# A possible explination for certain Guests **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 30, 2004, 6:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-explination-for-certain-guests/237264 "2004-03-30T06:44:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Cardinal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cardinal/32/4000_2.png) [@Cardinal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cardinal)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2004, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-explination-for-certain-guests/237264/41 "2004-03-31T01:44:48Z")
Maybe this is a place to ask this question: I was one of the main people battling with Rabbi Rosencratz (sic), who turned out to be a troll from the SF board. Someone else astutely called him on it. I didn’t because it was easier for me to imagine that there was a radical offended Jew than an SFer who thought it was funny to yank our chains in this way. I honestly don’t get it. What did he want to do? 1. Show what Jews do and have us attack him for it, illustrating how jerky Jews are. I don’t think anyone ever thought that this was typical of Jews. It never ocurred to me that this was some stereotype brought to life. 2. Have us join him in attack on SFers so he could show how Jew-loving we are. In fact, we argued that racist people are normal people with some bad ideas, not psychotics. 3. Just jerk us around in general like he was 12. This sounds the most plausible because it doesn’t need the rational explanation that I can’t find. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2004, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-explination-for-certain-guests/237264/42 "2004-03-31T02:10:10Z")
> [@](#): > > I honestly don’t get it. What did he want to do? [I posted my guess as to his motives in his Pit thread.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=4693343#post4693343) OTOH, there are those people among those groups who sincerely believe that “white people” are doomed and that “Jews” are involved in some sort of conspiracy to make it happen. (Never mind that the eradication of whites would eliminate Jews, pretty much by definition.) For those people, their only interest is in gathering poor put-upon white people to the cause. They are not going to persuade very many rational people by argument, since their facts are nonexistent and their logic is flawed, so they troll the world looking for people to join them just by repeating their claims as often as possible. (The Big Lie technique.) For them, their primary driving force is that of the publicist, not the scholar: “I don’t care what they say as long as they spell my name right.” By wandering in here and getting _any_ attention, they hope to find like-minded people who think that they are being persecuted who will go visit the hate sites to see what the fuss is about and, if luck is with the WN crowd, will decide to join the movement. ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2004, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-explination-for-certain-guests/237264/43 "2004-03-31T02:27:02Z")
> [@lambchops](#): > > Noam Chomsky’s being used by skinheads now?? I noticed some other surprising names on the list. ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2004, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-explination-for-certain-guests/237264/44 "2004-03-31T02:28:26Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > Paleo-Conservative? 😕 > (don’t wanna go to the site to find out…) Opposed to the neo-conservatives who hold sway inn th eWH and elsewhere now. ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2004, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-explination-for-certain-guests/237264/45 "2004-03-31T02:30:36Z")
> [@Really Not All That Bright](#): > > Read “watered-down white supremacist dipshit”. Bull Shit ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2004, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-explination-for-certain-guests/237264/46 "2004-03-31T02:37:12Z")
Didn’t I say that in more words up there? ---
**Author:** ![da\_pope](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ba0ec/32.png) [@da\_pope](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/da_pope)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2004, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-explination-for-certain-guests/237264/47 "2004-03-31T03:30:39Z")
‘science girl’ ‘lyricalreckoner’ ‘castaway’ etc… have come with one purpose in mind. It’s not debate, it’s not to fight ignorance, but to spew shit all over these boards. I hate that I can’t jump in within the first couple of posts and say ‘don’t take the bait, just ignore it’. It’s against the rules to call a troll a troll. That’s fine, I can live with that. They’re NOT DEBATING. I hate to see people attempt to intelligently discuss with these fucksticks. I’m not buying ‘rational discourse is better than ignoring them or shouting them down’; they’re not responding to questions asked, they refuse to cite proper sources. They don’t concede points; there is no rational discourse with these posters. The game is disruption, distortion, and other assorted bullshit. I’m a lurker, not a poster; I have not the mental fortitude of those dedicated to fight ignorance. I have found myself walking into threads thinking one way and walking out thinking the opposite. I enjoy the spirited debates on god and politics and life, that’s why I continue to come back, day after day. I hate to see the WNs take a laughing diarrhea on every thread in GD. ---
