# A general detectable frequency, everywhere? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 6, 2018, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-general-detectable-frequency-everywhere/811929 "2018-04-06T16:05:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Kedikat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed655f/32.png) [@Kedikat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kedikat)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2018, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-general-detectable-frequency-everywhere/811929/1 "2018-04-06T16:05:32Z")
With the right detector. Is there a frequency that is present everywhere on the surface of Earth? Like some tick tock of the universe? Or at least somewhat local to Earth? Asking in relation to my question about linear acceleration detection. If such a frequency exists. Could you attach your “antenna” for it, to a device that also generates the frequency. Mix the frequencies and by the difference, tell if the set up is moving or at rest. Doppler effect would change the frequency the antenna sees. But the frequency from the generator would not be effected. It is not moving relative to the antenna. There all all sorts of things putting out various frequencies. But is there one or more that stands out? ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2018, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-general-detectable-frequency-everywhere/811929/2 "2018-04-06T16:09:27Z")
[Cosmic microwave background radiation.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmic_microwave_background) ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2018, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-general-detectable-frequency-everywhere/811929/3 "2018-04-06T16:56:29Z")
Not to be sarcastic, but I’m not sure that you know what “frequencies” means. “There all all sorts of things putting out various frequencies.” doesn’t make sense. ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2018, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-general-detectable-frequency-everywhere/811929/4 "2018-04-06T17:07:32Z")
Well, frequency is a property of waves, like electromagnetic radiation. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2018, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-general-detectable-frequency-everywhere/811929/5 "2018-04-06T17:11:24Z")
> [@Kedikat](#): > > With the right detector. Is there a frequency that is present everywhere on the surface of Earth? Like some tick tock of the universe? Or at least somewhat local to Earth? > > Asking in relation to my question about linear acceleration detection. > > If such a frequency exists. Could you attach your “antenna” for it, to a device that also generates the frequency. Mix the frequencies and by the difference, tell if the set up is moving or at rest. Doppler effect would change the frequency the antenna sees. But the frequency from the generator would not be effected. It is not moving relative to the antenna. > > There all all sorts of things putting out various frequencies. But is there one or more that stands out? Are you trying to invent GPS? ETA: Or astronaviagation? That works by detecting EM, too. ETA: Or come to that, I can tell if I’m moving by detecting reflected EM radiation all around me without using any instruments at all. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2018, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-general-detectable-frequency-everywhere/811929/6 "2018-04-06T17:15:04Z")
> [@cmyk](#): > > Well, frequency is a property of waves, like electromagnetic radiation. But usually when someone talks about things “putting out frequences” without specifying sound or electromagnetic radiation, they are talking about something [like](http://altered-states.net/barry/newsletter420/) [this](http://www.earthunchained.com/vibrational-frequency/). ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2018, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-general-detectable-frequency-everywhere/811929/7 "2018-04-06T17:24:21Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > ETA: Or come to that, I can tell if I’m moving by detecting reflected EM radiation all around me without using any instruments at all. You crazy kids, using those things called _eyes._ ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2018, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-general-detectable-frequency-everywhere/811929/8 "2018-04-06T17:25:57Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > But usually when someone talks about things “putting out frequences” without specifying sound or electromagnetic radiation, they are talking about something [like](http://altered-states.net/barry/newsletter420/) [this](http://www.earthunchained.com/vibrational-frequency/). Or they’re about to beat up Dan Rather. ---
**Author:** ![newme](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/e0b2c6/32.png) [@newme](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newme)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2018, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-general-detectable-frequency-everywhere/811929/9 "2018-04-06T17:43:24Z")
How about [Doppler aided positioning.](http://gpsworld.com/gnss-systemalgorithms-methodsinnovation-doppler-aided-positioning-11601/) GPS and other global navigation satellite systems use the Doppler shift of the received carrier frequencies to determine the velocity of a moving receiver. Doppler-derived velocity is far more accurate than that obtained by simply differencing two position estimates. ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2018, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-general-detectable-frequency-everywhere/811929/10 "2018-04-06T18:09:54Z")
How about [X-ray pulsar-based navigation](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X-ray_pulsar-based_navigation)? Article says it is being considered for aircraft navigation. ---
