# A message to all atheists, unbelievers, and lukewarm christians **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 25, 2013, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-message-to-all-atheists-unbelievers-and-lukewarm-christians/667164 "2013-08-25T23:56:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-message-to-all-atheists-unbelievers-and-lukewarm-christians/667164/201 "2013-08-28T21:11:36Z")
> [@hotflungwok](#): > > And what did the Jews put mustard on back then anyway? A nice MLT, mutton, lettuce and tomato sandwich, where the mutton is nice and lean, and the tomato is ripe… ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-message-to-all-atheists-unbelievers-and-lukewarm-christians/667164/202 "2013-08-28T21:19:19Z")
**Jesusguy** , serious question. Do you think anyone here has not already heard about what you’re preaching? And with that in mind, do you think just repeating it is going to convince _anyone_? ---
**Author:** ![drewtwo99](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d07c76/32.png) [@drewtwo99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drewtwo99)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-message-to-all-atheists-unbelievers-and-lukewarm-christians/667164/203 "2013-08-28T21:22:22Z")
It all makes perfect sense when you stop and think about it. So God created the world and man, who went on for several thousands of years fucking and killing in His name. Yay! Then all of a sudden God was like, “woah woah woah hold on. I can’t hear anyone’s prayers and I guess I never could, and all this fucking and killing is really getting out of hand. And look at all these folks who are worshiping other gods and stuff WHICH I TOLD THEM NOT TO DO! Ugh. Ok… think God, think… how can we get out of this mess? Let me think for a few minutes…” So God comes up with a plan. 1. Create a woman, the first woman since Eve to be born without Original Sin. I am God and I can do this. Why not just get rid of everyone’s Original Sin you ask? SHHhhhhh! 2. Impregnate this woman with My Holy Seed, but I guess I’ll send one of my angels down first to tell her I’m about to rape her and make her carry my child. Also, she should be a virgin when this all happens, just for the lols. 3. So this kid that this chick is going to bring into the world is going to be my Son, but he’s also going to be me. Don’t ask. 4. Kid grows up, performs a bunch of miracles, says a bunch of wonderful things about how great I am. Gather a cult following of disciples. 5. Stir up some shit with the Romans and get them to kill him/me. This is the Perfect Sacrifice, because I, God himself, will be dying. Of course I won’t actually be dying, just this human form of me I’m making. Yes I know I’ve been in human form and burning bush form before but this time it’s going to be special BECAUSE I SAY SO. 6. Come back from the dead 3 days later, in this human form. I mean, I know I was God all along and never really died, so not really sure what the point of this will be, but hey, ok… why not? 7. I’m pretty sure if I do all this shit, and get people to believe it, I should be able to hear their prayers again, and forgive them for their sins. I think so, anyway. I mean, I’m God so yeah, it’ll work. 8. When I get bored enough of people fucking and killing in my name again, I guess I’ll send myself/son back down again and just end it all in a big fiery blaze of glory. Just to fuck with everyone I’m going to make people think it’s going to be really soon after I do the virgin birth and sacrificing thing, but really I’m going to wait several thousand years, just to test 'em. Heheheh heh heh… It’s just crazy enough to work!!! I for one thank \*\*jesusguy \*\*for helping show us all the light, and spreading His word here on The Straight Dope. ---
**Author:** ![BigAppleBucky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigapplebucky/32/178_2.png) [@BigAppleBucky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigAppleBucky)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-message-to-all-atheists-unbelievers-and-lukewarm-christians/667164/204 "2013-08-28T21:24:03Z")
To the OP. You are completely welcome to believe whatever you want. Just don’t try to force me to go along. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-message-to-all-atheists-unbelievers-and-lukewarm-christians/667164/205 "2013-08-28T21:34:31Z")
> [@jesusguy](#): > > Jesus had to die to restore our relationship with God because sin(we’re all sinners) seperates us from God. James You are really just repeating yourself. Why did he have to die to restore our relationship with God? I don’t understand why this would be necessary. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-message-to-all-atheists-unbelievers-and-lukewarm-christians/667164/206 "2013-08-28T21:37:13Z")
> [@Princhester](#): > > You are really just repeating yourself. Why did he have to die to restore our relationship with God? I don’t understand why this would be necessary. Especially given that it was God that decided to ‘terminate’ the relationship in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-message-to-all-atheists-unbelievers-and-lukewarm-christians/667164/207 "2013-08-28T21:39:27Z")
For God so Loved Himself that He sacrificed Himself to appease Himself. ---
