# A murder mystery plot twist I've never seen (possibly open spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [November 6, 2023, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-murder-mystery-plot-twist-ive-never-seen-possibly-open-spoilers/992691 "2023-11-06T14:21:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Jay\_Z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Jay\_Z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jay_Z)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2023, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-murder-mystery-plot-twist-ive-never-seen-possibly-open-spoilers/992691/21 "2023-11-06T16:39:44Z")
How about one where I, the reader or viewer, am the murderer? ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2023, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-murder-mystery-plot-twist-ive-never-seen-possibly-open-spoilers/992691/22 "2023-11-06T16:46:39Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > To be fair, Agatha Christie books include circumstances where pretty much every stock character is the murderer in one book or another: the police detective, the obnoxious kid detective, the unreliable narrator, the apparent intended victim, one of the _actual_ victims, **everybody** , random bystanders, Hercules Poirot… The butler? ---
**Author:** ![Stanislaus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stanislaus/32/3391_2.png) [@Stanislaus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stanislaus)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2023, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-murder-mystery-plot-twist-ive-never-seen-possibly-open-spoilers/992691/23 "2023-11-06T16:47:54Z")
Hey, that irascible colonel would still be alive now if you hadn’t picked up the book and started reading. You craved his death, didn’t you? And why? Not for monetary gain, not for revenge, but simply for the thrill it gave you. But not even the thrill of his death. No, he had to die simply so you could enjoy the unravelling of the mystery. You read him into an early grave out of simple boredom. You monster. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2023, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-murder-mystery-plot-twist-ive-never-seen-possibly-open-spoilers/992691/24 "2023-11-06T16:48:57Z")
There are various works of metafiction where characters “die” because they’re _not_ being read. And ones where the author is the murderer (or the victim). But the reader as murderer? That’s a challenge, unless you mean in a “Choose Your Own Adventure” way. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2023, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-murder-mystery-plot-twist-ive-never-seen-possibly-open-spoilers/992691/25 "2023-11-06T16:49:54Z")
> [@John\_DiFool](#): > > Star Trek ep. “Wolf In The Fold.” Also the case with Trek in THE UNDISCOVERED COUNTRY, when Lt. Valeris — Spock’s handpicked top-of-her-class intended replacement — leads the investigation into the murders she managed. ---
**Author:** ![TheCuse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thecuse/32/2854_2.png) [@TheCuse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheCuse)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2023, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-murder-mystery-plot-twist-ive-never-seen-possibly-open-spoilers/992691/26 "2023-11-06T16:51:11Z")
I think there were a few in TV Shows (NCIS and Castle I believe). I don’t recall the episode names. ---
**Author:** ![Dropo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ce7236/32.png) [@Dropo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dropo)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2023, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-murder-mystery-plot-twist-ive-never-seen-possibly-open-spoilers/992691/27 "2023-11-06T16:55:21Z")
> **[So Dark the Night (1946) ⭐ 6.3 | Crime, Film-Noir, Mystery](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0038958/?ref_=nm_flmg_t_145_act)** > > 1h 11m | Not Rated > **[Vidocq (2001) ⭐ 6.4 | Action, Crime, Fantasy](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0164961/?ref_=nv_sr_srsg_0_tt_7_nm_1_q_vidocq)** > > 1h 38m | R ---
**Author:** ![solost](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/solost/32/11776_2.png) [@solost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/solost)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2023, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-murder-mystery-plot-twist-ive-never-seen-possibly-open-spoilers/992691/28 "2023-11-06T16:58:09Z")
The plot of Shutter Island is very close: The protagonist is a Federal Marshall who visits an island hospital for the criminally insane to look into the disappearance of a patient who killed her three children. It’s later revealed that the protagonist was actually a patient on the island, having gone insane from guilt after killing his wife for drowning their three children. He escaped into a fantasy of being a lawman investigating a crime very similar to his own experience, and the hospital staff indulged him, thinking it might be therapeutic for him (spoiler: it wasn’t). ---
**Author:** ![eburacum45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eburacum45/32/8690_2.png) [@eburacum45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eburacum45)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2023, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-murder-mystery-plot-twist-ive-never-seen-possibly-open-spoilers/992691/29 "2023-11-06T17:06:35Z")
There must be a SciFi story where the murderer is the detective, who mind-wiped himself or herself after committing the murders, and gradually discovers that he is the killer after investigating the crimes. Anyone remember any films, TV programmes or stories like this? The plot device sounds vaguely familiar - perhaps I’ve been mind-wiped myself and forgotten it. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2023, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-murder-mystery-plot-twist-ive-never-seen-possibly-open-spoilers/992691/30 "2023-11-06T17:07:09Z")
Shouldn’t we include everybody’s favorite theory about Murder She Wrote? ---
