Point taken. Truth be told, I’ll probably just take whatever he offers, unless it’s insulting. The net loss to me (assuming this doesn’t significantly affect my resale value or get me into trouble with my town) is that I have less to mow.
The main issue with this, in my mind, is that the realtor is then working for the neighbor and has their best interests in mind, not necessarily yours. To that point, if the neighbor’s realtor then comes to you with a supposedly “fair” offer, you don’t have to take it. As I said upthread, the neighbor should expect to pay above market rate for this, not necessarily what is “fair.” (And what is “fair” is in the eye of the beholder regardless.)
Do you have a mortgage? I’m guessing the bank would be extremely interested in any actions which lower the value of their collateral.
Nope, owned free and clear.
Not quite the same situation, but there was a person in Rhode Island a few years ago who bought the empty lot next to theirs, then subdivided it so they could add a garage on their own property.
Unfortunately for them, the Town then changed the rules on minimum lot sizes to build a house. Existing houses were grandfathered, but this property was vacant, and so the smaller lot became a non-buildable lot, causing its value to plummet.
The owner then sold the lot. The new owner—who knowingly bought a non-buildable lot at a bargain-basement price—was sure they could get an exemption from the town. They couldn’t. They were not happy. They sued the Town and lost, then cut down all of the trees and painted the stumps garish colors to protest, which made the news.
Speaking from Australia, with probably very different land law fundamentals, while our realtors normally buy and sell property and houses, they are not licensed or technically equipped to subdivide land. That domain belongs to surveyors. All changes to the cadastre (the pattern of land subdivision which legally describe what you own) is registered by a central authority, and has to be millimetre accurate. The authority that controls land registers is unlikely to accept the new shape of the lots and their adjusted boundary unless it is fully described by surveyors and an expert statement that it complies with any relevant regulations as mentioned above. Any other encumbrances such as rights of way for utility access need to be spelled out in the new land titles, and those bodies may even have a chance to object to the change.
A realtor / real estate agent may act on your behalf, but they will not necessarily have the competence to get you through this unscathed.
I’d be telling your neighbour to go away. Then, if he’s serious, he’ll be back in 12 months with a firmer offer to pay for all the costs, and something more than a strictly pro rata / square feet price. After all, you will have a smaller block that is now too small for an extra garage as your minimum future cost.
How big is your city lot? What percentage of your lot would you lose from this? Moving the line by 36+ feet seems like a lot to me. Once you have a smaller lot, it might be harder to sell in the future. And it reduces what you and future owners can build on it. I don’t know that I would consider this unless I really needed the money at this moment. If I did sell part of my lot, it would be for several multiples over what the fractional value of that part was worth. That would be to account for any headaches and hassles I might encounter in the future.
I would build a garage on my land and rent it to the neighbor, provided he was willing to pay enough rent. The problem with dividing the land and making your lot smaller is that a prospective buyer for your property won’t have the room to build a garage if he wanted. He would rather pay more for the house next door that has a bigger lot and a garage already. If it were me, I would tell the neighbor no to the deal.
This. Check with your municipality, whether it’s a city or a town or something else. You probably aren’t allowed to create a nonconforming lot; and there may be a procedure to go through; though it may be pretty simple.
Only for the condition currently existing. You won’t be grandfathered for the change in condition you’d be creating by moving the property line.
I’m on a planning board in a poor, rural town. Here you’d need our board’s approval for a lot line adjustment, and you wouldn’t get it if the change created a nonconforming lot or screwed up your setbacks; not unless you first got an area variance from a different board, the Zoning Board of Appeals. The rules for area variances are pretty strict. If both lots and the setbacks would remain conforming, the process would be quite simple.
Different areas do indeed have different rules. But don’t assume that just because you’re down a dirt road in poor rural county your area has no such rules. They might not, but they probably do.
I wouldn’t count on the realtor to check. They probably ought to, but they sometimes don’t. There’s a certain amount of caveat emptor concerned, or in your case caveat seller.
Which may include a signature from the relevant municipal board.
Another issue here is that your neighbor will presumably continue to be your neighbor, either way. If you really don’t mind transferring the area, and it turns out to cause no legal problems to do so, then the neighborly thing for you to do is to sell it; at a fair but not exorbitant price. A happy neighbor is an advantage not to be sneezed at; and a neighborhood reputation for being reasonable to deal with is also good. They can only buy it from you, but you can’t very well sell it to anybody else, either. I agree that they should cover expenses.
Do we know that? I don’t think we know the size or layout of @HeyHomie’s lot.
I would not do this. I would definitely not do this by relying on a realtor’s word. This is way outside a realtor’s area of expertise.
First, I’m going to preface that my experience is solely in California, and the laws and terms may different where you are. You’ll need a lot line adjustment. To get that, you’ll need a new map prepared by a licensed land surveyor. After you have the map, you’ll need to take it to whatever government agency handles this sort of thing to get it approved and to change their official maps. The licensed land surveyor can probably advise you and your neighbor where to go, who to talk to, what it might cost, and how long it might typically take. How you pay for that is up to you and the buyer, but as others have noted, since you wouldn’t be doing any of this if the neighbor had not approached you, it only seems fair that the neighbor foot the entire bill, including whatever the licensed land surveyor charges for advice and guidance provided, inspection and permit fees, and any other associated costs.
