# A Pre-Emptive Goodbye **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [February 2, 2010, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-pre-emptive-goodbye/527417 "2010-02-02T18:27:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![tacoloco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tacoloco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tacoloco)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2010, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-pre-emptive-goodbye/527417/61 "2010-02-02T21:07:22Z")
> [@ajb867](#): > > Try to see where he is coming from, we have almost 20,000 posts. Right now in great debates he is actually causing _shock_ a debate! It keeps the forum motor purring. If he is removed over the next slightest warning we are going to be left with Dio’s > > “No it isn’t” > routine in great debates, fuck that. If he has a moderation complaint, then he should have opened a thread for that. This thread, OTOH, makes it seem like we’re supposed to have a pity party for poor downtrodden **mswas**. The whole preemptive goodbye thing rubs me the wrong way. ---
**Author:** ![ajb867](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f14d63/32.png) [@ajb867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ajb867)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2010, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-pre-emptive-goodbye/527417/62 "2010-02-02T21:10:48Z")
I don’t agree with this policy though Marley, not all moderator warnings are created equal! It’s like California’s three strike rule. On the whole the board would be loosing part of it’s appeal. I’m sure not everyone like’s mswas but I’m positive there is plenty who feel the same about other posters over in Great Debates. When they all mix together it’s what makes the place worth coming back too! ---
**Author:** ![Winston\_Smith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e95f7d/32.png) [@Winston\_Smith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Winston_Smith)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2010, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-pre-emptive-goodbye/527417/63 "2010-02-02T21:17:14Z")
My advice is to take a break from the boards. Do something different, like finding a fledgling board, becoming a moderator there, realizing how much being a mod sucks and how terrible you are at it, and ultimately collapse in failure. That’ll fix you _right_ up. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2010, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-pre-emptive-goodbye/527417/64 "2010-02-02T21:17:58Z")
> [@ajb867](#): > > I don’t agree with this policy though Marley, not all moderator warnings are created equal! The policy of making people stick to the rules? I’m sorry, he’s been here for 10 years and knows what the rules are but can’t be bothered to pay attention to them, but keeps crying that he’s being persecuted. He was suspended over the fall, which really shows he’s on thin ice, and today he got his second warning since then. (The other one was in January.) And he didn’t even get banned for _this one_- he was told the _next one_ is it. Truth be told this is probably the third time he’s heard that. That’s more than enough exceptions for one person, particularly when his response to everything is “y’all are brutalizing me.” ---
**Author:** ![ajb867](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f14d63/32.png) [@ajb867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ajb867)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2010, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-pre-emptive-goodbye/527417/65 "2010-02-02T21:18:24Z")
> [@tacoloco](#): > > If he has a moderation complaint, then he should have opened a thread for that. > > This thread, OTOH, makes it seem like we’re supposed to have a pity party for poor downtrodden **mswas**. > > The whole preemptive goodbye thing rubs me the wrong way. While I don’t agree Marley made the wrong decision in closing the thread, I think its hard and folly to expect someone to post here infraction free forever. The whole point of them telling him this was I’m sure to provoke a change in behavior overall for the better but no one is perfect. I would be down trodden too if I had almost 20,000 posts and was told my next fuck up is my last, it would honestly just come across as…the inevitable… ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2010, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-pre-emptive-goodbye/527417/66 "2010-02-02T21:21:45Z")
**mswas** said: > [@](#): > > So after my most recent capricious warning on this message board,… Capricious? You called a Mod a jerk in GD. That’s not capricious, that’s an overt rule. Do not insult anyone except in the Pit. The other comment about starting a GD thread without defending a position or staking out a debatable point? That wasn’t capricious, and furthermore, that wasn’t a warning. > [@](#): > > LOL whatever, the most recent warning was completely unecessary. You were just on a tear this morning for whatever reason. I didn’t do anything that so many people don’t do on a daily basis. You just immediately threatened to lock my thread for no reason other than to be a … about it. What, you insulted a mod like so many people do on a daily basis? Or are you talking about the statement about posting a non-debate in GD? Because that wasn’t a _warning_. It was a moderator action, but the two are not synonymous. And here you are arguing that what **Marley23** did was “capricious” and “completely unnecessary”, and then you turn around and say > [@](#): > > Whether or not it was against the rules isn’t being debated. If you’re not