# A Game of Thrones (HBO series) \[SPOILERS\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 17, 2011, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-game-of-thrones-hbo-series-spoilers/567955 "2011-01-17T16:36:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-game-of-thrones-hbo-series-spoilers/567955/101 "2011-03-19T02:12:19Z")
April 17th. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 8:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-game-of-thrones-hbo-series-spoilers/567955/102 "2011-03-19T08:58:01Z")
> [@Ura-Maru](#): > > At the end of the last book, she kills a guy for no practical reason other than she feels like it. Her justification is he was a deserter, but that was a transparent excuse, even to her. She wanted to lash out and he was available. I disagree completely - she killed him because the Starks are responsible for executing Night Watch deserters, and no matter what the Faceless Men want to make of her, she’s a Stark and will always be a Stark. It was a declaration of who she was and what she was loyal to, and as such, was actually quite stirring. I predict that her teachers will try to beat the Stark out of her, and fail. ---
**Author:** ![Eleanor\_of\_Aquitaine](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a88e4f/32.png) [@Eleanor\_of\_Aquitaine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eleanor_of_Aquitaine)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-game-of-thrones-hbo-series-spoilers/567955/103 "2011-03-19T14:29:14Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > Brienne is a good one. I was initially thinking only Jon. I had a reason to discount Ned, but now I can’t think of it. After finishing the first book, I can’t think of a reason to discount Ned Stark as a solid good guy. He’s all about honor, and it causes him to do some pretty dumb things, like…warn Cersei ahead of time that he’s about to reveal her secret, so that she can have time to flee. :rolleyes: The book held up well on a re-read. It was really interesting to see these characters again in the beginning. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-game-of-thrones-hbo-series-spoilers/567955/104 "2011-03-19T14:34:31Z")
> [@Eleanor\_of\_Aquitaine](#): > > After finishing the first book, I can’t think of a reason to discount Ned Stark as a solid good guy. He’s all about honor, and it causes him to do some pretty dumb things, like… And his eldest son suffers from the exact same flaw, with the exact same results. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-game-of-thrones-hbo-series-spoilers/567955/105 "2011-03-19T16:31:40Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > And his eldest son suffers from the exact same flaw, with the exact same results. There’s a thought that Rob was under the influence of potions. Marrying Jeyne though, was all him. [spoiler]I don’t really think that grovelling before your sworn man and having the Lord of Riverrun marry as a substitute is anywhere near as stupid. Ned thought Cersei was a murderer and told her. Rob just thought that Walder was butthurt. I mean, you didn’t see that coming either, right? Speaking of which, oh man do I want to see the Red Wedding on screen.[/spoiler] ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-game-of-thrones-hbo-series-spoilers/567955/106 "2011-03-19T16:59:19Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > There’s a thought that Rob was under the influence of potions. Marrying Jeyne though, was all him. > > [spoiler]I don’t really think that grovelling before your sworn man and having the Lord of Riverrun marry as a substitute is anywhere near as stupid. Ned thought Cersei was a murderer and told her. Rob just thought that Walder was butthurt. I mean, you didn’t see that coming either, right? > > Speaking of which, oh man do I want to see the Red Wedding on screen.[/spoiler] Robb’s failings didn’t end with Jeyne and the Freys. Remember, he trusted Theon Greyjoy - who does that? - executed Rickard Karstark, and lost Roose Bolton. It’s not just that Ned and Robb were overly honorable; it’s that they assumed everyone else was as honorable as they were. That’s a tragic flaw of Shakesperean proportions. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-game-of-thrones-hbo-series-spoilers/567955/107 "2011-03-19T17:12:21Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Robb’s failings didn’t end with Jeyne and the Freys. Remember, he trusted Theon Greyjoy - who does that? - executed Rickard Karstark, and lost Roose Bolton. It’s not just that Ned and Robb were overly honorable; it’s that they assumed everyone else was as honorable as they were. That’s a tragic flaw of Shakesperean proportions. [spoiler]He was good friends with Theon his entire life. I’m not sure how evil Theon is, it’s more that he’s extremely weak willed and insecure. Theon didn’t plan on betraying Robb initially. Karstark… well, what should he do? He murdered several people. Send him to the wall? Bolton was never Robb’s to lose. Bolton constantly worked for himself and not for Robb. He was killing off northmen the entire war. He was fully gone as soon as the South joined the Lannisters. I don’t see how Robb could have prevented that. I do agree that the Starks are very naive. Hard to see how they stayed the dominant house in the north for so long.[/spoiler] ---
**Author:** ![AuntiePam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@AuntiePam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AuntiePam)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-game-of-thrones-hbo-series-spoilers/567955/108 "2011-03-19T19:45:41Z")
Not a spoiler – do we see the Moon Room in the first book? I can’t remember. I really want to see if it’s anything like I imagined it. Something similar has featured in my nightmares, even before reading the books. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-game-of-thrones-hbo-series-spoilers/567955/109 "2011-03-19T19:53:48Z")
