousand-dollar-trip-to-europe-for-a-fourteen-year-old/715939/168 "2015-03-27T11:45:30Z")
> [@Dangerosa](#): > > Having just spent two days in London with EF Tours, that was pretty much what they did. > > There was a half day bus tour of drive around the city, get out at Westminster and Buckingham Palace to ohh and ahh, see look, the tower and the tower bridge, there is Big Ben and Piccadilly, etc. Did the London Eye. Then there was a day and a half of "well, if you want to do the optional (and additional) trip to Windsor, we meet here, otherwise, see you at dinner - meet here. > > Kids buddied off and went. Students who had Moms (it was all Moms on our trip) went off with Mom. Younger students went with chaperones from school. We saw the collections room at the British Library, spent a bunch of time in the British Museum and spent half a day at the Tower. (To me, the most disappointing thing was how much shopping people did with their free time. We did almost no shopping at all). > > And yes, some kids were bored out of their mind for the whole trip and were obviously there because Parent Unit(s) wanted to force the “opportunity” down their throat. My son hates that type of trip, skipped this one in preference for baseball, for which I wasn’t sorry. Other kids eat it up. > > Each city was similar - some time seeing something with EF Tours that was included in the cost of the trip (Edinburgh castle, the Book of Kells), the rest of the day on your own or with an optional tour. I’m sure you looked into this before your trip and decided that having other teenagers there was good for your daughter, and the added security of having other adults around (so that if you were ill one day, she could still go out), plus also not having to plan anything yourself, which can be a total arse, I’d agree that it was money well-spent. You’re paying a lot more - and I mean a HELL of a lot more - to do this in order to have those privileges. If you’d had time to do your research you could have got the same trip for less than half the cost. Paying double is probably worth it for you but hardly something everyone should chip in for. That’s an extra reason why this plea was so weird. It’s a really, really, privileged excursion. It’s not even a plane fare plus some accommodation costs, it’s asking for what the most privileged can get. “My daughter works hard, so she should get the best,” is understandable but not to the point of asking for help from strangers rather than friends. There has been at least one instance of someone posting in a giving thread where they are in genuine need and basically shitting on it due to the Europe!Yay! thread. ---
**Author:** ![Ms\_Boods](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5e9695/32.png) [@Ms\_Boods](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ms_Boods)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2015, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-four-thousand-dollar-trip-to-europe-for-a-fourteen-year-old/715939/169 "2015-03-27T12:54:00Z")
> [@RobDog](#): > > That’s all fine, but I don’t know what valuable experience they’ll get from the London part of the itinerary. > > The Strand, Trafalgar Square, Leicester Square, Convent [sic] Garden, Piccadilly Circus. Really? > > That’s basically a road, three fucking roundabouts and a glorified shopping precinct with an opera house on one side. > > It’s like they planned it using the UK Monopoly board and a cheesy postcard someone sent them. Ditto – as I said above, that’s what baffled me about the London leg of the trip - nothing about museums orcultural experience (which as far as I can see when I go to London, judging from the tourists’ shopping bags, is Primark and M & M World.) ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2015, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-four-thousand-dollar-trip-to-europe-for-a-fourteen-year-old/715939/170 "2015-03-27T13:41:30Z")
Jeez, I missed a big opportunity when we adopted the Firebug several years back! International adoptions ain’t cheap, but for some reason it never occurred to me to ask my fellow Dopers to chip in to help with the costs. Man, I totally blew it! :smack: 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2015, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-four-thousand-dollar-trip-to-europe-for-a-fourteen-year-old/715939/171 "2015-03-27T14:25:18Z")
> [@SciFiSam](#): > > That’s an extra reason why this plea was so weird. It’s a really, really, privileged excursion. It’s not even a plane fare plus some accommodation costs, it’s asking for what the most privileged can get. “My daughter works hard, so she should get the best,” is understandable but not to the point of asking for help from strangers rather than friends. This is why Mistee’s request pissed me off - that and the whole nauseous-making long-winded description of Emily’s adventure … _Emily will get to view a leathermaking demonstration !!!_ I think the most educational thing that could possibly happen here would be for Emily to get to understand that sometimes she can’t get something she really wants, not because she hasn’t been good but because Mommy and Daddy simply can’t afford it. ---
**Author:** ![Cinnamon\_Imp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/58956e/32.png) [@Cinnamon\_Imp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cinnamon_Imp)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2015, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-four-thousand-dollar-trip-to-europe-for-a-fourteen-year-old/715939/172 "2015-03-27T14:37:30Z")
> [@spinky](#): > > It’s possible you might be a little more upset about this than the situation warrants. Bet he’s the one who anonymously donated $20 yesterday. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2015, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-four-thousand-dollar-trip-to-europe-for-a-fourteen-year-old/715939/173 "2015-03-27T14:55:14Z")
