# A mystery \[Why people accept Trump\] **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 6, 2020, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-mystery-why-people-accept-trump/847565 "2020-02-06T21:24:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![ZipperJJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zipperjj/32/211_2.png) [@ZipperJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZipperJJ)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2020, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-mystery-why-people-accept-trump/847565/61 "2020-02-07T21:33:16Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > Does he really not have the time for subtlety? Is his and his fellow Trump supporters really more busy then those of us who oppose him? In what way are their lives so much busier or more complicated than ours that they don’t take the time to understand the actual issues in sufficient detail? > > I suspect the answer isn’t a lack of time. I suspect the answer is, as you say, the desire for easy answers that don’t challenge their oversimplified view of the world. Because, as Hunter S. Thompson put it, they have been left behind by the changes they refused to embrace. Well you’re being pedantic. I was using the phrase “doesn’t have the time” in such a way to mean “does not care to spend the time to”. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2020, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-mystery-why-people-accept-trump/847565/62 "2020-02-07T22:28:01Z")
> [@ZipperJJ](#): > > Well you’re being pedantic. I was using the phrase “doesn’t have the time” in such a way to mean “does not care to spend the time to”. Am I though? They don’t care to spend the time to understand the nuance. Because doing so would require them to re-evaluate their superficial understanding of a complex topic. Not because they are too busy or have better things to do. But because they simply don’t want to risk changing their world view. ---
**Author:** ![margin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/65b543/32.png) [@margin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/margin)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2020, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-mystery-why-people-accept-trump/847565/63 "2020-02-07T23:17:56Z")
> [@penultima\_thule](#): > > It indicates just how far the liberal intelligentsia have left behind “the deplorables” over the past couple of decades. Progress may well be inevitable but you can’t leave behind a bloc that represents an electoral majority in a functioning democracy. > > In a nutshell, it’s schadenfreude. They’re NOT a majority, they just throw Dems off the rolls and gerrymander. Plus, they’re assholes who are just fine with brown people dying. They’re ignorant and hateful by choice, and they stay in a paranoid fever swamp where Fox and Alex Jones and every other Reichwing sleazebag tells them that liberals are evil, that Trump is a good Christian, that Obama is a Kenyan Muslim, that Michelle is a man, and that Melania is a great lady. They believe Sandy Hook didn’t happen but that Pizzagate did. They believe in Qanon but call the endless list of Trump’s secret meetings with Putin or Putin’s staff, his admiration of Putin, his decades of financial dealings with Russians pure fiction. They freak out if white men get treated in movies the way women usually do----off to the side as boyfriends or parents, to be fridged if the hero needs to have a montage of tortured faces for his Oscar reel. They whine at movies that aren’t all geared toward straight white teenaged boy dirtbags. They want to control womens’ uterii without knowing anything about them, and they think rape only happens at gunpoint in dark alleys. Fuck 'em. And fuck people who make excuses. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2020, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-mystery-why-people-accept-trump/847565/64 "2020-02-07T23:43:59Z")
> [@penultima\_thule](#): > > It indicates just how far the liberal intelligentsia have left behind “the deplorables” over the past couple of decades. Progress may well be inevitable but you can’t leave behind a bloc that represents an electoral majority in a functioning democracy. And by “an electoral majority” you mean “lost the popular vote despite conservatives traditionally being hella more motivated to get their minority-population butts to the polls”. ---
**Author:** ![Balthisar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/balthisar/32/2825_2.png) [@Balthisar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balthisar)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2020, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-mystery-why-people-accept-trump/847565/65 "2020-02-08T00:33:55Z")
I hate the guy and a lot of what he does. On the other hand, he doesn’t fuck up most of the stuff that matters, which shows how unimportant POTUS really is (I loved the Clinton years, because Bill didn’t really do ANYTHING, which is good). I hate the current crop of dems (and the 2016 dems) more, because they have actually evil, well-thought-out plans. Trump’s just an idiot, and I prefer an idiot in power to an actual bad person. 2020 is going to be difficult. I actually voted for a good candidate in 2016 who didn’t win; there’s no one standing out on my party’s ticket this year at all. I may just skip that part of the ballot. ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2020, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-mystery-why-people-accept-trump/847565/66 "2020-02-08T00:50:44Z")
