# A Massachusetts "Big Dig" Question **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 12, 2010, 12:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-massachusetts-big-dig-question/535827 "2010-04-12T12:52:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 12:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-massachusetts-big-dig-question/535827/1 "2010-04-12T12:52:19Z")
I was driving on Rt. 128 yesterday, and was instantly reminded of the fiscal insanity of the “Big Dig” highway project (which has cost $21 billion so far). Anyway, part of the project involved erecting massive electronic signboards along sections of Rt. 128/95. The idea is that these signboards would be updated with traffic information, road conditions, and were to be integrated with sensors in the Big Dig tunnels. This did not happen-instead, these idiotic signs now bear messages like “Wear your seatbelt”, “Speed limit is 60 MPH”, or “Have a Nice Day!”. I understand that over $55,000,000 was spent on these signs…and I cannot find out who authorized their purchase (no info on any state websites). Of course, this being Massachusetts, I am sure that substantial kickbacks were involved. Anybody know who the guilty parties might be?☹ ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-massachusetts-big-dig-question/535827/2 "2010-04-12T13:13:51Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > This did not happen-instead, these idiotic signs now bear messages like “Wear your seatbelt”, “Speed limit is 60 MPH”, or “Have a Nice Day!”.( Most of the time, there are no traffic conditions to notify people of. This is what they display 95% of the time by design. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-massachusetts-big-dig-question/535827/3 "2010-04-12T13:47:25Z")
Better look into the Amber Alert system. Funding for those signs comes from the feds. ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-massachusetts-big-dig-question/535827/4 "2010-04-13T00:54:31Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > Most of the time, there are no traffic conditions to notify people of. This is what they display 95% of the time by design. “As some of you may have observed when you looked out the window, there is no weather today. This unusual condition is due to a strike by the Weather Forecaster’s Union…” ---
**Author:** ![Fair\_Rarity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fair_rarity/32/153_2.png) [@Fair\_Rarity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fair_Rarity)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-massachusetts-big-dig-question/535827/5 "2010-04-13T02:37:50Z")
The signs said something like “Thanks Ted,” when Kennedy died this summer…so … there’s that. ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-massachusetts-big-dig-question/535827/6 "2010-04-14T14:15:20Z")
I just was on Rt. 128-the multi-million$ signboard was displaying: “Buckle Up! Have a nice Day”!Great use of $55 million! Like I sai, I would just like to know what kind of idiot hack authorized this. Of course, nobody in government ever gets fired for incompetence. ---
**Author:** ![gotpasswords](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c57346/32.png) [@gotpasswords](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gotpasswords)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-massachusetts-big-dig-question/535827/7 "2010-04-14T14:34:02Z")
In California, most of the Amber Alert signs either display inane slogans like CLICK IT OR TICKET or DRIVE SAFELY. Alternately, a lot of them are left blank - it’s my experience that displaying anything on those signs will slow down traffic as everyone has to bring it down to 20 MPH in order to read. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-massachusetts-big-dig-question/535827/8 "2010-04-14T15:11:00Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > I just was on Rt. 128-the multi-million$ signboard was displaying: “Buckle Up! Have a nice Day”!Great use of $55 million! > Like I sai, I would just like to know what kind of idiot hack authorized this. Authorized what? The message you saw? Why is it better to have a blank sign instead of a public service message when it is not being used for traffic information? The cost of the signs is justified by the messages that are urgent safety information. Just because that happens infrequently does not mean the signs are a waste. When was the last time your airbag went off? ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-massachusetts-big-dig-question/535827/9 "2010-04-14T15:17:05Z")
We have those on the highways here (Nashville) and they often warn of traffic or upcoming contruction or, rarely, Amber alerts. Most of the time however they are blank. I don’t think anyone complains when there is no bad news to report. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-massachusetts-big-dig-question/535827/10 "2010-04-14T15:17:34Z")
Yeah, and why is my town spending thousands of dollars on fire trucks and paying the salaries of firefighters? I’ve never had a fire, so that’s a total waste of money. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-massachusetts-big-dig-question/535827/11 "2010-04-14T15:17:52Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > Of course, nobody in government ever gets fired for incompetence. Or gets yelled at on a message board. 🙂 The signs do serve a useful purpose, just not all the time. It’s not incompetence because they’re not needed 24/7. You can certainly argue about the cost of it, but you’re complaining about safety/emergency gear that isn’t being used a lot. It’s a silly complaint. ---
**Author:** ![pancakes3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ba9def/32.png) [@pancakes3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pancakes3)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-massachusetts-big-dig-question/535827/12 "2010-04-14T15:30:16Z")
honestly, i would rail against the construction of those things as well. traffic updates are useless. you’re already on the highway. even if there was a jacknifed big rig blocking 3 lanes of traffic, you’re already on the the highway, and chances are you’re part of the 90% of cars unable to read the sign. Of the 10% who can, you’re in the 67% who can’t switch over to the exit lane and use local roads. Even if people did use local roads, the traffic would be a sh\*tshow there as well. I have passed a million signs and those signs have never influenced me to use a detour, ever. They’ve influenced 1 person, ever in my experience. a mobile construction sign saying “left 2 lanes ending, merge right” made my friend exit, and re-enter the highway saving us about 500 feet of traffic. we did this about 4x and saved about 20 mins of idling. ---
