# A G&S Abomination - HMS Pinafore by the Guthrie Theater **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 20, 2011, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-g-s-abomination-hms-pinafore-by-the-guthrie-theater/600291 "2011-10-20T20:30:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![gaffa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e68b1a/32.png) [@gaffa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gaffa)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-g-s-abomination-hms-pinafore-by-the-guthrie-theater/600291/21 "2011-10-21T16:55:55Z")
> [@Bridget\_Burke](#): > > Kevin Kline was The Pirate King in _Pirates of Penzance_; Linda Ronstadt was the female lead. (She _does_ have a very fine voice.) A few liberties were taken but I like that version a lot… It suffers most from the cheesy synth score, but I figured it was too low budget to hire a real orchestra. > [@](#): > > My first G&S was _The Mikado_–a TV special with Groucho Marx playing The Lord High Executioner. It was cut for time & other liberties were taken but it was a great introduction. In preparation, our music teacher taught us some of the songs. Oh, that sounds FUN! > [@](#): > > It’s sad to lose any of the music but criminal to replace it with something else. Sullivan supplied the lovely tunes & Gilbert the silliness; the combination still works. (Why, yes, I love _Topsy Turvy_!) Why, oh why didn’t they film a complete performance of _The Mikado_? They had an excellent cast, they were in the original theater… What a loss. ---
**Author:** ![Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/le_ministre_de_l_au-dela/32/12181_2.png) [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Le_Ministre_de_l_au-dela)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-g-s-abomination-hms-pinafore-by-the-guthrie-theater/600291/22 "2011-10-21T17:12:39Z")
Seconded - it would have made such a good companion piece to Topsy-Turvy! ---
**Author:** ![robert\_columbia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@robert\_columbia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robert_columbia)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-g-s-abomination-hms-pinafore-by-the-guthrie-theater/600291/23 "2011-10-21T17:27:03Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > If the standard G&S works are considered old hat in need of modernization, maybe the problem is that hardly anyone seems to perform works other than _The Mikado_ and _H.M.S. Pinafore_. How many times must they put on just these two? There are other deserving operas by G&S that I’d like to see, but they are never staged, at least not in my area… What, _NEVER_? ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-g-s-abomination-hms-pinafore-by-the-guthrie-theater/600291/24 "2011-10-21T17:34:25Z")
> [@robert\_columbia](#): > > What, _NEVER_? Well, hardly ever. The groups that I’ve worked with try to do rotations through all of the shows, but the popular ones still get more play. I’m a total Yeoman freak, though. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Lurker\_Above](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/dc4da7/32.png) [@The\_Lurker\_Above](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Lurker_Above)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-g-s-abomination-hms-pinafore-by-the-guthrie-theater/600291/25 "2011-10-21T17:41:55Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > If the standard G&S works are considered old hat in need of modernization, maybe the problem is that hardly anyone seems to perform works other than _The Mikado_ and _H.M.S. Pinafore_. How many times must they put on just these two? There are other deserving operas by G&S that I’d like to see, but they are never staged, at least not in my area. > > _Iolanthe_? _The Yeoman of the Guard_? Totally overlooked. Are you me? Don’t get me wrong, I love _The Mikado_ and _H.M.S. Pinafore_, but I just can’t work up the enthusiasm to go see them in yet another production. I did jump at the chance to see my cousin in _The Gondoliers_ a few years ago even though it was a four hour trip. I would definitely go to any non-Mikado/Pinafore G&S production within a few hours drive, if anyone would actually put one on. As an aside, can anyone recommend a good recording of _The Sorcerer_? It’s pretty much the only G&S work I don’t have at least one version of. ---
**Author:** ![gaffa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e68b1a/32.png) [@gaffa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gaffa)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-g-s-abomination-hms-pinafore-by-the-guthrie-theater/600291/26 "2011-10-21T18:21:55Z")
It really seems to be an east coast thing in the US. Chicago has two groups that produce one show a year. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-g-s-abomination-hms-pinafore-by-the-guthrie-theater/600291/27 "2011-10-21T18:26:26Z")
I have, alas, not availed myself of [Houston’s Gilbert & Sullivan society](http://www.gilbertandsullivan.org/launch/pages/historical-shows.html). Next summer: Iolanthe. ---
**Author:** ![suranyi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@suranyi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/suranyi)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-g-s-abomination-hms-pinafore-by-the-guthrie-theater/600291/28 "2011-10-21T19:02:44Z")
In the Bay Area we have the [Lamplighters](http://www.lamplighters.org/) who typically do two shows a year, mostly G&S. They have done both the famous ones and the more obscure ones. I’ve seen both Iolanthe and Yeoman. Looks like they’re doing Gondoliers in January. ---
**Author:** ![Daylate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9dc877/32.png) [@Daylate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Daylate)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-g-s-abomination-hms-pinafore-by-the-guthrie-theater/600291/29 "2011-10-21T21:55:59Z")
Let me chime in here. Anybody trying to “improve” on a G&S opera is an abomination before the Lord. I saw that Guthrie production, too, and stick it out hoping in vain that it would get better. If anyone saw that who has never before seen G&S, they will come awas with a very poor opinion of their work. Hughly disappointing. ---