debating it, then why are you calling it “capricious” and “completely unnecessary”? > [@](#): > > So in an effort to avoid the moderator caprice in GD, I’ll post threads that I _KNOW_ will eventually be moved to GD in other forums if I don’t want to immediately skew the debate in one direction or another. You don’t have to advocate a side to state a point as a debatable topic. “European Population Crash - is it really a population crash, or just a relocation?” “European Population Crash - why should I care?” “European Population Crash - bad for small towns, good for Europe?” “European Population Crash - does this article really have a valid point?” You said you think it is debate-worthy, but you failed to mention what about it is debate worthy. You didn’t give any description of what should be debated at all. What is to be debated about that article? That the ones leaving first were young women? That people leaving that town is a bad thing? What you did was post “I want to see a debate about European Population Crash. Somebody start one.” What is there to debate? “I want to see a debate about monkeys. Somebody start one.” 😕 > [@](#): > > The stakes are low and I don’t back down to petty abuses of authority. Right, so now it’s a petty abuse of authority to enforce the rule that there are no insults in GD? It’s a petty abuse of authority to ask you to clarify your GD post into a debatable topic, rather than just move or close the non-debate post? If you really want to do something pre-emptive, why don’t you pre-emptively leave? That way, there is no reason to ban you? Take that, you capricious moderators! > [@](#): > > I’m not getting myself banned. And yet you are. > [@](#): > > Nope, I am just saying Goodbye and pointing out the difference of opinion between myself and the mods. Most of my warnings were IMO unwarranted. And what I am saying is that I will most likely in a fit of pique get that last warning. I have no idea of your history or those previous warnings, so I cannot judge them. I have no intent to search your posting history to find them and see if you are correct. But I can comment on your posting in this thread, and from this sampling I can tell that if you get banned, it won’t be because the mods are acting capriciously, it will be because you deliberately break rules. If you truly want to keep posting here, **stop breaking rules**. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2010, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-pre-emptive-goodbye/527417/67 "2010-02-02T21:21:47Z")
Bye! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2010, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-pre-emptive-goodbye/527417/68 "2010-02-02T21:26:29Z")
> [@ajb867](#): > > The whole point of them telling him this was I’m sure to provoke a change in behavior overall for the better but no one is perfect. The hell with being perfect, he swears up and down in the OP he’s not even interested in making an effort. If he’s that “down trodden” - and he’s not, because he’s behaved like this so many times before - he’d considering behaving differently. It’s not like he has not been advised about this before. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2010, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-pre-emptive-goodbye/527417/69 "2010-02-02T21:32:20Z")
Here’s a question - if the point really was to say goodbye rather than complain about moderation, why did he open the thread in ATMB and not MPSIMS? MPSIMS is for sympathy and the like. ATMB is for discussing moderator actions. Hmmmmm. **Marley23** said: > [@](#): > > He was suspended over the fall, which really shows he’s on thin ice, and today he got his second warning since then. (The other one was in January.) And he didn’t even get banned for _this_ one- he was told the _next one_ is it. Truth be told this is probably the third time he’s heard that. That’s more than enough exceptions for one person, particularly when his response to everything is “y’all are brutalizing me.” Question relating to the other discussions in this forum - does **mswas** lean left or right? **ajb867** said: > [@](#): > > I think its hard and folly to expect someone to post here infraction free forever. The whole point of them telling him this was I’m sure to provoke a change in behavior overall for the better but no one is perfect. I would be down trodden too if I had almost 20,000 posts and was told my next fuck up is my last, it would honestly just come across as…the inevitable… I can’t speak for the mods, but if he made a deliberate effort to clean up his act, if he remained warning free for several months, and then got an infraction for something minor, it’s possible it wouldn’t be an insta-ban. If the whole point is to improve his behavior, a marked preponderance of that result could result in some leeway. But it would have to be a significant effort to behave properly for a significant amount of time and the infraction would have to be something that does not look like a return to old patterns. Of course, I’m just speculating… ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2010, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-pre-emptive-goodbye/527417/70 "2010-02-02T21:32:35Z")
> [@ajb867](#): > > While I don’t agree Marley made the wrong decision in closing the thread, I think its hard and folly to expect someone to post here infraction free forever. I dunno … I would guess that most people here post infraction-free forever. ---
