# A possible breakthrough regarding Alzheimer's **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [January 27, 2019, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-breakthrough-regarding-alzheimers/828495 "2019-01-27T21:00:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Flyer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/flyer/32/7298_2.png) [@Flyer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flyer)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2019, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-breakthrough-regarding-alzheimers/828495/1 "2019-01-27T21:00:23Z")
I’m a little surprised that nobody has posted this yet. Obviously, more research will have to be done. But if this finding holds up, this could very well be a true turning point in dealing with Alzheimer’s. > [@](#): > > If you bled when you brushed your teeth this morning, you might want to get that seen to. We may finally have found the long-elusive cause of Alzheimer’s disease: Porphyromonas gingivalis, the key bacteria in chronic gum disease. > > That’s bad, as gum disease affects around a third of all people. But the good news is that a drug that blocks the main toxins of P. gingivalis is entering major clinical trials this year, and research published today shows it might stop and even reverse Alzheimer’s. There could even be a vaccine. > **[We may finally know what causes Alzheimer’s – and how to stop it](https://www.newscientist.com/article/2191814-we-may-finally-know-what-causes-alzheimers-and-how-to-stop-it/)** > > Evidence is growing that a bacteria involved in gum disease causes Alzheimer's, raising hopes over new kinds of treatments that are currently undergoing testing > [@](#): > > Tests on mice confirmed the bacteria, Porphyromonas gingivalis could migrate from the mouth to the brain and that a toxic protein they secrete (gingipain) destroyed brain neurons. > > The bacteria also boosted production of amyloid beta, a component of brain plaques associated with Alzheimer’s, BBC News reported. > > Further tests on mice showed that drugs that block the toxic proteins produced by the bacteria stopped brain degeneration. > **[The Basics of Alzheimer's Disease](https://www.webmd.com/alzheimers/understanding-alzheimers-disease-basics)** > > WebMD provides an overview of Alzheimer's disease and what causes it. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2019, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-breakthrough-regarding-alzheimers/828495/2 "2019-01-27T21:25:43Z")
Little surprised? Well lots of us are jaded: we constantly hear of incredible medical breakthroughs–but which don’t end up amounting to much if anything. ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2019, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-breakthrough-regarding-alzheimers/828495/3 "2019-01-27T21:29:37Z")
The relationship between guts (or the digestive system overall), bacteria and inflammation and various diseases including neural ones like Alzheimer’s and Parkinsons is intensely being studied. So this is only a bit of surprise: mouth not intestines. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2019, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-breakthrough-regarding-alzheimers/828495/4 "2019-01-28T01:11:48Z")
Mice are not people. They make nice preliminary models for working out some basic principles on mammals, but perhaps about 1 out of 1000 announcements about breakthroughs using mice end up having a glimmer of applicability for humans. It’s good we’re learning more; we’ve got to figure out the details to hope to find solutions for these very complex problems. But this is a looong ways from being certain about any clinical relevancy for us humans. ---
**Author:** ![jasg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f0a364/32.png) [@jasg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jasg)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2019, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-breakthrough-regarding-alzheimers/828495/5 "2019-01-28T03:31:25Z")
There is also this interesting research - about a toxin, BMAA found in Cyanobacteria and a [theory linking the BMAA toxin and neurological disease.](http://fortune.com/longform/alzheimers-disease-cure-breakthrough/) ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2019, 12:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-breakthrough-regarding-alzheimers/828495/6 "2019-01-28T12:35:42Z")
> [@ftg](#): > > The relationship between guts (or the digestive system overall), bacteria and inflammation and various diseases including neural ones like Alzheimer’s and Parkinsons is intensely being studied. > > So this is only a bit of surprise: mouth not intestines. Actually, it’s not really a surprise about the mouth, either. A link between gingivitis and Alzheimers has been suggested before, several years ago, in fact.[sup]1[/sup] This is confirmational evidence, although it doesn’t make it absolutely certain. [sup]1[/sup] My cite here is an [article](https://www.sciencenews.org/article/gum-disease-opens-body-host-infections) from 2016 in _Science News_, but unfortunately, you have to be a subscriber to access it online. ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2019, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-breakthrough-regarding-alzheimers/828495/7 "2019-01-28T15:31:21Z")