I can’t find it now but just yesterday read a review of an old like 1950’s old book about the white working class. At that point in time the US was full of promise. They had excellent union jobs with benefits and pensions, one job to support a whole family – yet the study found that these men were nostalgic for an imagined past, and full of resentment at the educated, minorities, women – just like now, when they are supposedly angry because their ‘way of life’ is crumbling. They haven’t changed in 75 years and it seems probable to me that these resentments long predate the 1950’s as well. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2020, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-mystery-why-people-accept-trump/847565/67 "2020-02-08T00:52:55Z")
> [@Balthisar](#): > > I hate the guy and a lot of what he does. On the other hand, he doesn’t fuck up most of the stuff that matters, which shows how unimportant POTUS really is (I loved the Clinton years, because Bill didn’t really do ANYTHING, which is good). > > I hate the current crop of dems (and the 2016 dems) more, because they have actually evil, well-thought-out plans. Trump’s just an idiot, and I prefer an idiot in power to an actual bad person. > > 2020 is going to be difficult. I actually voted for a good candidate in 2016 who didn’t win; there’s no one standing out on my party’s ticket this year at all. I may just skip that part of the ballot. What is specifically “bad” and “evil” about the current crop of dems? ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2020, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-mystery-why-people-accept-trump/847565/68 "2020-02-08T00:56:33Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > What is specifically “bad” and “evil” about the current crop of dems? Or “well-thought-out”, for that matter. Seriously, I can’t think of a better demonstration that one is being fed propaganda than the idea that the dems are some kind of coherent organized group with a clear vision. Talk about a fictionalized portrayal! ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2020, 3:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-mystery-why-people-accept-trump/847565/69 "2020-02-08T03:07:29Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > I guess you’ll have to define what you mean by “decline in liberal values”. > > My thinking is that the rise in fringe (nationalism, bigotry, take-back-ism) is a backlash to the expansion and wider acceptance of liberal values. That’s how it seems on the surface; in reality, it’s a backlash against the growth of economic equality - it’s that what is making them miserable. The liberal values are the changes that they associate with their decline. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2020, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-mystery-why-people-accept-trump/847565/70 "2020-02-08T03:15:27Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > This seems true for all types of totalitarian regimes. Communism arose because of frustration by the peasants about the monarchs, the oligarchs and the bourgeoisie. Predictably, before they could establish their own laws and rules, there always has to be a revolution that includes scapegoating, killing and a burning down of all things. Invariably to their own detriment. i.e. Politics thru chaos: _Plus ça change…_ Yes and no. There is a bit difference between “discontent” and “revolt”, and yet more of a difference between “revolt” and “revolution”. For example, it’s common knowledge that in the feudal era peasants were treated like absolute shit (it’s actually not quite true or quite universal but let’s just go with that), and it’s also common knowledge that peasant uprisings were a dime a dozen. From that, we tend to assume that what the revolting peasants wanted was to depose the lords, the kings and whatnot but I haven’t actually ran into such a thing prior to the enlightenment era. Rather, they rose either to nail _this_ specific noble to a barn door\* pour encourager les autres \*; or most commonly to create enough of a stink that the local nobles/churchmen couldn’t hide it and information about their plight would reach the ears of the duke or the baron or the king himself ; which they assumed ipso facto was a good person since he was king and god wouldn’t let a bad person be king, stands to reason. He just has bad advisors/his subordinates lie to him. In other words, they didn’t try to \*overthrow \*a system which they accepted, or deemed good enough, or simply didn’t believe could ever change (and change into what ? For most of 'em it was all they knew), instead they merely objected to individual, punctual abuses of power of officials within that system. Trying to get a different, better system is one big step beyond that. But that’s not what fascists are into, either. Fascists just want to watch the system burn. There’s no plan after that. Because fascism is a death cult. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2020, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-mystery-why-people-accept-trump/847565/71 "2020-02-08T03:47:14Z")