**Author:** ![Kedikat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed655f/32.png) [@Kedikat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kedikat)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2018, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-general-detectable-frequency-everywhere/811929/11 "2018-04-06T20:14:17Z")
I have considered using the carrier frequency of GPS. I am still trying to find information about mixers and such to see if they are capable of providing the small resolution I am seeking. Small movement detection. Not very familiar with that area of electronics. More frequency modulation decoding. So I did not have to write a novella length question. I assumed most folks would assume I was speaking of frequencies that are able to be detected by an antenna. And left out other somewhat obvious specifics. I did not say anything about navigation. Just detection of acceleration or velocity. There are various electro mechanical devices available. But they are not as solid state as I am seeking. Cost and complexity of them is somewhat an issue. I have used some of them. Repaired many of them. ---
**Author:** ![Kedikat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed655f/32.png) [@Kedikat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kedikat)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2018, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-general-detectable-frequency-everywhere/811929/12 "2018-04-06T20:18:38Z")
I am looking to detect irregular movement in the range of 0 to 1 inch. A geophone. With no moving parts whatsoever. Not even mems. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2018, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-general-detectable-frequency-everywhere/811929/13 "2018-04-06T20:25:53Z")
> [@Kedikat](#): > > I am looking to detect irregular movement in the range of 0 to 1 inch. A geophone. With no moving parts whatsoever. Not even mems. As my mother used to say, people in Hell want ice water. I suspect that both are equally likely. ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2018, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-general-detectable-frequency-everywhere/811929/14 "2018-04-06T20:35:19Z")
> [@Kedikat](#): > > I am looking to detect irregular movement in the range of 0 to 1 inch. A geophone. With no moving parts whatsoever. Not even mems. Wouldn’t a digital accelerometer work for something like that? ---
**Author:** ![scr4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/59ef9b/32.png) [@scr4](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scr4)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2018, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-general-detectable-frequency-everywhere/811929/15 "2018-04-06T20:41:34Z")
> [@Kedikat](#): > > I have considered using the carrier frequency of GPS. I am still trying to find information about mixers and such to see if they are capable of providing the small resolution I am seeking. Small movement detection. Not very familiar with that area of electronics. More frequency modulation decoding. > > … Just detection of acceleration or velocity. There are various electro mechanical devices available. But they are not as solid state as I am seeking. Cost and complexity of them is somewhat an issue. I have used some of them. Repaired many of them. Oh. So this is not a theoretical/speculative question, you want an actual solution that you can incorporate into an actual device. I was going to suggest telescopes with high resolution spectrometers to look at stellar spectra, but I suppose that’s out. Same with pulsar signals. Cosmic microwave background is not easy to measure either. All naturally occurring signals are very weak, and their sources aren’t stationary anyway. > [@](#): > > I am looking to detect irregular movement in the range of 0 to 1 inch. That’s not a speed, that’s a distance. Do you need to detect a speed of 1 inch per millisecond, or 1 inch per minute, or what? ---
**Author:** ![scr4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/59ef9b/32.png) [@scr4](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scr4)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2018, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-general-detectable-frequency-everywhere/811929/16 "2018-04-06T20:43:08Z")
> [@cmyk](#): > > Wouldn’t a digital accelerometer work for something like that? OP said “no MEMS.” Solid state accelerometers are still MEMS (Microelectromechanical systems). Though I don’t understand why, since that’s the obvious solution, and there is no practical difference between a MEMS and a purely electronic device. ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2018, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-general-detectable-frequency-everywhere/811929/17 "2018-04-06T20:46:55Z")
> [@scr4](#): > > OP said “no MEMS.” Solid state accelerometers are still MEMS (Microelectromechanical systems). Though I don’t understand why, since that’s the obvious solution, and there is no practical difference between a MEMS and a purely electronic device. :smack: I somehow read “not even mems”, and then immediately forgot I did. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2018, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-general-detectable-frequency-everywhere/811929/18 "2018-04-06T20:55:39Z")
> [@scr4](#): > > OP said “no MEMS.” Solid state accelerometers are still MEMS (Microelectromechanical systems). Though I don’t understand why, since that’s the obvious solution, and there is no practical difference between a MEMS and a purely electronic device. And as I linked to in the other thread, there is a class of sensor that uses tiny heaters and thermometers–some sealed-in air is heated and any movement causes the air to move, allowing the thermometers to detect the temperature change and thus the acceleration. There are literally no moving parts in the sensor other than air. And they cost a dollar or two in bulk. (Probably can be bought for a few dollars individually from resellers.) If that isn’t good enough for the OP’s restrictions, then he really will be waiting until Hell freezes over. ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2018, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-general-detectable-frequency-everywhere/811929/19 "2018-04-06T20:57:05Z")
Would something like the [WWVB signal](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WWVB) for atomic clocks work? ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2018, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-general-detectable-frequency-everywhere/811929/20 "2018-04-06T21:02:30Z")
> [@cmyk](#): > > Would something like the [WWVB signal](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WWVB) for atomic clocks work? OP wants “a frequency that is present everywhere on the surface of Earth.” [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-general-detectable-frequency-everywhere/811929.md?page=2)