# A Perfectly Reasonable Amount of Schadenfreude about Things Happening to Trump & His Enablers (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 14, 2020, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537 "2020-11-14T00:09:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 293
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2022, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/5847 "2022-07-07T23:53:04Z")
While I can completely believe that Trump had his adversaries audited by the IRS, because it is one of the things that he personally fears most, so thinks it’s a nice weapon to unleash on others, comma, I wish people would stop placing Comey in the “Trump Adversary” category. That fucking prick Comey had more to do with getting Trump elected in the first place than even Putin did. ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2022, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/5848 "2022-07-07T23:56:38Z")
Statistics _and_ projection-bingo all in one post brought a tear of joy to this weary soul. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2022, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/5849 "2022-07-08T01:15:10Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > I wish people would stop placing Comey in the “Trump Adversary” category. How about “Trump patsy”? ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2022, 4:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/5850 "2022-07-08T04:29:02Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > Your calculation would be correct if those two people were identified specifically a priori as the only potential targets but they are two among a multitude of people who Trump has a grudge against. For example if instead of Comey and McCabe it had been Hunter Biden and Alexander Vindman, that also would have set off the same alarm bells. So in order to properly compute how unlikely it is you would have to calculate how likely it would be that any two or more of Trumps enemies list would be audited. Which would inflate the probability by a factor of about (N^2)/2 where N is the number of Trump enemies at least as significant as McCabe and Comey, > > Even with this additional factor its going to be pretty unlikely so your general point probably holds, but miscalculation is used all the time by those trying to lie with statistics (Republicans in particular) and we need to be better than that. One thing which may matter in these calculations is that Comey and Mccabe _had the same job_: Director of the FBI. Would that change the odds at all? ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2022, 6:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/5851 "2022-07-08T06:52:38Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > But for _two_ DOJ men who both happened to be on Trump’s Enemies List, the odds of these audits happening by chance (not by malfeasance) would be–the product of the odds of just one of them? So 1 in 900,000,000? Here is a current (July 7) article in New York Times discussion the statistical chances of this, in some mathematical detail: > **[How Unlikely Is It That the Audits of Comey and McCabe Were a Coincidence? A...](https://www.nytimes.com/2022/07/07/upshot/comey-mccabe-tax-audits.html)** > > The chances are minuscule. But minuscule is not zero. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2022, 11:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/5852 "2022-07-08T11:12:57Z")
> [@Senegoid](#): > > Here is a current (July 7) article in New York Times discussion the statistical chances of this, in some mathematical detail: As several of the comments on that article point out, the article implicitly assumes that there aren’t any other Trump enemies who “just happened” to get an invasive audit. To do a proper analysis requires a cross-check of an enemies list (admittedly fuzzy around the edges, but constrained by the criterion “people who annoyed Trumpelthinskin sufficiently that he remembers who they are”) against the invasive audit list. EDIT: One possible way to objectively make an enemies list is to comb his late lamentable Twitter account for personal denunciations. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2022, 11:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/5853 "2022-07-08T11:33:42Z")
I have no doubt at all that Trump himself is entirely capable of ordering the IRS to target somebody for his own retaliatory purposes and that he’d be very happy to do so. I have reservations, though, which revolve around uncertainty in how, exactly, this would be accomplished. How does he issue the order? To whom? And then how does that person relay the command? What is the exact line of communication? Are there procedural rules to prevent this kind of abuse? How would those rules be circumvented? Would doing so leave any kind of a records trail, whether explicit or implicit? And so on, and so on. Alternatively, is this more of a “troublesome priest” situation where a mid-level apparatchik takes it upon himself to impose the audits, without explicit direction, with the plan of reaching out later to the White House and claiming this as a bona fide of loyalty in a request for reward or promotion? Basically, I’m not prepared to accept this as anything more than a rumor without more concrete corroboration of the logistical details. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2022, 11:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/5854 "2022-07-08T11:38:26Z")
> [@Cervaise](#): > > Basically, I’m not prepared to accept this as anything more than a rumor I don’t see how that works, unless you don’t believe that 1)the audits actually occurred and/or 2)it is highly improbable that two people who both happen to be on Cheato’s shit list would both be selected for a one-in-tens-of-thousands audit. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2022, 12:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/5855 "2022-07-08T12:32:24Z")
What I mean is, I am withholding any belief that the audits were a result of Trump’s direct intervention, for the reasons I laid out. As I mentioned, a “troublesome priest” kind of scenario feels more plausible, unless and until somebody can explain exactly how a president can exert influence over on-the-ground IRS activity without tripping the flags that are intended to prevent such interference. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2022, 12:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/5856 "2022-07-08T12:42:31Z")