> [@Balthisar](#): > > I hate the guy and a lot of what he does. On the other hand, he doesn’t fuck up most of the stuff that matters … Jesus fucking christ, “doesn’t fuck up … the stuff that matters”, what kind of ignorance are you living in? Do you even pay any attention to what this shitpile administration is running over roughshod? That is just goddam depressing, to realize that jello-brains like you are allowed near a ballot. ---
**Author:** ![penultima\_thule](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penultima_thule/32/3833_2.png) [@penultima\_thule](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/penultima_thule)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2020, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-mystery-why-people-accept-trump/847565/72 "2020-02-08T05:06:21Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > And by “an electoral majority” you mean “lost the popular vote despite conservatives traditionally being hella more motivated to get their minority-population butts to the polls”. I mean sufficient votes to win an election. And if you are still vexed, irked & riled about the GOP winning in 2016 because more of them voted under the agreed and understood rules of the game then there’s a line about wops, knives and a gun fight that you need to learn real quick. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2020, 5:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-mystery-why-people-accept-trump/847565/73 "2020-02-08T05:51:07Z")
> [@dasmoocher](#): > > “As democracy is perfected, the office of president represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart’s desire at last and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.” > > –HL Mencken, _Baltimore Evening Sun_ on 26 July 1920 I was about to report you for using [my prior post](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=21901204&postcount=1) without attribution. But Google shows me at least seven other Dopers provided the same quote, starting with **Der Trihs** : **Der Trihs** (way back in 2005) \*\*TreacherousCretin Jackknifed Juggernaut GreenWyvern QuickSilver asahi jayjay \*\* ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2020, 12:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-mystery-why-people-accept-trump/847565/74 "2020-02-08T12:56:27Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > I was about to report you for using [my prior post](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=21901204&postcount=1) without attribution. But Google shows me at least seven other Dopers provided the same quote, starting with **Der Trihs** : > > **Der Trihs** (way back in 2005) > \*\*TreacherousCretin > Jackknifed Juggernaut > GreenWyvern > QuickSilver > asahi > jayjay > \*\* And I’ll quote it again because it’s a damn fine post (and comment)! ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2020, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-mystery-why-people-accept-trump/847565/75 "2020-02-08T13:04:18Z")
> [@Ulfreida](#): > > I can’t find it now but just yesterday read a review of an old like 1950’s old book about the white working class. At that point in time the US was full of promise. They had excellent union jobs with benefits and pensions, one job to support a whole family – yet the study found that these men were nostalgic for an imagined past, and full of resentment at the educated, minorities, women – just like now, when they are supposedly angry because their ‘way of life’ is crumbling. They haven’t changed in 75 years and it seems probable to me that these resentments long predate the 1950’s as well. That’s the point I was trying to make: there will always be Trumpists. The question is whether the malcontents are on the edges of society or whether they become the mainstream. Despite their nostalgia for the past, there was optimism for the future. The standard of living grew, not just for whites but for pretty much everyone. Life spans were extended. But let’s not just focus on the white working class when considering the Trump problem. A lot of Trump voters have six figure incomes and money in the bank, and yet they still feel anxieties that people with lower incomes feel. Even if you’re yearly income is higher than the average person, people may suffer from age-related illnesses which pile up medical debt. Everyone knows a trip to the hospital can wipe out whatever you’ve saved, and trips to the hospital become more inevitable with time. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2020, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-mystery-why-people-accept-trump/847565/76 "2020-02-08T14:31:39Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > That’s how it seems on the surface; in reality, it’s a backlash against the growth of economic equality - it’s that what is making them miserable. The liberal values are the changes that they associate with their decline. We seem to be in vehement agreement here. They resent the democratization of economic distribution. There was a time when whites (in America) felt like they were top of the heap. They weren’t “rich” but they had minorities to look down on because minorities knew they place is the social pecking order. As that changed, with the emergence of liberal values becoming the popular norm, their relatively lower middle class economic stature was compounded by their declining social stature. Hence the MAGA-reaction. Because they are convinced that minorities are taking their jobs and liberals are telling them that they are bigots and troglodytes for being angry about it. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2020, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-mystery-why-people-accept-trump/847565/77 "2020-02-08T14:34:07Z")