**Author:** ![holmes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e95f7d/32.png) [@holmes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/holmes)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2004, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-explination-for-certain-guests/237264/48 "2004-03-31T03:42:40Z")
> [@da\_pope](#): > > ‘science girl’ ‘lyricalreckoner’ ‘castaway’ etc… have come with one purpose in mind. It’s not debate, it’s not to fight ignorance, but to spew shit all over these boards. > > I hate that I can’t jump in within the first couple of posts and say ‘don’t take the bait, just ignore it’. It’s against the rules to call a troll a troll. That’s fine, I can live with that. They’re NOT DEBATING. I hate to see people attempt to intelligently discuss with these fucksticks… I would agree, except these guys are only expressing what many people think, no not to the same extreme, but to a certain degree… How many people wonder why group “X” doesn’t do as well as group “Y”? While the reasonable person may not believe in separatism, I find they have that nagging doubt that there maybe a “reason”. When these guys come here and actually say that there’s a “Genetic” reason why and they can “prove” it and their arguments are ripped to shreds…I like to think that, that lurker who secretly questioned whether “X” really is “different” than “Y”, goes nah, that’s the thoughts of the ignorant… **I know better.** We’ve beaten these guy back. ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2004, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-explination-for-certain-guests/237264/49 "2004-03-31T03:58:20Z")
> [@pravnik](#): > > I’m a self identified jew 90% of the time! I know what that’s like. I don’t necessarily like to self-identify all the time either. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2004, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-explination-for-certain-guests/237264/50 "2004-03-31T04:07:09Z")
> [@Jonathan Chance](#): > > Didn’t I say that in more words up there? Yeah, but sometimes I post as I read. ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2004, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-explination-for-certain-guests/237264/51 "2004-03-31T04:10:05Z")
> [@SimonX](#): > > Yeah, but sometimes I post as I read. Meaning that I hadn’t read your post yet. ---
**Author:** ![TitoBenito](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2acd7d/32.png) [@TitoBenito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TitoBenito)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2004, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-explination-for-certain-guests/237264/52 "2004-03-31T04:10:12Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > I knew it! He was always the shiftiest of the Kids in the Hall! Never trusted that guy either, then again I never trusted any of **those** people if you catch my drift. Damn flappy head and beedy eyes with their heads all full of lies. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2004, 4:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-explination-for-certain-guests/237264/53 "2004-03-31T04:16:45Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > OTOH, there are those people among those groups who sincerely believe that “white people” are doomed and that “Jews” are involved in some sort of conspiracy to make it happen. (Never mind that the eradication of whites would eliminate Jews, pretty much by definition.) For those people, their only interest is in gathering poor put-upon white people to the cause. Actually, I’d say their motivation comes more from being gathered to the cause than gathering others. Look, what makes a person a white supremacist? You don’t just misread the newspaper and get the mistaken impression that Jews run the world. The great, great majority of neo-Nazis are: - White males, ages 18 to 40 - Uneducated - Un- or under-employed - Have difficulty forming healthy sexual relationship with women They are, in other words, losers - were losers BEFORE the became Nazis. White supremacy offers the gardon-variety loser two incredibly enticing carrots: 1. Someone to blame for their loserdom. It’s not YOUR fault you can’t hold a job and don’t have a girlfriend and flunked out of high school - it’s the ZOG, or the “niggers,” or the “spics,” or (insert group here.) You can see that pattern directed at other groups by young losers in other countries. 2. A group to belong to. Losers have been rejected by school, by employers, and by women (I know, some are women; the great majority are not), so the local chapter of White Power Inc. offers a group that not only accepts them, but gives them a fantasy identity - the Young Aryan Resister - which makes them feel powerful and important. They aren’t losers, see; they’re members of the lost Aryan Race, the superior ones, the masters of the world. Look at the symbology they use - the clenched fist, the armored warrior. A survey of white power heavy metal albums reveals album art that looks like old Nazi props from the “Indiana Jones” sets combined with storyboard art from “Conan the Barbarian.” One album has a cover featuring a huge, cartoonish warrior holding a battle axe - an image so over-the-top Viking-cum-homoerotic it makes you laugh. Symbols of virility, power, strength, violence. The young Nazi is usually a young man with no economic or social power. He resents his lowly place, fears for his virility. What he wants is not to LEAD, but to BELONG. ---
**Author:** ![gum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bbe5ce/32.png) [@gum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gum)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2004, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-explination-for-certain-guests/237264/54 "2004-03-31T04:34:04Z")
Excellent post, **RickJay**. Thank you. ---
