# A prep school math teacher arrested for having inappropriate sexual contact with male students. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 12, 2017, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-prep-school-math-teacher-arrested-for-having-inappropriate-sexual-contact-with-male-students/788790 "2017-06-12T18:08:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Don\_t\_Panic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/don_t_panic/32/398_2.png) [@Don\_t\_Panic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_t_Panic)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2017, 9:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-prep-school-math-teacher-arrested-for-having-inappropriate-sexual-contact-with-male-students/788790/81 "2017-06-15T09:41:02Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Basically, for the same reason that male/male prison rape is also typically treated as a big joke instead of a horrifying crime. What, now? Who the heck in this thread is laughing about prison rape? Who is the butt of the joke if you’re making light of prison rape? Actually, I’m not sure. I don’t know any prison rape jokes, and I wasn’t even aware that it was a common subject for hilarity. But speaking of butts, there’s probably a pun in there somewhere. Even so, you may have a point. So, never mind that. Take male/male top/bottom jokes. Say, Putin/Trump. So, Trump is sucking Putin’s dick. Who is the butt of the joke? Well, Trump. He’s having his masculinity violated. The fuckee is the butt. Who is the butt of the hot math teacher jokes? Well, it’s the math teacher. Because… because it’s impossible for us to imagine the male beeing the fuckee in the situation? Is that what these jokes come down to? “Ha ha! A woman doing the fucking? What an absurd notion! The impossibility of that makes me fall over laughing!” That’s pretty sad. Sounds like a meta-joke now. Maybe we should all go fuck ourselves. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2017, 10:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-prep-school-math-teacher-arrested-for-having-inappropriate-sexual-contact-with-male-students/788790/82 "2017-06-15T10:52:53Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > And according to traditional sexist gender norms, attractive sexually mature females are the prime trophies of masculinity. Getting sex with young attractive women is such a crucial feature of male success that it’s unthinkable to associate it with sexual coercion or exploitation of males. If such a thing actually happens, men feel they have to rewrite the narrative as a male sexual success story: either directly by joking about how lucky the victims are, or vicariously by joking about how lucky they’d have felt if it happened to them. _See, they are so virile and manly that a woman couldn’t have sexually coerced them! It wasn’t abuse, it was a highly desirable sex trophy! They’re the ones really in control of the situation and getting what they want!_ I’ll grant – for the sake of argument – that, sometimes, that happens: that a male in that situation might _think_ he was lucky and uncoerced; but he wasn’t _really_ getting what he wants from “a highly desirable sex trophy” even if it’d maybe take a lot of work to make him notice it when he’s done getting ‘virile stud’ high-fives. Can you grant that – sometimes – things just _are_ as they say? That there are times where, just like he says, the male would simply feel great about the situation; and, when he’s in his twenties and grins upon bedding a hot older woman, can accurately relay that _oh, yeah, this uncoerced Getting-What-I-Want feeling? As far as I can tell, it’s significantly similar to something else I’d like to mention…_ ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2017, 11:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-prep-school-math-teacher-arrested-for-having-inappropriate-sexual-contact-with-male-students/788790/83 "2017-06-15T11:41:25Z")
> [@Martian Bigfoot](#): > > What, now? Who the heck in this thread is laughing about prison rape? > > Who is the butt of the joke if you’re making light of prison rape? Actually, I’m not sure. I don’t know any prison rape jokes, and I wasn’t even aware that it was a common subject for hilarity. But speaking of butts, there’s probably a pun in there somewhere. Even so, you may have a point. So, never mind that. Take male/male top/bottom jokes. Say, Putin/Trump. > > So, Trump is sucking Putin’s dick. Who is the butt of the joke? Well, Trump. He’s having his masculinity violated. The fuckee is the butt. > > Who is the butt of the hot math teacher jokes? Well, it’s the math teacher. Because… because it’s impossible for us to imagine the male beeing the fuckee in the situation? > > Is that what these jokes come down to? “Ha ha! A woman doing the fucking? What an absurd notion! The impossibility of that makes me fall over laughing!” > > That’s pretty sad. Sounds like a meta-joke now. Maybe we should all go fuck ourselves. You really seem to be taking this personally. ---
**Author:** ![Don\_t\_Panic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/don_t_panic/32/398_2.png) [@Don\_t\_Panic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_t_Panic)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2017, 11:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-prep-school-math-teacher-arrested-for-having-inappropriate-sexual-contact-with-male-students/788790/84 "2017-06-15T11:47:16Z")
> [@jz78817](#): > > You really seem to be taking this personally. Well, let me tell you about my high school math teacher… Actually, I’m not taking it personally. Couldn’t give less of a toss, really. Just a distraction from my real problems. ---
**Author:** ![Icarus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icarus/32/72_2.png) [@Icarus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icarus)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2017, 12:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-prep-school-math-teacher-arrested-for-having-inappropriate-sexual-contact-with-male-students/788790/85 "2017-06-15T12:14:48Z")
> [@femmejean](#): > > Legality aside, are there mental issues with her? > > I don’t just mean for the ephebophelia but rather the rationality of having sex with someone who has complete leverage over you (liability wise). It’s similar to cheating on your parnter when you’re a married billionaire; the cheater has everything to lose while the other individual can blackmail the cheater into pretty much doing anything provided they don’t have connections that can make people ‘disappear’. > > This boys really are lucky. If they played their cards correctly they could extort money and get the woman spending a long time prison… Damn:D I wouldn’t go so far as mental issue. My speculation, again PURELY SPECULATION I AM NOT A PSYCHOLOGIST ETC., is that as an attractive young female she has likely been the subject of constant attention from older and equal age males from her teens onward. It would be normal for her to see these males as having power over her, and her being powerless to control their reactions to her. To her they are controlling her sexuality. By targeting the younger males, she is taking power over her own sexuality in a way that she could not with older and equal age males. So, not mental issue. Poor judgement, yes, but within the context of a desire to take power for herself, a fairly normal motivation. ---