**Author:** ![ajb867](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f14d63/32.png) [@ajb867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ajb867)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2010, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-pre-emptive-goodbye/527417/71 "2010-02-02T21:36:01Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > The hell with being perfect, he swears up and down in the OP he’s not even interested in making an effort. If he’s that “down trodden” - and he’s not, because he’s behaved like this so many times before - he’d considering behaving differently. It’s not like he has not been advised about this before. I didn’t read it like that Marley, to me he is just stating the obvious. Think about it like this Marley even if he does change his behavior there is going to be an eventual slip. Another warning is like a typo for someone who contributes as much as he does, it will happen. No one likes to hear things in absolutes. He has already posted several posts that have been well in line in another forum. ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2010, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-pre-emptive-goodbye/527417/72 "2010-02-02T21:36:50Z")
So, am I the only one that sees the damn winky smilie after every single one of mswas’ posts? Because, I can’t believe everyone resists the urge to comment on it. Or is this something that everyone has accepted, like ‘regards’? Anyways, Imma miss ya, mswas! ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2010, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-pre-emptive-goodbye/527417/73 "2010-02-02T21:41:10Z")
> [@ajb867](#): > > I didn’t read it like that Marley, to me he is just stating the obvious. > [@mswas](#): > > I am not going to make a special effort not to step on over-sensitive people’s toes. > [@](#): > > Think about it like this Marley even if he does change his behavior there is going to be an eventual slip. We making allowances for people making a mistake once in a while, that’s part of life. But it’s not like you can accidentally insult someone on a message board. You have to deliberately type the words and send them. Once in a while people forget what forum they’re in, but that’s rare. So I don’t buy this rationalization. > [@](#): > > Another warning is like a typo for someone who contributes as much as he does, it will happen. Bull. There are people with way more posts than **mswas** who have zero warnings. > [@Irishman](#): > > I can’t speak for the mods, but if he made a deliberate effort to clean up his act, if he remained warning free for several months, and then got an infraction for something minor, it’s possible it wouldn’t be an insta-ban. That’s usually how we handle it. Although with the ridiculous number of warnings **mswas** has racked up I’m guessing it’d have to be a lot more than several months. We’ve seen him do “several months” - his suspension ended in late September and he didn’t get any warnings until January. ---
**Author:** ![ajb867](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f14d63/32.png) [@ajb867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ajb867)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2010, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-pre-emptive-goodbye/527417/74 "2010-02-02T21:51:32Z")
There is always the exception to the rule with regards to the people who don’t have warnings. I’m sure you are willing to agree that those posters probably have come across a situation where they could of received a warning but didn’t. Also those posters with out naming any names may post in forums about topics that are less likely to get heated. These said posters could receive their first warning later today for all we know! I’m just saying I think mswas outcry about being removed from the board over the next infraction no matter what it is, seems rational. I’m speaking a bit for him but I believe he likes to post here other wise he would of left a long time ago. The fact that this whole thing upsets him is an encouraging sign but he believes the odds are insurmountable. Remember he is not talking about whether a kitten is cute day in or day out here. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2010, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-pre-emptive-goodbye/527417/75 "2010-02-02T21:59:36Z")
> [@ajb867](#): > > There is always the exception to the rule with regards to the people who don’t have warnings. **mswas** is the exception to the rule, not the other posters who have managed to get zero warnings, or far fewer warnings than he has. > [@](#): > > I’m sure you are willing to agree that those posters probably have come across a situation where they could of received a warning but didn’t. What does that have to do with the price of tea in China? There could be situations where **mswas** might have received a past warning and didn’t, too. > [@](#): > > I’m just saying I think mswas outcry about being removed from the board over the next infraction no matter what it is, seems rational. Treating it as a fait accompli while refusing to try to prevent it is not rational. It’s just drama queenery. > [@](#): > > I’m speaking a bit for him but I believe he likes to post here I’m sure he does. That’s not the issue. > [@](#): > > The fact that this whole thing upsets him is an encouraging sign Not really. Maybe it would be encouraging if this were the first time we’ve been down this road, [but it isn’t by a long shot](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=529654). ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2010, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-pre-emptive-goodbye/527417/76 "2010-02-02T22:04:49Z")