> [@Flyer](#): > > I’m a little surprised that nobody has posted this yet. I was going to, but I forgot. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2019, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-breakthrough-regarding-alzheimers/828495/8 "2019-01-28T16:48:34Z")
I’d hope this leads somewhere important, but I’ve also gotten wary of “this is the answer” breakthroughs. I remember when (not too many years ago) there was a wildly enthusiastic thread here about the cause of MS being distended neck veins, which could be fixed and MS greatly improved or cured through surgery. Didn’t pan out. > [@Gatopescado](#): > > I was going to, but I forgot. You are a bad man. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2019, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-breakthrough-regarding-alzheimers/828495/9 "2019-01-28T19:21:29Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > I remember when (not too many years ago) there was a wildly enthusiastic thread here about the cause of MS being distended neck veins, which could be fixed and MS greatly improved or cured through surgery. Didn’t pan out. I recall that thread, but can’t presently find it. could you summon up a link to assist my fading memory? ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2019, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-breakthrough-regarding-alzheimers/828495/10 "2019-01-28T19:37:54Z")
[Multiple Sclerosis - Liberation Treatment](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=540940) The new study mentioned in post #133, although it was 2 years old by that point. ---
**Author:** ![rat\_avatar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rat_avatar/32/255_2.png) [@rat\_avatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rat_avatar)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2019, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-breakthrough-regarding-alzheimers/828495/11 "2019-01-28T19:55:26Z")
After 30 years of “breakthroughs” with MS as my dad suffered more and more I have become skeptical about these claims but in this case I think that waiting for the clinical trials to be completed will be interesting to see. [http://advances.sciencemag.org/content/5/1/eaau3333/tab-pdf](http://advances.sciencemag.org/content/5/1/eaau3333/tab-pdf) > [@](#): > > In conclusion, we have designed an orally bioavailable, brainpenetrant Kgp inhibitor currently being tested in human clinical studies for AD. The present data indicate that treatment with a potent and selective Kgp inhibitor will reduce P. gingivalis infection in the brain and slow or prevent further neurodegeneration and accumulation of pathology in AD patients As there are already almost 400 papers on [Porphyromonas gingivalis](https://scholar.google.com/scholar?as_ylo=2019&q=Porphyromonas+gingivalis&hl=en&as_sdt=0,48) in 2019 claiming it is the cause of everything form cancer to AD I am a bit skeptical as we rarely find broad miracle cures for broad non-related issues with one cause. I will be happy if my skepticism proves false. ---
**Author:** ![gkster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gkster/32/14107_2.png) [@gkster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gkster)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2019, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-breakthrough-regarding-alzheimers/828495/12 "2019-01-29T03:01:45Z")
Very different from Alzheimers, but gingivitis in pregnancy is supposedly risky for the fetus: “Research suggests that the bacteria that cause inflammation in the gums can actually get into the bloodstream and target the fetus, potentially leading to premature labor and low-birth-weight (PLBW) babies.” > **[Periodontitis: A risk for delivery of premature labor and low-birth-weight...](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3217279/)** > > Periodontitis is a destructive inflammatory disease of the supporting tissues of the teeth and is caused by specific microorganisms or group of specific microorganisms. The association of periodontal infection with organ systems like cardiovascular... “periodontal diseases represent a previously unrecognized and clinically significant risk factor for preterm low birth weight” > **[Periodontal infection as a possible risk factor for preterm low birth weight...](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/8910829/)** > > Peridontal diseases are gram-negative anaerobic infections that can occur in women of childbearing age (18 to 34 years). In the present investigation we sought to determine whether the prevalence of maternal periodontal infection could be associated... So a vaccine against gingivitis, if effective, would be a wide-ranging public health breakthrough. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2019, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-breakthrough-regarding-alzheimers/828495/13 "2019-01-29T04:07:28Z")
What about the argument that alzheimers is due to insulin resistance? > **[Alzheimer's Disease Is Type 3 Diabetes–Evidence Reviewed](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2769828/)** > > Alzheimer's disease (AD) has characteristic histopathological, molecular, and biochemical abnormalities, including cell loss; abundant neurofibrillary tangles; dystrophic neurites; amyloid precursor protein, amyloid-β (APP-Aβ) deposits; ... Is that entire theory thrown out, or is it tied in somehow? ---