**Author:** ![araminty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b5e925/32.png) [@araminty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/araminty)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-g-s-abomination-hms-pinafore-by-the-guthrie-theater/600291/30 "2011-10-21T22:24:41Z")
Yeah, I made **MaxTheVool** turn it off when I heard the atrocious accents. Why are Americans so bad at sounding English? Aussies can do it! ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-g-s-abomination-hms-pinafore-by-the-guthrie-theater/600291/31 "2011-10-21T23:39:24Z")
There was a big stink on Broadway this season about an “improved” version of Gershwin’s _Porgy and Bess_, too. I don’t recall exactly what the changes were, but I think they involved Porgy joining the Roller Disco. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-g-s-abomination-hms-pinafore-by-the-guthrie-theater/600291/32 "2011-10-21T23:42:01Z")
> [@Eve](#): > > There was a big stink on Broadway this season about an “improved” version of Gershwin’s _Porgy and Bess_, too. I don’t recall exactly what the changes were, but I think they involved Porgy joining the Roller Disco. _Porgy Express_? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2011, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-g-s-abomination-hms-pinafore-by-the-guthrie-theater/600291/33 "2011-10-21T23:53:02Z")
_Jammertime, and the Living is Easy_ ? ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2011, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-g-s-abomination-hms-pinafore-by-the-guthrie-theater/600291/34 "2011-10-22T01:20:50Z")
It’s reset from a black tenement in Depression era Charleston to a middle class retirement community in Palm Beach where instead of a beggar on a cart Milton “Poor Guy” Saperstein has a disability check and a mobility scooter and takes in Bess, a pregnant sorority girl who stays behind on spring break. James Earl Jones and Brenda Song are attached. Actually, the recent version and several others have changed some of the musical numbers to spoken (more like a musical than an opera) and toned down the dialect (that/this/I’m for dat/dist/I’se). Mixed reviews. ---
**Author:** ![lawoot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/35a633/32.png) [@lawoot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lawoot)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2011, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-g-s-abomination-hms-pinafore-by-the-guthrie-theater/600291/35 "2011-10-22T02:01:23Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > _Iolanthe_? _The Yeoman of the Guard_? Totally overlooked. My college music department has done both _The Gondoliers_ and _Iolanthe_. As the Scenic Designer for the theater, I designed both shows. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Roderick\_Femm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roderick_femm/32/14875_2.png) [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2011, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-g-s-abomination-hms-pinafore-by-the-guthrie-theater/600291/36 "2011-10-22T04:17:29Z")
> [@suranyi](#): > > In the Bay Area we have the [Lamplighters](http://www.lamplighters.org/) who typically do two shows a year, mostly G&S. They have done both the famous ones and the more obscure ones. I’ve seen both Iolanthe and Yeoman. Looks like they’re doing Gondoliers in January. Yes, we do, and I’m going to have to start supporting them more than I have. Maybe we could find a couple of others and have a Dopers’ night out? Roddy ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2011, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-g-s-abomination-hms-pinafore-by-the-guthrie-theater/600291/37 "2011-10-22T19:34:41Z")
> [@suranyi](#): > > In the Bay Area we have the [Lamplighters](http://www.lamplighters.org/) who typically do two shows a year, mostly G&S. They have done both the famous ones and the more obscure ones. I’ve seen both Iolanthe and Yeoman. Looks like they’re doing Gondoliers in January. Must be nice. Our one G&S performance scheduled for 2012 is _The Mikado_, in conjunction with the [N.Y. Gilbert & Sullivan Players](http://nygasp.org/current_season/on_tour). Let’s see, their upcoming performances at various venues are of: _The Mikado The Pirates of Penzance H.M.S. Pinafore The Pirates of Penzance The Mikado_ I sense a rut. ---
**Author:** ![gaffa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e68b1a/32.png) [@gaffa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gaffa)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2011, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-g-s-abomination-hms-pinafore-by-the-guthrie-theater/600291/38 "2011-10-22T20:46:16Z")
Both of my nieces are sopranos, and either of them could have done a wonderful job in any of those roles, but for some stupid reason the school’s director insisted on wasting their scarce resources on buying the rights to musicals and plays still in copyright. ---
**Author:** ![Hershele\_Ostropoler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e47c2d/32.png) [@Hershele\_Ostropoler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hershele_Ostropoler)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2011, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-g-s-abomination-hms-pinafore-by-the-guthrie-theater/600291/39 "2011-10-22T21:22:58Z")
It was better than any other televised production of G&S on in this market at the time it aired. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2011, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-g-s-abomination-hms-pinafore-by-the-guthrie-theater/600291/40 "2011-10-22T21:38:11Z")
> [@Roderick\_Femm](#): > > The directing was ridiculous I very quickly grew tired of Joe Dowling’s directorial slant. Maybe he was great back in the day but now he just makes me sad. And the additional materials guy is Jeffrey Hatcher. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-g-s-abomination-hms-pinafore-by-the-guthrie-theater/600291.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-g-s-abomination-hms-pinafore-by-the-guthrie-theater/600291.md?page=3)