Well, **mswas** fucked up a little and the board might soon be the poorer for it. Yeah, she insulted a mod in GD, and that is against the rules. But, come on, this was pretty minor, you have to admit. And it all stemmed from **Marley23** just happening to see and post in her thread 1 minute after it was opened. I’m not saying **Marley’s** doing that was wrong, but I can see it from **mswas’s** point of view (I think). Her thread was not unlike many threads posted on GD. Hell, one poster alone, **BrainGlutton** , has probably bumped up his obscenely impressive/ridiculous post count by a few hundred doing the exact same thing. So, in light of that, combined with a few current threads discussing moderation bias, **mswas** was probably a little too touchy about what she perceived, understandably, as a mod coming after her yet again. When elsewhere in the SDMB universe, we have **Der Trihs** spewing his content-free ignorant hatred without so much as a peep from a mod. So, yeah, **mswas** screwed up. His emotions got the better of him. And now the mods can place razor blades a hair’s breadth from his neck and sit back and watch, smug in their righteousness. The bottom line is that mswas is an excellent thinker and debater. He follows the arguments well (a rarity around here), provides articulate rationales for his positions, and stands up to greater numbers of posters with a light and pleasant demeanor. (Yeah, he probably got that from me. :dubious:) I hope the mods take into account both the very positive contribution he makes to the board and the rather minor nature of this infraction, wrong as she was for leveling the insult in GD. ---
**Author:** ![Arnold\_Winkelried](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Arnold\_Winkelried](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arnold_Winkelried)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2010, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-pre-emptive-goodbye/527417/77 "2010-02-02T22:07:47Z")
> [@ajb867](#): > > I’m just saying I think mswas outcry about being removed from the board over the next infraction no matter what it is, seems rational. 😕 So how many times should a poster be allowed to break the rules before being banned? An infinite number of times? Or a number X \< inifinity? I am going to assume that the answer is the latter, a number less than infinity. Otherwise, of course, no one would ever be banned. When a poster has broken the rules X - 2 times, is it OK to tell her “after two more warnings you’re out?” When a poster has broken the rules X - 1 times, what are we supposed to tell her then? “You’ll be banned if you keep down this path but we can’t tell you how many more chances you have because that would upset your delicate sensibilities?” ---
**Author:** ![Arnold\_Winkelried](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Arnold\_Winkelried](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arnold_Winkelried)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2010, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-pre-emptive-goodbye/527417/78 "2010-02-02T22:10:33Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > I hope the mods take into account both the very positive contribution he makes to the board and the rather minor nature of this infraction, wrong as she was for leveling the insult in GD. Are you thinking that this is the only time mswas ever broke the rules of the board? ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2010, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-pre-emptive-goodbye/527417/79 "2010-02-02T22:11:24Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > Well, **mswas** fucked up a little and the board might soon be the poorer for it. Yeah, she insulted a mod in GD, and that is against the rules. But, come on, this was pretty minor, you have to admit. And it all stemmed from **Marley23** just happening to see and post in her thread 1 minute after it was opened. I’m not saying **Marley’s** doing that was wrong, but I can see it from **mswas’s** point of view (I think). Her thread was not unlike many threads posted on GD. Hell, one poster alone, **BrainGlutton** , has probably bumped up his obscenely impressive/ridiculous post count by a few hundred doing the exact same thing. So, in light of that, combined with a few current threads discussing moderation bias, **mswas** was probably a little too touchy about what she perceived, understandably, as a mod coming after her yet again. When elsewhere in the SDMB universe, we have **Der Trihs** spewing his content-free ignorant hatred without so much as a peep from a mod. > > So, yeah, **mswas** screwed up. His emotions got the better of him. And now the mods can place razor blades a hair’s breadth from his neck and sit back and watch, smug in their righteousness. > > The bottom line is that mswas is an excellent thinker and debater. He follows the arguments well (a rarity around here), provides articulate rationales for his positions, and stands up to greater numbers of posters with a light and pleasant demeanor. (Yeah, he probably got that from me. :dubious:) > > I hope the mods take into account both the very positive contribution he makes to the board and the rather minor nature of this infraction, wrong as she was for leveling the insult in GD. You used both he and she when referring to **mswas** , so now I’m confused. Is **mswas** male or female? ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2010, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-pre-emptive-goodbye/527417/80 "2010-02-02T22:12:08Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > The bottom line is that mswas is an excellent thinker and debater. Cite? 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-pre-emptive-goodbye/527417.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-pre-emptive-goodbye/527417.md?page=5)