# A Hobbit question **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** middle-earth\ **Created:** [November 6, 2013, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-hobbit-question/673264 "2013-11-06T18:59:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![sohvan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/96bed5/32.png) [@sohvan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sohvan)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2013, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-hobbit-question/673264/21 "2013-11-07T17:46:41Z")
There have already been several good reasons mentioned in this thread, but I think Gandalf chose Bilbo partly because he thought Bilbo might keep the dwarves alive. Gandalf can’t possibly expect 13 dwarves and 1 hobbit to kill the dragon. The dragon had to be dealt with though, or it might ally with Sauron in the future. I think Gandalf wanted the expedition to disturb Smaug, but expected others to have to kill him afterwards. If Smaug is awake and active, then he’s a much more pressing concern to be dealt with by humans, elves, other dwarves, and the White Council. The dwarves are stubborn, and a Hobbit’s sensibility and common sense might just save them. If he had chosen a “hero” as the 14th member, that person would have probably just ended up dragon food. ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2013, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-hobbit-question/673264/22 "2013-11-07T19:16:44Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > One of their considerations was not to have their party number “unlucky” thirteen. (Gandalf didn’t count since he wouldn’t be with them all of the way.) In any case, Rohan was far out of their way, and Laketown was at the very end of their journey. They didn’t encounter any real men between Bree and Laketown (Beorn not being an ordinary human.) The dwarves did not start in the Shire, they had to journey there to pick up Bilbo. Surely Gandalf could have had them journey somewhere else instead. I don’t know where Thorin lived after Smaug kicked all the dwarves out of Erebor, but the Shire is in the opposite direction from Erebor from every other place in Arnor, except for the Blue Mountain dwarves and the Elven Grey Havens. ---
**Author:** ![Airk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9de053/32.png) [@Airk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airk)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2013, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-hobbit-question/673264/23 "2013-11-07T20:56:38Z")
> [@mlees](#): > > The dwarves did not start in the Shire, they had to journey there to pick up Bilbo. Surely Gandalf could have had them journey somewhere else instead. I don’t know where Thorin lived after Smaug kicked all the dwarves out of Erebor, but the Shire is in the opposite direction from Erebor from every other place in Arnor, except for the Blue Mountain dwarves and the Elven Grey Havens. Except that the dwarven expedition STARTED in the Blue Mountains. So the Shire was not only on the way, but anywhere else would have been well out of it. ---
**Author:** ![the\_diego](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7bcc69/32.png) [@the\_diego](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_diego)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-hobbit-question/673264/24 "2013-11-08T00:22:48Z")
An agreement between Gandalf and the Old Took. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-hobbit-question/673264/25 "2013-11-08T02:50:25Z")
Gandalf was a Maiar reduced enough from his eternal spiritual being to fit into a mortal body. As such he had premonitions that he didn’t understand but knew to trust. He flatly told Thorin that it was fated that if Bilbo went with the dwarves their quest would succeed, and that if he didn’t it would fail. That probably came straight from Eru Iluvatar. ---
**Author:** ![the\_diego](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7bcc69/32.png) [@the\_diego](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_diego)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-hobbit-question/673264/26 "2013-11-08T02:59:24Z")
Because Bilbo was a bachelor and an orphan (as was Frodo.) So yes, the luck that befalls orphans and widows’ sons implies Valar intervention. If it was Elrond or Aragorn who did the choosing, they might have opted for either the heir to the Thainship (a Took) or to Brandyhall (a Brandybuck.) ---
**Author:** ![Cheez\_Whia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/d26b3c/32.png) [@Cheez\_Whia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheez_Whia)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 4:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-hobbit-question/673264/27 "2013-11-08T04:23:32Z")
Well, Bilbo’s mother was “the fabulous Belladonna Took, one of the three remarkable daughters of The Old Took”. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-hobbit-question/673264/28 "2013-11-08T04:28:00Z")
> [@mlees](#): > > I don’t know where Thorin lived after Smaug kicked all the dwarves out of Erebor, I do.😉 > [@](#): > > but the Shire is in the opposite direction from Erebor from every other place in Arnor, except for the Blue Mountain dwarves and the Elven Grey Havens. Thrain and Thorin settled among the Blue Mountain dwarves, and over time their various kin and other party members joined them there. As **Airk** says, they went through the Shire exactly because it was on the direct route between the Blue Mountains and Erebor. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 8:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-hobbit-question/673264/29 "2013-11-08T08:01:49Z")
Tolkien started with the sentence “In a hole there lived a hobbit.” And the book was about the hobbit. So the question isn’t why a hobbit, but why what followed: a wizard, dwarrows, adventure and a dragon and back again. The given is the hobbit. ---
**Author:** ![42fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/4/b487fb/32.png) [@42fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/42fish)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 12:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-hobbit-question/673264/30 "2013-11-08T12:48:24Z")
> [@Tim\_R.Mortiss](#): > > Gandalf was a pervy hobbit-fancier! Sam will kill him if he tries anything. ---