Now for a cautionary tale. In the late 1960s, my grandparents owned a double lot in Palo Alto, CA. On one lot, there was their tiny house, a 2 bedroom, 1 bath place that was probably 900-1000sf, tops. The other lot was a pretty large vegetable garden and an unpermitted dwelling unit (it was originally a storage outbuilding that had gotten enclosed and turned into a 2-room dwelling we called “the shed”). Their next door neighbor on the side adjacent to the garden asked if they could buy about 15 feet off the garden property so they could turn their 1-car carport into a 2-car garage, and they needed a little more room to do it. My grandparents didn’t have a problem with selling them 15 feet, so my dad and uncle, both licensed civil engineers (their licenses permitted them to do surveys, too) drew up maps and took care of the details for my grandparents and their neighbors. The maps were approved, my grandparents were paid, the neighbors built a garage, and everybody was happy. Fast forward about 25 years, and this neighborhood had gone through a tremendous transformation. It was originally nothing but small homes of 1000-1500sf on relatively small lots, probably averaging about 6000sf. But by the mid-1990s, demand for houses soared, values skyrocketed, and tech immigrants were buying two adjacent lots to knock down the existing homes and build McMansions. A single lot commanded prices close to seven figures. A double lot was even more.
When my grandmother finally moved, she sold her property for something like $1.2M. Had it been a true double lot, though, she might have gotten over $2M. Selling 15 feet cost her a ton of money.
Unless you really need the money, I would not do it.
Your cautionary tale is appreciated, but the amount of money that’s going to change hands in this transaction is pennies in comparison. The insured value of my house is like $265k and that’s only because the insurance agent strongly cautioned me against going lower. If I sold my house (and lot based on current boundaries) today I might clear $150k. Unless gold or crude oil are found on the property, there’s no scenario in which it or the land are going to appreciate that dramatically. It’s a poor Ozark Mountain town for a reason.
In an hour or so I’ll have pics.
Hooray for @thorny_locust !
The Dope always comes through w a relevant expert. Plus the usual assortment of decent folks w some adjacent experience or knowledge.
Got it. Completely different set of circumstances. OTOH, Jed Clampett didn’t think he’d strike it rich either, did he?
So to answer your question more succinctly, if your neighbor wants it, he should pay all the freight. You’re not benefiting from the changed lot lines, so why should you have to share the cost? And do not rely just on the word of a realtor.
The question you need to answer is “how much less will I’ll be able to sell my house for, if the lot is this much smaller?” That answer is the marginal cost to you, and the absolute minimum you should ask for. You’d probably want to put a premium (think 50% or 100%, if not more) over that to cover unforeseen inconveniences and other risks.
And to make explicit: the buyer should cover all transaction costs, including surveys, fees, permits, etc.
This should be another thread, but you are probably WAY overinsured. Insurance is primarily to cover replacement of the improvements. If your house gets wiped out - tornado, fire, flood - you’ll still have the land, which retains some value. So let’s say your lot is worth $50k of that $150k. You’d only need to have insurance for the replacement cost of $100k worth of improvements. Unless, that is, you’re also covering contents worth a lot (eg collectible cars, antique firearms, an original signed copy of the Declaration of Independence, etc).
Thanks. But I’m not an expert on land use laws in the Ozarks. It’s possible that where @HeyHomie is there aren’t any. But it’s still a really good idea to check. A lot of places that had no land use regulations twenty years ago have them now — often developed after something unpleasant got built in the next town over. Once construction’s started, or even somewhat earlier in the process, you can’t retroactively ban whatever it is that’s screwing up all the neighbors; but you may be able to stop the next mess, or at least get some control over design and location.
It costs way more to build a replacement house than the existing one is likely to be worth on the market.
This is the east end of Case Homie, the interested neighbor is further east, and down the hill
This is the space betwixt our houses, mine on the right (you can just barely see the eastern edge), his on the left (that’s his carport on the west side of his house).
Mine is bounded by green. My house isn’t exactly in the middle, as the dot might indicate.
Map to follow.
I’m #59, my neighbor is #63. Where his car is parked, effectively you just draw a straight line, parallel to his bumper, towards to G in Google Maps. That’s the boundary of my property. He wants to buy approximately from that line to the corner of my outbuilding.
Viburnum, Iron County, Missouri.
And no, I don’t care who knows my name or where I live. I’ve no enemies here nor any deranged fans.
Yes, exactly this, I was just getting ready to post a similar response.
It looks like you have a double lot and he has a single lot. As mentioned above, there could be advantages at some point to having a true double lot. One option could be to just give him a patch of your lot which is just the minimum he needs to extend his garage. So rather than transferring the whole side of your lot, just transfer the corner, like this:
