# A Perfectly Reasonable Amount of Schadenfreude about Things Happening to Trump & His Enablers (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 14, 2020, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537 "2020-11-14T00:09:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 438
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/8747 "2023-02-02T15:23:44Z")
> [@ParallelLines](#): > > Somehow, authoritarians (mostly, but not exclusively republican) spend all their time on the first three words More like six, I’d say. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/8748 "2023-02-02T15:25:58Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > I will use my Kung Fu only in self-defense and defense of others. Did you ever say, ‘I will use my King Fu only for niceness, instead of evil’? ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/8749 "2023-02-02T15:26:47Z")
> [@ParallelLines](#): > > I would have _fewer_ issues with the pledge of allegiance if people focused on the merits of the last part, and not just the first part. > > “I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.” My problem with it is, why pledge allegiance _to a flag?_ The flag itself means nothing, and this just leads to the fetishzation of the flag that’s rampant in the US, where the symbol has become more important than the principles it symbolizes. Pledge allegiance to the ideas of the United States, not some flag that’s been edited every time a new state joins up. This pledge just lets people get away with the easy part of flag-waving, while ignoring the hard part of actually living up to the principles the US was founded upon. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/8750 "2023-02-02T15:29:29Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > My problem with it is, why pledge allegiance _to a flag?_ - The next line is…“and to the republic for which it stands.” I do agree we don’t live up to the principles we claim to have. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/8751 "2023-02-02T15:29:30Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > Pledge allegiance to the ideas of the United States, not some flag that’s been edited every time a new state joins up. In fairness, that’s the second part. “And to the republic for which it stands.” The pledge acknowledges that the flag is a representative stand-in for the nation. But performative patriotism is garbage no matter the verbiage. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/8752 "2023-02-02T15:41:14Z")
The second phrase is the only part of the pledge I agree with. That’s why I refuse to stand when they read/lead the pledge over the intercom every Monday & Friday. Over the years I’ve noticed more and more of my students refusing to stand as well. Empty words for empty heads, I guess. Which is the definition of “indoctrination.” ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/8753 "2023-02-02T16:27:14Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > The second phrase is the only part of the pledge I agree with. That’s why I refuse to stand when they read/lead the pledge over the intercom every Monday & Friday. Over the years I’ve noticed more and more of my students refusing to stand as well. My kid told me she didn’t stand up and pledge because she didn’t see the point; she didn’t say it forcefully, or as if taking a principled stand: just a low-key, matter-of-fact not-going-along-with-this, because, wait, what _is_ this? _Pledging allegiance to a flag? Under god? Seriously, what are you talking about?_ ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/8754 "2023-02-02T16:33:58Z")
> [@Johnny\_Bravo](#): > > But performative patriotism is garbage no matter the verbiage. People like to say that “there is more that unites us that divides us” as Americans. But when a sizable portion of our country think pledging allegiance is a good idea (and mandatory at that) I really don’t know what to say. I can’t understand how we can find any common ground, since that world view is so alien to me. It’s one thing to mindlessly carry on a bizarre tradition, but to actively advocate that we keep doing it, expand it, and require it, requires a personality that is fundamentally at odds with our greatest traditions of freedom and personal autonomy. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/8755 "2023-02-02T16:40:39Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > but to actively advocate that we keep doing it, expand it, and require it, requires a personality that is fundamentally at odds with our greatest traditions of freedom and personal autonomy. I’m not inherently opposed to patriotic displays when they make sense. Singing the anthem at a ball game is a nice communal experience. Patriotism isn’t automatically bad! It’s just an acknowledgement of “us-ness” and it can enrich a community. Patriotism is about celebrating the things that bind us together, y’know? But it gets ugly as hell when it bleeds into jingoism and nationalism and becomes “us, **not them.** ” That’s what the coldly calculated mercenary performative nonsense is. That’s what happens when you require it, or punish people for doing it ‘wrong,’ or do any number of cynical displays. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/8756 "2023-02-02T16:44:18Z")
> [@Johnny\_Bravo](#): > > Singing the anthem at a ball game is a nice communal experience. We can agree to disagree about that. But the Pledge is 1000 times worse in my book. It smacks of authoritarianism. The National Anthem at a ball game just feels out of place. Not the same thing at all. I guess we should let this hijack go. Back to Schadenfreude! ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/8757 "2023-02-02T16:47:05Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > We can agree to disagree about that. Are we allowed to do that in the pit? ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/8758 "2023-02-02T16:53:53Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > I guess we should let this hijack go. Are we allowed to do that in the pit? ---
**Author:** ![wguy123](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wguy123/32/3161_2.png) [@wguy123](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wguy123)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/8759 "2023-02-02T17:00:13Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > The National Anthem at a ball game just feels out of place. I agree. Why don’t we sing it before the opera starts? Why don’t we sing it before Old Faithful erupts? ---
**Author:** ![Guest-starring\_Id](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guest-starring_id/32/21736_2.png) [@Guest-starring\_Id](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guest-starring_Id)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/8760 "2023-02-02T17:03:11Z")
…or just before AxCx takes the stage. Sure, this derail’s probably done . 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/8761 "2023-02-02T17:06:59Z")
> [@wguy123](#): > > Why don’t we sing it before the opera starts? An opera singer could at least hit that high note. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/8762 "2023-02-02T17:56:52Z")
> [@Johnny\_Bravo](#): > > I’m not inherently opposed to patriotic displays when they make sense. Singing the anthem at a ball game is a nice communal experience. I’m not sure what makes sense about that. Sure, there’s a communal experience, but that can be had by singing “Take me out to the ball game.” What does football have to do with patriotism? ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/8763 "2023-02-02T18:00:08Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > What does football have to do with patriotism? I thought of something worse. I don’t know when it started but assholes have decided that it’s fun to chant “USA! USA!” at the strangest times. I think they even did it when McCarthy was finally elected Speaker of the House. Personally, I’m not a fan of any chanting (not even LOCK HIM UP) but repeating the name of our country doesn’t help me remember where I am in the world. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/8764 "2023-02-02T18:07:26Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > What does football have to do with patriotism? Football **is** America. _In football, during the game in the stands, you can be sure that at least twenty-seven times you’re capable of taking the life of a fellow human being._ - George Carlin ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/8765 "2023-02-02T18:10:10Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > I don’t know when it started but assholes have decided that it’s fun to chant “USA! USA!” at the strangest times. In sports, it often is actually meant as “You suck ass!” At least in high school sports, that’s usually the reason for the chant. May have been the prompt for McCarthy, too. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2023, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537/8766 "2023-02-02T18:25:32Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > We can agree to disagree about that. But the Pledge is 1000 times worse in my book. It smacks of authoritarianism. The National Anthem at a ball game just feels out of place. Not the same thing at all. Yeah, an anthem is mostly a statement of celebrating a country, or respect. It doesn’t place an obligation on you, and you don’t even have to sing it if you don’t want, you can just listen as someone else sings it. But the pledge of allegiance? You have to actively _take_ a pledge, and taking a pledge imposes at least some degree of moral burden upon you, which should never be mandatory for regular citizens. I’m kind of okay with elected officials reciting a pledge every now and then, in hopes that it will remind them that they have duties to the nation beyond those of regular citizens, but doing it every day is a bit over the top. Multiple times a day is just nuts. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537.md?page=437) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-perfectly-reasonable-amount-of-schadenfreude-about-things-happening-to-trump-his-enablers-part-1/925537.md?page=439)