**Author:** ![Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Swallowed_My_Cellphone)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-massachusetts-big-dig-question/535827/13 "2010-04-14T15:55:31Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Authorized what? The message you saw? Why is it better to have a blank sign instead of a public service message when it is not being used for traffic information? I don’t see what the OP’s fuss is about either. We have similar signs around Toronto. During rush hour you’ll often see traffic updates if there’s something up, like a slow down, accident, road closure, or detour instructions. If traffic is moving well and there’s nothing to report, the signs will say things like "Arrive alive! Buckle up!’ The only message I find perplexing is “School’s out! Watch for children!” as if someone expects children to be playing on the expressway. :eek: ETA: > [@pancakes3](#): > > They’ve influenced 1 person, ever in my experience Well you can count me on multiple occasions. We’ve taken the recommended alternate route suggested by the signs frequently to save time and not get stuck when traffic was backed up due to a fender-bender. Maybe our express and collector lanes are just planned better allowing us to take advantage of the heads up. ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-massachusetts-big-dig-question/535827/14 "2010-04-14T16:05:02Z")
Again, the utility of these signs (on Rt. 128) is pretty low. First, they never (to my knowledge) display alternate routes. Most of Rt. 128 has no alternatives-once you get on the stretch between Rt.95 and Rt.3, there is simply nothing you can do-once in traffice, you are stuck. Second, free traffic reports are broadcast every 3 minutes (AM 1030) vis radio-this is more cost effective than the signs. I would like to see the repair costs when these things start breaking down-I have noticed several sections of display are dimmer than others. Hey, what’s another $55 million? ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-massachusetts-big-dig-question/535827/15 "2010-04-14T17:01:52Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > Hey, what’s another $55 million? I think your information on the cost of the system is out of whack also. Here is a description of the [Route 128/I-95 Advanced Traffic Management System (ATMS)](http://www.mhd.state.ma.us/default.asp?pgid=its/route128&sid=itsData), including the “dynamic message signs” that you are upset about, and the budget for the whole system is only $8.2 million: > [@](#): > > Construction is nearly 90% complete for the Route 128/I-95 Advanced Traffic Management System (ATMS) for the Route 128/ I-95 circumferential highway and I-93 north of Boston. The ATMS includes a surveillance system (loop detectors, machine vision, radar, and lasers) that detects traffic anomalies or incidents, live roadside cameras to verify the type of incident (flat tire, road debris or accident) and dynamic message signs (DMS) to alert motorists of potential safety problems (accident ahead, slow speeds etc.). > > The construction cost of this project is approximately $ 8.2 million. I think you have been misinformed. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-massachusetts-big-dig-question/535827/16 "2010-04-14T17:07:35Z")
I think they should have the signs read: Doper **ralph124c** gets his facts wrong. Again. Uses vaguely-remembered statistics for anti-government diatribe. News at 11. ---
**Author:** ![Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Swallowed_My_Cellphone)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-massachusetts-big-dig-question/535827/17 "2010-04-14T17:18:25Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > I think your information on the cost of the system is out of whack also. Here is a description of the [Route 128/I-95 Advanced Traffic Management System (ATMS)](http://www.mhd.state.ma.us/default.asp?pgid=its/route128&sid=itsData), That is actually pretty cool. It never occurred to me that the systems were actually operating a traffic monitoring system too. It makes perfect sense though. ---
**Author:** ![IAmNotSpartacus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/cc9497/32.png) [@IAmNotSpartacus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IAmNotSpartacus)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-massachusetts-big-dig-question/535827/18 "2010-04-14T17:20:51Z")
> [@pancakes3](#): > > honestly, i would rail against the construction of those things as well. traffic updates are useless. you’re already on the highway. even if there was a jacknifed big rig blocking 3 lanes of traffic, you’re already on the the highway, and chances are you’re part of the 90% of cars unable to read the sign. Of the 10% who can, you’re in the 67% who can’t switch over to the exit lane and use local roads. Even if people did use local roads, the traffic would be a sh\*tshow there as well. I have passed a million signs and those signs have never influenced me to use a detour, ever. Some transportation agencies have the foresight to display estimated drive times to certain waypoints, and give drive time using alternative routes. They use realtime information from traffic sensors on the highway to give these estimates. It is very useful and relevant information. Relying on the radio is not reliable, traffic reports come in from drivers that don’t know the difference between north and south, don’t know how to count lanes properly (it starts from the left, and excludes HOV lanes) and so on. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-massachusetts-big-dig-question/535827/19 "2010-04-14T17:23:36Z")
> [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](#): > > That is actually pretty cool. It never occurred to me that the systems were actually operating a traffic monitoring system too. It makes perfect sense though. Not only that, but all the cameras are [accessable on the intarwebs](http://www1.eot.state.ma.us/boswebcammulview.aspx). The system is a bargain at twice the price. ---
**Author:** ![hogarth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hogarth/32/1773_2.png) [@hogarth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hogarth)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-massachusetts-big-dig-question/535827/20 "2010-04-14T17:26:58Z")
> [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](#): > > Well you can count me on multiple occasions. We’ve taken the recommended alternate route suggested by the signs frequently to save time and not get stuck when traffic was backed up due to a fender-bender. Maybe our express and collector lanes are just planned better allowing us to take advantage of the heads up. Likewise, I’m in Toronto and I’ve gotten use of the signs if they say something like “Traffic slow until such-and-such exit”; if it seems that a traffic slowdown is going to clear up soon, I’m less likely to exit immediately and take surface streets instead. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-massachusetts-big-dig-question/535827.md?page=2)