**Author:** ![Valteron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/f17d59/32.png) [@Valteron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Valteron)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2013, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-message-to-all-atheists-unbelievers-and-lukewarm-christians/667164/208 "2013-08-28T22:04:31Z")
[quote=“Leaffan, post:5, topic:667164”] Jesus is not coming back. In fact I’m doubtful he was even here in the first place. [QUOTE] The late, great Christopher Hitchens of all people made a strong argument that Jesus did exist, even if he was not the son of God and even if there is no God to begin with. The argument is that the gospel of Luke fabricates the story about their being a census in which everyone had to return to their home town to be taxed and counted. This would have been a ridiculous way to hold a census, and it is pretty certain that it never happened. But the Messiah has to be born in Bethlehem, so Luke comes up with a story that puts the pregnant Mary in that town when she gives birth. Now, if Jesus was 100% invention, why bother with this improbable story to explain why he was a Nazarene but was born in Bethlehem? Why not just say he was born in Bethlehem, if you are inventing the story? The only explanation is that Luke and the others were writing about a real rabbi who had lived and been crucified by the Romans around 33 A.D. ---
**Author:** ![Cumberdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8c91f0/32.png) [@Cumberdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cumberdale)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2013, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-message-to-all-atheists-unbelievers-and-lukewarm-christians/667164/209 "2013-08-29T00:07:59Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > For God so Loved Himself that He sacrificed Himself to appease Himself. And more importantly gave up a weekend. ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2013, 9:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-message-to-all-atheists-unbelievers-and-lukewarm-christians/667164/210 "2013-08-29T09:25:08Z")
> [@jesusguy](#): > > Hebrews 10:14-24 Cite means evidence. Anonymous mumbo-jumbo is not ‘evidence’. This is the Great Debates section not the IMHO one so let’s see the proof. start with proving there is a god. Then prove he’s the Christian one. Then we’ll take it from there. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2013, 10:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-message-to-all-atheists-unbelievers-and-lukewarm-christians/667164/211 "2013-08-29T10:26:38Z")
Forgive them **jesusguy** , for they know not what the hell you’re talking about. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2013, 10:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-message-to-all-atheists-unbelievers-and-lukewarm-christians/667164/212 "2013-08-29T10:39:05Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > Forgive them **jesusguy** , for they know not what the hell you’re talking about. We do. It’s just that, after countless other newbies have turned up, announced that Jesus is Lord and discovered that we’re already familiar with the guy and his story and that mentioning his name and quoting the Bible is not actually persuasive, a lot of people get a bit bored and decide to amuse themselves rather than to constructively engage. I can’t say I really blame them. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2013, 10:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-message-to-all-atheists-unbelievers-and-lukewarm-christians/667164/213 "2013-08-29T10:47:01Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > We do… \…a lot of people get a bit bored and decide to amuse themselves rather than to constructively engage. You don’t say… 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2013, 10:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-message-to-all-atheists-unbelievers-and-lukewarm-christians/667164/214 "2013-08-29T10:51:07Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > You don’t say… 😉 I do indeed. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![monavis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@monavis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monavis)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2013, 10:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-message-to-all-atheists-unbelievers-and-lukewarm-christians/667164/215 "2013-08-29T10:52:54Z")
> [@For You](#): > > You can shoot summarily on principle. Luke 19:29-35 is clear evidence that he was a horse thief, that constitutes a capital crime in some eras/regions. p If you are quoting Peter Chapter 3 He is not speaking of his return, but the world ending. ---