**Author:** ![Siege](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@Siege](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siege)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2004, 10:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-explination-for-certain-guests/237264/55 "2004-03-31T10:46:54Z")
I agree with **RickJay**. While I haven’t, as far as I know, known any white-supremacists in real life, I had a lot of experience with bullies growing up, usually as one of their victims. When I tried to figure out their mindset, I came to the conclusion part of it involved wanting to be better than someone. I figured it had to be a bit of feeling that even though they’d never date the pretty girls they wanted to or be as successful as the cream of the crop at least they were better than that handicapped person or that person with the funny accent. In my experience in high school, the worst bullies weren’t the school’s social elite; they were the ones with little academic, social, or athletic success. I understand the need to belong and the need to believe you’re not the stupidest, least worthy form of scum to walk the face of the earth. I’ve need both things rather desperately myself at times. I will _not_, however, stand for the right of people to beat up and degrade others to fill those needs. You see, people doing just that to me left me desperate to belong, etc. I’d prefer it if people would not insist on transfering their insecurities! :rolleyes: CJ ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2004, 11:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-explination-for-certain-guests/237264/56 "2004-03-31T11:49:37Z")
> [@](#): > > Actually, I’d say their motivation comes more from being gathered to the cause than gathering others. You have explained who tends to get recruited pretty well. (I have minor quibbles: women are increasingly showing up in their ranks, for example.) However, how they get recruited does not answer the question “Why do they come _here_ and pretend to be non-white or Jewish? (Particularly when they get shot down so thoroughly.)” My responses was to _that_ question. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Sarang](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e8c25b/32.png) [@Jack\_Sarang](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Sarang)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2004, 12:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-explination-for-certain-guests/237264/57 "2004-03-31T12:06:24Z")
> [@Gest](#): > > TitoBenito, why did you bold Rushton and Lynn’s names in your OP? Rushton is a psychologist who has published papers claiming that blacks are genetically inferior to whites based on intelligence. He’s widely considered a crank by anyone who has studied Psychology due to his very obvious agenda and dubious methodology. For every paper he publishes there are about 10-11 refutations and then numerous rejoinders have been thrown back and forth. ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2004, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-explination-for-certain-guests/237264/58 "2004-05-06T04:59:43Z")
It seems to me that White Supremacists are afraid of Jews and how intelligent they are, how they control all the banks and media, how they control the world. If the guys at SF really believe that, why don’t they all just convert to Judaism and jump on the world domination bandwaggon? ;j ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2004, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-explination-for-certain-guests/237264/59 "2004-05-06T13:28:24Z")
> [@Jonathan Chance](#): > > I almost ran ‘American Conservative’ magazine a few years ago. You? YOU?!?!? Well, I suppose, since I used to run this TeenAged Republican newsletter during the Nixon admin… But I had the old “you see, there was this girl…” excuse while I doubt Lady Chance would let you get away with that. But YOU? “American Conservative?” > [@](#): > > don’t post any retarded Nazi/Skinhead/KKK stuff Even THEY know how poorly written that shit is. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2004, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-explination-for-certain-guests/237264/60 "2004-05-06T13:31:37Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > women are increasingly showing up in their ranks, for example. Yeah, I’ve noticed that, too. Why do you suppose that is? And it’s a bad sign–now that these guys finally have a chance of getting laid they’ll NEVER quit. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-explination-for-certain-guests/237264.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-possible-explination-for-certain-guests/237264.md?page=4)