That’s possible. Not very smart, given that his go-to solution to any problem is to throw somebody under the bus, but not being very smart is hardly a disqualification for MAGA acolytes or wannabes. ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2022, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/5857 "2022-07-08T15:22:30Z")
> [@Cervaise](#): > > I have no doubt at all that Trump himself is entirely capable of ordering the IRS to target somebody for his own retaliatory purposes and that he’d be very happy to do so. Unless it was one of his twitter spasms, that’s not how Oranganus was raised. He have someone else order the audits. He could dodge the direct association while still delivering the message. Your basic Mob Boss move. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2022, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/5858 "2022-07-08T15:27:23Z")
Yes, but then it gets extemely complicated, because you would have to define, the level of connection. Like in the example I gave both Hunter Biden and Vindman were associated with the Ukraine impeachment, is that the same level of closeness? Ideally what you want it the set of pairs of people that are high enough on Trumps enemies list and connected close enough that having them audited in this way would be suspicious enough to make it on to the national news. This set is very ill defined. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2022, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/5859 "2022-07-08T15:36:02Z")
> [@smithsb](#): > > He could dodge the direct association while still delivering the message. Your basic Mob Boss move. Very much this. “Hey, the a-holes are talking about releasing my tax returns while I’m under audit. Wonder how that so-and-so Comey would like getting audited. Now where’s that bronzer” ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2022, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/5860 "2022-07-08T15:38:06Z")
> **[Brett Kavanaugh Denied American Right to Finish Dessert at Steakhouse in Peace](https://jezebel.com/brett-kavanaugh-denied-american-right-to-finish-dessert-1849156756)** > > A group of terrible, "unruly" protesters ruined Kavanaugh's meal at Morton's, violating his most basic constitutional right to eat surf 'n' turf in public. The commentary in this article is a ripping good thrashing of this man and those other complicit justices. Fucker Carlson will be outraged. Perhaps we should be above the fray, show some decorum, try to find common ground. Nah, the Reich-wingers won’t, they’ll lie and cheat and bellow “we’re victims”. Brass knuckles. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2022, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/5861 "2022-07-08T16:37:33Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > Ideally what you want it the set of pairs of people that are high enough on Trumps enemies list and connected close enough that having them audited in this way would be suspicious enough to make it on to the national news. This set is very ill defined. Definitely includes the two people in question, though. Don’t forget Trump took away McCabe’s pension! > **[Ex-FBI leader Andrew McCabe wins back pension in Justice Dept. settlement...](https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/legal-issues/andrew-mccabe-fbi-settlement-pension/2021/10/14/81502504-2d3f-11ec-985d-3150f7e106b2_story.html)** > > McCabe approved the FBI’s Trump-Russia probe and briefly succeeded James B. Comey, and was dismissed hours before his retirement in March 2018. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2022, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/5862 "2022-07-08T16:39:27Z")
> [@smithsb](#): > > The commentary in this article is a ripping good thrashing of this man and those other complicit justices Definitely chuckled at the ‘so he aborted his dinner via a back ally connection’ line. ---
**Author:** ![SingleMalt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/singlemalt/32/3961_2.png) [@SingleMalt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SingleMalt)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2022, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/5863 "2022-07-08T19:45:26Z")
You touched on something I was wondering about, seeing as it’s been years since I’ve messed with combinations. From just some back of the envelope calculations, if Trump’s enemies list has 100 names, then picking two off of that list would have odds of about 1/90,000. If a third person turns up, however, the odds jump to about 1/28,000,000 (assuming a 1/30,000 chance of being audited). (100/30,000 times 99/30,000 (times 98/30,000)). Do I have this correct? I wonder if anyone else is going to be revealed. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2022, 12:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/5864 "2022-07-09T12:45:43Z")
Roy Moore, Trump Enabler, loses like a loser to Sacha Baron Cohen in court. > **[Sacha Baron Cohen defeats $95 million defamation suit filed by Roy Moore](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/arts/sacha-baron-cohen-defeats-95-million-defamation-suit-filed-by-roy-moore)** > > Cohen defeated a $95 million defamation lawsuit by former Alabama Supreme Court Chief Justice Roy Moore, who said he was tricked into an humiliating television appearance that lampooned sexual misconduct accusations against him. “For far too long the American people have been subjected to the antics of Sasha Baron Cohen. His pusillanimous and fraudulent conduct must be stopped. We will appeal,” the couple said in a statement texted to The Associated Press." ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2022, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/5865 "2022-07-09T16:25:06Z")
Yes, but he might be in trouble if paedophiles sue him for associating them with Roy Moore. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2022, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/5866 "2022-07-09T19:18:55Z")
What they really mean is “for far too long Americans have been subjected to the consequences of the First Amendment and to the high standards that public figures must meet to prove defamation, especially when they are actual pedophiles and sexual predators, and twice removed from the bench for judicial misconduct.” Not sure what Moore thinks he’s going to appeal or on what grounds. This is already an appeals court judgment upholding a lower court decision siding with Sacha Baron Cohen. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537.md?page=292) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537.md?page=294)