**Author:** ![sciurophobic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cab0a1/32.png) [@sciurophobic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sciurophobic)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2023, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-murder-mystery-plot-twist-ive-never-seen-possibly-open-spoilers/992691/31 "2023-11-06T17:25:29Z")
Does _Oedipus Rex_ count? ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2023, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-murder-mystery-plot-twist-ive-never-seen-possibly-open-spoilers/992691/32 "2023-11-06T17:28:37Z")
There is also [No Way Out](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_Way_Out_(1987_film)) IIRC its a pretty unremarkable 80s spy thriller except for the twist ending. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2023, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-murder-mystery-plot-twist-ive-never-seen-possibly-open-spoilers/992691/33 "2023-11-06T17:34:09Z")
> [@eburacum45](#): > > There must be a SciFi story where the murderer is the detective, who mind-wiped himself or herself after committing the murders, and gradually discovers that he is the killer after investigating the crimes. > > Anyone remember any films, TV programmes or stories like this? The plot device sounds vaguely familiar - perhaps I’ve been mind-wiped myself and forgotten it. Memento sort of has this plot IIRC. The original murder of his wife wasn’t carried out by the protaganist, but it turns out the murder of his cop buddy (who’d been stringing him along for years to use as his own personal amnesiac hitman after he actually got revenge on his wife’s murderer, but forgot about it) was. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2023, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-murder-mystery-plot-twist-ive-never-seen-possibly-open-spoilers/992691/34 "2023-11-06T17:38:43Z")
> [@Jay\_Z](#): > > How about one where I, the reader or viewer, am the murderer? _Memento Mori_ by Jonathan Nolan gets close to that. ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2023, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-murder-mystery-plot-twist-ive-never-seen-possibly-open-spoilers/992691/35 "2023-11-06T17:46:54Z")
Similar, in a way, is [No Way Out](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_Way_Out_(1987_film)) - the detective’s boss committed the murder and and wants the detective to run a cover-up investigation…in which the false evidence points (unknowingly to the boss) to the detective himself. ---
**Author:** ![Yllaria](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yllaria/32/3452_2.png) [@Yllaria](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yllaria)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2023, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-murder-mystery-plot-twist-ive-never-seen-possibly-open-spoilers/992691/36 "2023-11-06T17:50:33Z")
> [@Stanislaus](#): > > You read him into an early grave out of simple boredom. You monster. That is nice. ---
**Author:** ![eburacum45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eburacum45/32/8690_2.png) [@eburacum45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eburacum45)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2023, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-murder-mystery-plot-twist-ive-never-seen-possibly-open-spoilers/992691/37 "2023-11-06T17:52:26Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > Memento sort of has this plot IIRC. Thanks! ---
**Author:** ![dorvann](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/df705f/32.png) [@dorvann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dorvann)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2023, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-murder-mystery-plot-twist-ive-never-seen-possibly-open-spoilers/992691/38 "2023-11-06T18:01:43Z")
One of the stories of The Simpsons Treehouse of Horror just had this basic plot last night (11/5/2023). I wonder if it inspired the question ---
**Author:** ![Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/q.q.switcheroo/32/5713_2.png) [@Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.Q.Switcheroo)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2023, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-murder-mystery-plot-twist-ive-never-seen-possibly-open-spoilers/992691/39 "2023-11-06T18:02:28Z")
> [@cmkeller](#): > > Similar, in a way, is [No Way Out](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_Way_Out_(1987_film)) - the detective’s boss committed the murder and and wants the detective to run a cover-up investigation…in which the false evidence points (unknowingly to the boss) to the detective himself. Which is the same basic plot as _The Big Clock_, of which _No Way Out_ was a remake. ---
**Author:** ![Roderick\_Femm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roderick_femm/32/14875_2.png) [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2023, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-murder-mystery-plot-twist-ive-never-seen-possibly-open-spoilers/992691/40 "2023-11-06T18:39:31Z")
There is one Christie novel where Poirot is “the detective”, but the culprit is the local detective inspector (“Hercule Poirot’s Christmas”). This one still annoys me, because the buried clues that should make it a revelation are so tenuous that the solution just seems to come out of thin air, or to require clairvoyance of some kind. I don’t mind being fooled by a clever author, but not this way. > [@StarvingButStrong](#): > > one of Agatha Christie’s novels very famously has the murderer turn out to be the detective’s sidekick > [@StarvingButStrong](#): > > I don’t see how you could possibly consider the Poirot/Hastings relationship in some of the novels as anything but ‘sidekick.’ But Hastings was never the culprit. And I am at a loss to think of any other sidekicks in any of her series books. Please, @StarvingButStrong, can you enlighten us which story this is? Unless you mean “The Murder of Roger Ackroyd” where the narrator is the culprit, and also a recent friend of Poirot during his abortive retirement? Hardly a sidekick, though. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-murder-mystery-plot-twist-ive-never-seen-possibly-open-spoilers/992691.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-murder-mystery-plot-twist-ive-never-seen-possibly-open-spoilers/992691.md?page=3)