**Author:** ![Flyer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/flyer/32/7298_2.png) [@Flyer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flyer)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2019, 6:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-breakthrough-regarding-alzheimers/828495/14 "2019-01-29T06:32:26Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > Little surprised? Well lots of us are jaded: we constantly hear of incredible medical breakthroughs–but which don’t end up amounting to much if anything. > [@Jackmannii](#): > > I’d hope this leads somewhere important, but I’ve also gotten wary of “this is the answer” breakthroughs. > [@rat\_avatar](#): > > After 30 years of “breakthroughs” with MS as my dad suffered more and more I have become skeptical about these claims but in this case I think that waiting for the clinical trials to be completed will be interesting to see. I too have seen claims that fizzled out. That’s precisely why I said “possible” breakthrough, and pointed out the need for more research. I guess cautious optimism is too subtle for you folks to understand. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2019, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-breakthrough-regarding-alzheimers/828495/15 "2019-01-29T15:42:42Z")
> [@Flyer](#): > > I guess cautious optimism is too subtle for you folks to understand. Hardly. :rolleyes: How about understanding healthy skepticism? When I hear a claim about a breakthrough, I want to know who’s claiming it, what their credentials are, and how do they know what they claim is true. If they can’t pass all 3, I won’t keep thinking about it. If they’re already brilliant scientists, but they performed a lousy experiment, or overstated the results, I won’t either. ---
**Author:** ![filmore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7993a0/32.png) [@filmore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/filmore)\ **Post date:** [January 29, 2019, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-breakthrough-regarding-alzheimers/828495/16 "2019-01-29T16:07:45Z")
Wouldn’t this kind of link be immediately evident since different cultures have very different dental hygiene practices? There are some cultures where they brush/floss multiple times a day vs others where they never brush their teeth. ---
**Author:** ![Grestarian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grestarian/32/3227_2.png) [@Grestarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grestarian)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2019, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-breakthrough-regarding-alzheimers/828495/17 "2019-01-31T01:58:16Z")
I don’t think everyone is $H!++ing on your thread, Flyer. I think the general reception is rather cautious, as is typical of this board. I recall a few years ago that there were some articles pointing at acid-fighting drugs like Pepcid and Zantax as a cause of Alzheimers – or at least related to a spike in occurrence over the previous decade. My point being \*here’s another potential culprit \*is just another potential culprit and, as the skepticism around here goes, we’ll wait until further studies are done. I appreciate the information but I’ll wait to get excited. That said, I was still active in publishing (turn of the century, then) when I read in the journal-aggregator Discovery# some discussions and speculation that the “Salk Model” was pretty much dead – one problem/one cause worked for polio, chicken pox, and even the common (?) cold but the stuff bioscientists were now chasing seemed to have aggregate causes and/or single causes triggering multiple problems. –G! #I liked having access to that publication, even if I couldn’t hope to directly understand the journal articles from Lancet, AMA, etc. Alas, that was so long ago they are all but forgotten. BTW: Good to see you’re still out there, Qadgop! ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2019, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-breakthrough-regarding-alzheimers/828495/18 "2019-01-31T02:39:28Z")
> [@Grestarian](#): > > Good to see you’re still out there, Qadgop! Out there? You mean out there on the hull of the tranship? * * * "Qadgop the Mercotan slithered flatly around the after-bulge of the tranship. Fools! Did they think that the yieldlessness of absolute neutronium could stop QADGOP THE MERCOTAN? And that human wench Cynthia, cowering in helpless terror just beyond this thin and fragile wall… ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [January 31, 2019, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-breakthrough-regarding-alzheimers/828495/19 "2019-01-31T03:12:53Z")
> [@Grestarian](#): > > That said, I was still active in publishing (turn of the century, then) when I read in the journal-aggregator Discovery# […] > #I liked having access to that publication, even if I couldn’t hope to directly understand the journal articles from Lancet, AMA, etc. Alas, that was so long ago they are all but forgotten. I can’t pin down the date, but sometime last century Lancet, AMA etc stopped being anecdotal and started being loaded with statistics. Also, some of those journals adopted designs which made reading more difficult. I used to read that stuff when I was 12: by the time I was 40 they weren’t worrying if anybody could actually understand the articles. Now my favourite journal doesn’t even include the references in the print edition, which was one of the last directly understandable features (I could always form some kind of opinion about interesting opinions referenced only to other articles by the same authors, or whose best references were minor paramedical journals)