**Author:** ![monavis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@monavis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monavis)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2013, 10:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-message-to-all-atheists-unbelievers-and-lukewarm-christians/667164/216 "2013-08-29T10:59:21Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > Is he bringing Moses with him? > “uh-oh, here come the lepers.” Paul was speaking about the day of the Lord, not Jesus, he was referring to the end of the world. ---
**Author:** ![monavis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@monavis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monavis)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2013, 11:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-message-to-all-atheists-unbelievers-and-lukewarm-christians/667164/217 "2013-08-29T11:14:18Z")
> [@jesusguy](#): > > Sin is basically a perversion of God’s natural order. In a specific sense, stuff like adultery, and homosexuality are sins. These are all perversions of God’s natural order. He didn’t create men and women to be promiscuous, He created them to have a relationship and sex(Gen 1:28 “Be fruitful and multiply”) within the order/confines of marriage which is between one man and one woman. > > Jeremiah 32:27 says there’s NOTHING too hard for God so based on that He could easily change the rules. Why didn’t He change the rules? That’s a different story all together but Isaiah 55:8 says “For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways,” declares the LORD. God is a righteous judge and everything He does is perfect so I don’t even question Him about not “changing the rules” because I’m sure there’s a method to His “madness”. > > You’re taking the “powerful” part of the verse too literally. What it’s basically saying is that because many of have accepted jesus as their savior, they’re made righteous and that God basically hears their prayers. > > The things to consider about prayer and whether or not God answers it are what are our motives for asking and are we using wisdom in asking. If I’m broke, unemployed and bad with money, I’m not gonna pray to God to help me win the lotto and become a millionaire because that’s a unwise prayer. The smart thing to do would be to pray and ask God for the wisdom to manage your money correctly and to also ask God to help you find employment(while you also put in job applications). > > Other things to consider is that maybe what we pray for isn’t the right thing for us, or that now isn’t the right time, or that God has something better in mind. Why would an all Knowing , all loving Being need people to ask for what he knows they need, or hold back anything that he knows is good for the person or give what is harmful? He seems far less than a human parent that doesn’t make their child beg for necessities, or give them things that are harmful. I know I wouldn’t and I am far from all knowing! ---
**Author:** ![Valteron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/f17d59/32.png) [@Valteron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Valteron)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2013, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-message-to-all-atheists-unbelievers-and-lukewarm-christians/667164/218 "2013-08-29T13:50:29Z")
> [@drewtwo99](#): > > 1. Impregnate this woman with My Holy Seed, but I guess I’ll send one of my angels down first to tell her I’m about to rape her and make her carry my child. Also, she should be a virgin when this all happens, just for the lols. > . I happen to be an atheist, (polls have shown that atheists and agnostics tend to be better informed about religion generally than theists) and I would point out that Mary was NOT raped for two reasons. 1. There was no sexual penetration. The Bible does not exactly specify if the angel took out a turkey baster full of God-sperm and used it on Mary, but it is generally agreed that the insemination did not involve an actual act of sexual intercourse. 2. Mary consented. She said “Be it done unto me according to thy word.” Now, if she had refused, the God of the Bible is cruel enough to have said: "Okay you ungrateful bimbo, both your tits will fall off. But Mary nonetheless consented. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2013, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-message-to-all-atheists-unbelievers-and-lukewarm-christians/667164/219 "2013-08-29T13:58:34Z")
> [@Valteron](#): > > 1. Mary consented. How meaningful is consent when the other party is all-powerful? :dubious: A student’s consent for sex with a teacher, a patient’s consent for sex with their doctor, etc, all meaningless! ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2013, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-message-to-all-atheists-unbelievers-and-lukewarm-christians/667164/220 "2013-08-29T16:11:17Z")
> [@Valteron](#): > > I happen to be an atheist, (polls have shown that atheists and agnostics tend to be better informed about religion generally than theists) and I would point out that Mary was NOT raped for two reasons. > > 1. There was no sexual penetration. The Bible does not exactly specify if the angel took out a turkey baster full of God-sperm and used it on Mary, but it is generally agreed that the insemination did not involve an actual act of sexual intercourse. > > 2. Mary consented. She said “Be it done unto me according to thy word.” > > Now, if she had refused, the God of the Bible is cruel enough to have said: "Okay you ungrateful bimbo, both your tits will fall off. But Mary nonetheless consented. nm [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-message-to-all-atheists-unbelievers-and-lukewarm-christians/667164.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-message-to-all-atheists-unbelievers-and-lukewarm-christians/667164.md?page=12)