**Author:** ![vontsira](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/51bf81/32.png) [@vontsira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vontsira)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-hobbit-question/673264/31 "2013-11-08T13:52:35Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > It’s not so much that he had _knowledge_, per se, that sending Bilbo along would allow the expedition to succeed. It would be more accurate to describe it as intuition, or a hunch. But the hunches of such beings as Gandalf are wiser than the learnings of we mortals. And maybe the general “on-the-side-of-good higher powers” (I don’t know the Silmarillion-type learned terminology) nudging Gandalf, hunch-wise, to get Bilbo included in the expedition – with view having, as a seeming side benefit (in fact overall, more important) the Ruling Ring transferred from Gollum’s ownership, to Bilbo’s. ---
**Author:** ![shantih](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f6c823/32.png) [@shantih](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shantih)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-hobbit-question/673264/32 "2013-11-08T13:53:45Z")
> [@42fish](#): > > Sam will kill him if he tries anything. Y’know, in like 58 years, when Gandalf returns to the Shire for Bilbo’s eleventy-first birthday party. But then, for sure. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-hobbit-question/673264/33 "2013-11-08T15:18:45Z")
As to why they couldn’t find anyone else between the Ered Luin and Laketown, Eriador (the region west of the Misty Mountains (the Hithaeglir)) was almost depopulated by wars and plague in the first half of the Third Age. It used to be, in large part, the Northern Kingdom of Arnor (the sister-state to Gondor), but by the latter half of the Third Age Arnor had fallen (with the Rangers of the North the only remnant of the Dunedain in that part of the world). It was, aside from Lindon (of the Elves), a small community of Dwarves in the Ered Luin, and the Shire and Breeland, largely wilderness. ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-hobbit-question/673264/34 "2013-11-08T17:02:33Z")
> [@42fish](#): > > Sam will kill him if he tries anything. “Mr Frodo! Don’t let him do anything unnatural to me!” :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2013, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-hobbit-question/673264/35 "2013-11-10T22:05:44Z")
> [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](#): > > In Gandalf’s own words, from **Unfinished Tales** where he explained why he picked Bilbo… This is also included in _The Annotated Hobbit_, and is there entitled “The Quest of Erebor.” Gandalf, relaxed and expansive, tells the backstory of Thorin & Co.'s adventures to the Fellowship’s Hobbits as they relax in Minas Tirith after the fall of Sauron in LOTR. Good stuff. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2013, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-hobbit-question/673264/36 "2013-11-10T23:58:37Z")
> [@](#): > > Quoth **vontsira** : > > And maybe the general “on-the-side-of-good higher powers” (I don’t know the Silmarillion-type learned terminology) The “general on-the-side-of-good higher powers”, plural, are the Valar and the Maiar (Gandalf is one of the latter). The Valar don’t intervene directly in Middle Earth any more, though, since the last time they did so, they broke it. If there was nudging there (and there probably was), it had to have come from God Himself (who is called “Eru” or “Illuvatar” in Tolkien’s works). ---
**Author:** ![vontsira](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/51bf81/32.png) [@vontsira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vontsira)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2013, 8:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-hobbit-question/673264/37 "2013-11-11T08:55:20Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > The “general on-the-side-of-good higher powers”, plural, are the Valar and the Maiar (Gandalf is one of the latter). The Valar don’t intervene directly in Middle Earth any more, though, since the last time they did so, they broke it. If there was nudging there (and there probably was), it had to have come from God Himself (who is called “Eru” or “Illuvatar” in Tolkien’s works). Thanks. I love LOTR, but am basically pretty much on “hobbit” wavelength – enjoy their, mostly, decidedly down-to-earth take on things. Would not have taken very much pleasure in the books if they had involved only high / heroic / noble / spiritual, and superpower / evil-overlord, types. Have thus never wished to get into the “Silmarillion” – plus, I gather that much of it is profoundly depressing. ---
**Author:** ![Not\_Carlson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bc79bd/32.png) [@Not\_Carlson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Not_Carlson)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2013, 10:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-hobbit-question/673264/38 "2013-11-11T10:54:46Z")
> [@Balance](#): > > Gandalf’s purpose in Middle Earth was, in large part, to encourage people to stand up against the darkness. His strong association with fire (and Fire) is symbolic of his role in kindling courage in the hearts of others–one at a time, if necessary. He knew from long association that a steady ember of that courage waited in the hearts of many hobbits, and in Bilbo in particular. His purpose, his reason for taking mortal form, his very nature impelled him to breathe on that ember and bring it to life. > > Also, I daresay that he found it terribly amusing. 🙂 Very interesting! I never picked up that imagery before. That’s really pretty cool. As **Tim R. Mortiss** and **tullsterx** have suggested, Gandalf probably chose Bilbo out of his knowledge of Thorin’s shortcomings (_absolutely_ no pun intended) and some foresight of how later events would play out. He needed a thief who was not unquestioningly loyal to Thorin or the dwarves’ quest. > [@Ethilrist](#): > > “If you’re talking about the affair with the dragon, I was hardly involved…” Bastard never even called poor Smaug afterward. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2013, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-hobbit-question/673264/39 "2013-11-11T16:27:00Z")
The Silmarillion can be pretty depressing, but it mostly (aside from the tale of Turin) focuses on rays of hope shining through the darkness. You’re right though that there are hardly any “everyman” characters in it: The focus is all on “noble” types, and I can see how that might not be your thing. ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2013, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-hobbit-question/673264/40 "2013-11-11T17:31:10Z")
Given that the Silmarillion tells the tale of how once the world was a paradise where the eldest of the Elves rubbed shoulders with the archangels and lived in a land of eternal wonder and delight, and now it isn’t, it’s hard to see how it could not be pretty depressing on the whole. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-hobbit-question/673264.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-hobbit-question/673264.md?page=3)