# A little hazy on New York geography **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [January 10, 2010, 7:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-little-hazy-on-new-york-geography/524378 "2010-01-10T07:41:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2010, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-little-hazy-on-new-york-geography/524378/41 "2010-01-12T04:51:27Z")
> [@](#): > > I used to take the train from the north Bronx to go birding at Jamaica Bay, and once or twice to the Rockaways. It involved a couple of transfers between lines, and often took a couple of hours (not to mention a having to pay an additional fare). You should have just taken the U Train up to Rochester. The bird watching on Irondequoit Bay is great. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2010, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-little-hazy-on-new-york-geography/524378/42 "2010-01-12T13:47:15Z")
Incidentally, germane to this discussion is that the city of Rochester once had its own subway, which is now long gone. Some of the track, I’m told, is still used to deliver the rolls of paper to the newpaper printers downtown underground. I know that a couple of the old stations still exist (like the one near the Rundel Library). Rochester is AFAUIK, the only city to have a subway and let it go. By around 1950 noboidy was ridi ng it, and I’ve been told that the cards used to stop to let animals cross the track. They built the subway by putting rails down in the depressions where the Erie canal used to be when it went through downtown (it had been routed south of the city, as the New York State Barge canal), and it was apparently tempting to use that handy depression in the ground and give continued life to taverns and stores that had grown up around the canal. But the city grew up around different streets after the canal was moved, and that path became increasingly irrelevant, so the subway didn’t serve the popuilation very well as time went by, and its purpose was replaced by standard bus routes. There’s now quite a bit of info on the Rochester Subway on the Internet. But it never did reach anywhere near Downstate, let alone New York City. > **[Rochester subway](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rochester_Subway)** > > The Rochester Industrial and Rapid Transit Railway (reporting mark RSB), more commonly known as the Rochester subway, was a light rail rapid transit line in the city of Rochester, New York, from 1927 to 1956. The subway was constructed in the bed of the old Erie Canal, which allowed the route to be grade-separated for its entire length. Two miles (3.2 km) of the route through downtown were constructed in a cut-and-cover tunnel that became Broad Street, and the only underground portion of the sub... [http://rocwiki.org/Abandoned\_Subway](http://rocwiki.org/Abandoned_Subway) > **[Rochester Subway : 1928 Rochester Subway Map \[24" x 36" Poster \]](https://www.rochestersubway.com/rochester_subway_poster_1928.php)** > > The Rochester Subway may be history, but this large 24"x36" Rochester Subway map brings back a piece of Rochester history few people know about. Order yours today. > **[Infiltration: Rochester Subway](http://infiltration.org/transit-roch.html)** > > The zine about going places you're not supposed to go, like tunnels, abandoned buildings, rooftops, hotel pools and more. > **[RochesterSubway.com : Rochester NY's favorite spot for lost history and new...](https://www.rochestersubway.com/topics/)** > > Rochester NY's source for lost history and new ideas. The Rochester Subway may be gone, but these old Rochester photos, maps, images and stories bring back pieces of Rochester history few people know about. Explore Rochester's past and learn what may... [http://animatusstudio.com/subway/index.html](http://animatusstudio.com/subway/index.html) ---
**Author:** ![Pigs\_in\_Space](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9d8465/32.png) [@Pigs\_in\_Space](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pigs_in_Space)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 6:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-little-hazy-on-new-york-geography/524378/43 "2010-01-13T06:26:48Z")
> [@robardin](#): > > So yeah, case in point – to this NYC’er, I have to really concentrate to remember that stuff west of I-87 constitute a lot of (even most of) the area of NY State. New York state is shaped vaguely like a triangle pointing west. I-87 runs almost on the eastern border, darned near touching Vermont near Lake Champlain. The area west of I-87 is about 95% of the state. And for the love of Pete, upstate starts at Albany, not Westchester. 🙂 Trivia - I grew up in upstate NY, closer to Boston or Montreal (or Burlington! until the bridge fell down) than to NYC. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-little-hazy-on-new-york-geography/524378/44 "2010-01-13T14:00:04Z")
> [@Pigs\_in\_Space](#): > > The area west of I-87 is about 95% of the state. And for the love of Pete, upstate starts at Albany, not Westchester. 🙂 Westchester is upstate. North of that is Canada. 😛 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-little-hazy-on-new-york-geography/524378/45 "2010-01-13T14:35:17Z")
New York City people - I’m sorry guys - are terrible with upstate. They don’t seem to realize when I say something is an “hour” away, I mean, an hour at 70 mph. They think it’s the hour it takes them to get across town! And then once we had someone come into our Albany office from NYC, around 2 PM, and say, “let’s check into the hotel and then go visit the other offices before dinner.” You know, the Syracuse (2.5 hrs away), Rochester (4 hrs away), and Buffalo (5 hrs away)offices. I think they just don’t realize how BIG the state is. ---
**Author:** ![Maeglin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@Maeglin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maeglin)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-little-hazy-on-new-york-geography/524378/46 "2010-01-13T15:12:04Z")
> [@Hari\_Seldon](#): > > I’ve never actually done, but I understand that the full run of the A train from northern Manhattan to Far Rockaway is two hours. I have done this, and yes, it is about two hours. I happen to live at the end of the A train in Manhattan, and have also taken the subway to Brighton Beach (never again) and JFK airpirt (never, ever again). ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-little-hazy-on-new-york-geography/524378/47 "2010-01-13T21:44:44Z")
> [@Hari\_Seldon](#): > > It is eminently feasible to commute from Brooklyn to Manhattan, especially lower Manhattan. My son and his wife and my daughter all do it and my son-in-law commutes to Hoboken, NJ (by subway and PATH train). I’ve commuted from Hoboken to a client in Queens. It’s actually pretty easy if you take the bus into Midtown. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2010, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-little-hazy-on-new-york-geography/524378/48 "2010-01-13T22:39:06Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > I’ve commuted from Hoboken to a client in Queens. It’s actually pretty easy if you take the bus into Midtown. I did a reverse commute to Jersey City, and I hated it. Bus to E to PATH. Took forever. But I also hate when I have to commute downtown, versus getting to work in midtown. Saves ~30 minutes each way, no matter what downtown commute I’ve tried. ---
**Author:** ![Nutty\_Bunny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/d07c76/32.png) [@Nutty\_Bunny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nutty_Bunny)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-little-hazy-on-new-york-geography/524378/49 "2010-01-14T03:48:38Z")
What? No love for Northern New York (aka the REAL North Country)? And do NOT call us Upstate! I grew up in Northern New York (I can see Canada from my house!), but now live in Upstate New York. Before I moved to Albany, I considered anything south of Lake Placid “downstate”. As it turns out, I hear that Glens Falls is considered “North Country”. Um, no. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2010, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-little-hazy-on-new-york-geography/524378/50 "2010-01-14T04:22:00Z")
Downstate begins when you cross the Ausable. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-little-hazy-on-new-york-geography/524378.md?page=2)