> [@AuntiePam](#): > > Not a spoiler – do we see the Moon Room in the first book? I can’t remember. I really want to see if it’s anything like I imagined it. Something similar has featured in my nightmares, even before reading the books. Moon room? The cells in the Eyrie? If so, yes. We even see them, albeit not from a good angle, in some of the teasers. ---
**Author:** ![AuntiePam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@AuntiePam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AuntiePam)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-game-of-thrones-hbo-series-spoilers/567955/110 "2011-03-19T20:01:29Z")
Oops. I meant the moon door. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-game-of-thrones-hbo-series-spoilers/567955/111 "2011-03-19T20:03:50Z")
That, I don’t think we see. [spoiler]It gets mentioned for sure. Robert Arryn wants to use it with Tyrion, but I don’t think it’s ever opened until Storm of Swords. And yeah, as someone that’s not a huge fan of heights it is terrifying.[/spoiler] ---
**Author:** ![AuntiePam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@AuntiePam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AuntiePam)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2011, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-game-of-thrones-hbo-series-spoilers/567955/112 "2011-03-23T17:14:35Z")
Re-reading the book – just met Littlefinger and I think Aiden Gillen is gonna be perfect in the role. And my gosh but it’s just as good as I remember. I have a question. Why all the speculation among readers about Jon Snow’s mother? Ned names her to Robert early in the book and there’s no indication that he’s lying. ---
**Author:** ![Spectralist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Spectralist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectralist)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2011, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-game-of-thrones-hbo-series-spoilers/567955/113 "2011-03-23T17:32:56Z")
> [@AuntiePam](#): > > I have a question. Why all the speculation among readers about Jon Snow’s mother? Ned names her to Robert early in the book and there’s no indication that he’s lying. And even if he was lying it probably wouldnt matter at all anyway. It’s baffling that it’s obsessed over by the fandom. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2011, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-game-of-thrones-hbo-series-spoilers/567955/114 "2011-03-23T17:47:11Z")
> [@AuntiePam](#): > > Re-reading the book – just met Littlefinger and I think Aiden Gillen is gonna be perfect in the role. And my gosh but it’s just as good as I remember. > > I have a question. Why all the speculation among readers about Jon Snow’s mother? Ned names her to Robert early in the book and there’s no indication that he’s lying. No, he does not. He names the woman Robert is thinking of. Is bet anything the speculation is correct. It’s rock solid. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2011, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-game-of-thrones-hbo-series-spoilers/567955/115 "2011-03-23T17:49:17Z")
> [@Spectralist](#): > > And even if he was lying it probably wouldnt matter at all anyway. It’s baffling that it’s obsessed over by the fandom. If he was lying, Jon OS the heir to the seven kingdoms, it matters. ---
**Author:** ![AuntiePam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@AuntiePam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AuntiePam)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2011, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-game-of-thrones-hbo-series-spoilers/567955/116 "2011-03-23T17:52:32Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > No, he does not. He names the woman Robert is thinking of. Is bet anything the speculation is correct. It’s rock solid. What happened was Robert guessed Becca, and then said “No, she was one of mine.” Then Ned names Wylla. What’s the speculation? ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2011, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-game-of-thrones-hbo-series-spoilers/567955/117 "2011-03-23T17:53:42Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > If he was lying, Jon OS the heir to the seven kingdoms, it matters. Even if he is R and L’s kid, he’s still a bastard. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2011, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-game-of-thrones-hbo-series-spoilers/567955/118 "2011-03-23T18:13:10Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Even if he is R and L’s kid, he’s still a bastard. It’s quite likely that by the end of the story, every legitimate heir other than Dany is going to be dead (Joffrey’s alread defunct, Tommen is a puppet and Myrcella is currently captive and disfigured). Given the Targaryen penchant for marrying close relatives, Dany and Jon (aunt and nephew, after all) are likely to end up the royal couple at the finish line. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2011, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-game-of-thrones-hbo-series-spoilers/567955/119 "2011-03-23T18:28:18Z")
My guess is that by the end of the series, there won’t be a Seven Kingdoms left to rule. Besides, Dany marrying Jon won’t really help much - Dany can’t have any children. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2011, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-game-of-thrones-hbo-series-spoilers/567955/120 "2011-03-23T18:32:15Z")
May I ask that, rather than have posts which are entirely spoilered, we all at least include a word or two as to what it’s about? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-game-of-thrones-hbo-series-spoilers/567955.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-game-of-thrones-hbo-series-spoilers/567955.md?page=7)