> [@margin](#): > > … > > Fuck 'em. And fuck people who make excuses. This, dammit. There is no excuse anymore. It’s so fucking blatant and out in the open, that there is NO fucking excuse. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2020, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-mystery-why-people-accept-trump/847565/78 "2020-02-08T14:39:45Z")
> [@Balthisar](#): > > I hate the guy and a lot of what he does. On the other hand, he doesn’t fuck up most of the stuff that matters, which shows how unimportant POTUS really is (I loved the Clinton years, because Bill didn’t really do ANYTHING, which is good). > > I hate the current crop of dems (and the 2016 dems) more, because they have actually evil, well-thought-out plans. Trump’s just an idiot, and I prefer an idiot in power to an actual bad person. > > 2020 is going to be difficult. I actually voted for a good candidate in 2016 who didn’t win; there’s no one standing out on my party’s ticket this year at all. I may just skip that part of the ballot. I realize that coming out against the liberal p.o.v. on this board is not easy. But it doesn’t help your side to post drive-bys like this without a willingness to discuss your position. You seem to have some very strong opinions on things, and fair enough. But are you willing to discuss them or are you simply going to be just another example of someone who wants simple answers because he “doesn’t have the time” for the nuanced conversation? ---
**Author:** ![MikeF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@MikeF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MikeF)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2020, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-mystery-why-people-accept-trump/847565/79 "2020-02-08T14:50:18Z")
I think that greed/selfishness is at the heart of it. The historical “haves” (people like me -white males) see their inherent advantages being eroded by the party that, ostensibly, represents the “have nots”. There is only so much pie to go around and the only way to give the other guy a bigger slice is to take some from me. (And that’s probably true, to a certain extent.) Any change by the Dems is not going to make things better for the haves. They like the status quo. They long for the good old days when minorities knew their place and will vote for anyone who promises to get them there. People defending their stuff will normally be more passionate about defending it than those trying to take it. Until they are not. That’s what’s called a revolution and we are long way from that. Most of my co-workers (white males) are Trump supporters. Some are hard-core Trumpers and others are just anti-liberal. The hard-core Trumpers have said that they don’t care about his character or lying. “The economy is booming! I feel safer! (I don’t get that one) We’ve been taken advantage of by other countries forever and Trump is kicking their ass!” When we talk about politics, which is rare, the Trumpers resort to his tactics - yelling, name calling etc. I tell them that Trump is a con man, they have been conned and the victim of a good con man will never admit it. Hell, he won’t even see it. I’m resigned to another Trump term in office. Once again, the Dems are failing to come up with a candidate that can calm the fears of the haves while uniting the have nots. Maybe that’s a “mission impossible” these days. BTW, I’m a life-long registered Pub but now find the party repugnant, for the most part. I can vote for either party in the primaries so party affiliation is pretty much meaningless. As an aside, I find an interesting contradiction among some of Trumper friends. Many are avid outdoorsmen and love to hunt, fish, hike etc. These are their primary hobbies and, for some, it is a way of life. They are scared to death that the Dems are coming for their guns but fail to see what is happening to the environment they claim to love as a result of global warming, easing of environmental regulations etc. Which is another common trait of Trumpers - shortsightedness. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2020, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-mystery-why-people-accept-trump/847565/80 "2020-02-08T15:02:06Z")
> [@penultima\_thule](#): > > I mean sufficient votes to win an election. > > And if you are still vexed, irked & riled about the GOP winning in 2016 because more of them voted under the agreed and understood rules of the game then there’s a line about wops, knives and a gun fight that you need to learn real quick. You act like these rules just happened and it’s something both parties have to live with. Which is nonsense. The Republicans are rigging the system so they can steal elections. And the result of stealing elections is that they have the power to write the laws and declare what they’re doing is legal. Donald Trump is not the real problem. The real problem is a political system that gave Donald Trump the presidency. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-mystery-why-people-accept-trump/847565.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-mystery-why-people-accept-trump/847565.md?page=5)