> [@Ms\_Boods](#): > > Ditto – as I said above, that’s what baffled me about the London leg of the trip - nothing about museums orcultural experience (which as far as I can see when I go to London, judging from the tourists’ shopping bags, is Primark and M & M World.) Fun story: my only real souvenir from last year’s trip to London was a tweed wallet from Marks and Sparks. Well, that and a gigantic tube of Jaffa Cakes. > [@Cinnamon\_Imp](#): > > Bet he’s the one who anonymously donated $20 yesterday. Bet he wasn’t. In honor of the thread topic, winner of the bet gets to make the other donate $5 to a non-charitable or inappropriate thing that is stumping for donations. Say, the NRA’s arm-a-baby campaign, NAMBLA, ridiculously wealthy televangelists, and so on. If I win you donate to the Super Troopers 2 indiegogo campaign. Deal? ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2015, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-four-thousand-dollar-trip-to-europe-for-a-fourteen-year-old/715939/174 "2015-03-27T14:55:22Z")
> [@SciFiSam](#): > > "My daughter works hard, so she should get the best," is understandable… Maybe it’s because I’m not a parent, but I don’t even understand this. Everyone I know works very hard. Adults work hard, kids work hard. And for the most part, we aren’t rewarded for our efforts. We just get what we get. I worked hard when I was in school. And my parents appreciated this effort, I’m sure. But they didn’t raise me with the expectation that my hard work entitled me to anything. A person should work hard because they enjoy the fruits of their labor. Not because they expect a $4000 scooby snack. Emily’s going to grow up seeing people who don’t work nearly as hard as she does being blessed with expensive material goods and trips. She’ll see the slacker kids she went to school with getting accepted to better universities than hers and becoming executives making six figures while she’s plodding away in a cubicle somewhere. I’d be more willing to donate to a vacation for an adult version of Emily who’s never had anything nice before but works hard anyway. But the kid version of Emily sounds like someone who has well-to-do grandparents who are going to make sure she has a big chunk of change to play around with once she’s old enough to enjoy it. This is not going to be her only chance to get to Europe, not by a long shot. Most middle class people don’t go around saying their little Emily deserves the best. This is the kind of shit rich people say. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2015, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-four-thousand-dollar-trip-to-europe-for-a-fourteen-year-old/715939/175 "2015-03-27T14:57:39Z")
… what sort of middle class people do _you_ hang out with? Every middle class person I know thinks their crotchfruit deserve the best. They just don’t necessarily have very good judgment about what “the best” is. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2015, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-four-thousand-dollar-trip-to-europe-for-a-fourteen-year-old/715939/176 "2015-03-27T14:59:26Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > …But they didn’t raise me with the expectation that my hard work entitled me to anything. … Why did they hate America? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![PunditLisa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/4af34b/32.png) [@PunditLisa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PunditLisa)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2015, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-four-thousand-dollar-trip-to-europe-for-a-fourteen-year-old/715939/177 "2015-03-27T15:27:54Z")
I’m going to Hawaii at the end of November, and we’ll be visiting Pearl Harbor aka USS Arizona Memorial (patriotism), the Iolani Palace (history), the Bishop Museum (education) and the Polynesian Culture Center (culture). Who wants to throw $50 my way so that I can enrich myself? Bad form for allowing the fundraising thread, Dope. ---
**Author:** ![Kimballkid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b5a626/32.png) [@Kimballkid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimballkid)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2015, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-four-thousand-dollar-trip-to-europe-for-a-fourteen-year-old/715939/178 "2015-03-27T15:40:06Z")
I don’t think $50 will get you to Hawaii. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2015, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-four-thousand-dollar-trip-to-europe-for-a-fourteen-year-old/715939/179 "2015-03-27T16:07:30Z")
> [@Kimballkid](#): > > I don’t think $50 will get you to Hawaii. It will, however, get you a six dollar burger at Carl’s Jr. ---
**Author:** ![buddha\_david](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ee7513/32.png) [@buddha\_david](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buddha_david)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2015, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-four-thousand-dollar-trip-to-europe-for-a-fourteen-year-old/715939/180 "2015-03-27T16:15:10Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > This is why Mistee’s request pissed me off - that and the whole nauseous-making long-winded description of Emily’s adventure … _Emily will get to view a leathermaking demonstration !!!_ As I said in the ATMB thread, the only reason this trip exists _at all_ is because the OP’s sick and tired of her precious snowflake’s incessant complaints about how her older brother got to visit Europe, so why caaaan’t she visit Europe toooo? Which is her prerogative, of course – but hell if anyone else should feel obligated to pay for it. I’ve got enough helicopters hovering over my neighborhood, thank you very much. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-four-thousand-dollar-trip-to-europe-for-a-fourteen-year-old/715939.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-four-thousand-dollar-trip-to-europe-for-a-fourteen-year-old/715939.md?page=10)