**Author:** ![Don\_t\_Panic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/don_t_panic/32/398_2.png) [@Don\_t\_Panic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_t_Panic)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2017, 12:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-prep-school-math-teacher-arrested-for-having-inappropriate-sexual-contact-with-male-students/788790/86 "2017-06-15T12:22:57Z")
There is, of course, the issues of potential pregnancy and STDs. So she is subjecting the boys to real financial and health-related risks. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2017, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-prep-school-math-teacher-arrested-for-having-inappropriate-sexual-contact-with-male-students/788790/87 "2017-06-15T14:21:11Z")
> [@Martian Bigfoot](#): > > Who is the butt of the joke if you’re making light of prison rape? I so hope this word choice was deliberate! ---
**Author:** ![Maurie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df788c/32.png) [@Maurie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maurie)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2017, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-prep-school-math-teacher-arrested-for-having-inappropriate-sexual-contact-with-male-students/788790/88 "2017-06-15T15:29:51Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Basically, for the same reason that male/male prison rape is also typically treated as a big joke instead of a horrifying crime. Namely, because in traditional patriarchal culture it’s taboo for sexually mature males to be sexually dominated or coerced against their will: it’s perceived as “weak” and “unmanly”. Making jokes about it is a psychological defense against both the fear of actual violence and the insecurity about masculinity. > > And according to traditional sexist gender norms, attractive sexually mature females are the prime trophies of masculinity. Getting sex with young attractive women is such a crucial feature of male success that it’s unthinkable to associate it with sexual coercion or exploitation of males. If such a thing actually happens, men feel they have to rewrite the narrative as a male sexual success story: either directly by joking about how lucky the victims are, or vicariously by joking about how lucky they’d have felt if it happened to them. _See, they are so virile and manly that a woman couldn’t have sexually coerced them! It wasn’t abuse, it was a highly desirable sex trophy! They’re the ones really in control of the situation and getting what they want!_ > > Both the actual sexual assault and this kind of “gaslighting” about their reactions to it can be very traumatic to young men who get sexually abused by women. So there’s actually less hilarity and more outrage in such situations than you tend to imagine. It’s just that we need the pretense that female-on-male sexual abuse is “hilarious” and “awesome” to support our conventional gender stereotypes about the importance of male sexual dominance. Well said. I agree. I know people are adamant that horny teenage boys can’t possibly be abused by an attractive woman, and I will certainly accept that not all boys would suffer any damage from such a relationship, but there’s no question that some do. And any adult in a position of authority willing to take that risk is, by definition, incapable of making a sensible and well-reasoned decision as to which are which. > [@Melbourne](#): > > There’s an account I read years ago by a woman who had been forcibly raped, and had also, at a different time, and with a different person, inadvertently been subject to non-consensual sex in a situation she recognised /at the time/ as being socially enviable. > > Her experience was that the forcible rape was just a thing that happened to her. It was unpleasant and she got over it. The other experence played games with her mind. This has been my experience as well, precisely. I think a lot of people don’t realize this. I absolutely believe that being in a situation like the boys in this story, even if at the time I thought it was awesome (_especially_ if at the time I thought it was awesome) would ultimately leave me feeling dirtier, more confused, and less at peace than when I was violently raped in a park by a stranger. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2017, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-prep-school-math-teacher-arrested-for-having-inappropriate-sexual-contact-with-male-students/788790/89 "2017-06-15T15:46:43Z")
> [@Martian Bigfoot](#): > > What, now? Who the heck in this thread is laughing about prison rape? Where did I say anyone **in this thread** was laughing about prison rape? What I said is that it’s **typically** treated as a joke. Which it is. > [@Martian Bigfoot](#): > > There is, of course, the issues of potential pregnancy and STDs. So she is subjecting the boys to real financial and health-related risks. Suddenly it’s rather less hilarious, isn’t it? A guy barely 18 gets seduced by his 20something or 30something teacher and ends up dealing with paternal responsibilities for the rest of his life; totally worth it to score some of that fantasy hot-schoolma’am sex, right? Or maybe not? That’s one of the reasons why this kneejerk “hilarious” response of _WOO-HOO YEAH WAY TO GET SOME, BRO!_ when hearing about a male student seduced by a female teacher is more reflective of sexist conditioning than rational thought. > [@The Other Waldo Pepper](#): > > Can you grant that – sometimes – things just _are_ as they say? That there are times where, just like he says, the male would simply feel great about the situation Sure, **sometimes** teacher/student sexual relationships are fully consensual and not coercive, and the participants feel great about them. I don’t see anybody denying that that can **sometimes** happen, even though in general the innate power imbalance in the situation makes some form of coercion more likely than full consent. What we’re talking about here is why there exists a culturally enforced **default assumption** that teacher/student sexual relationships are **automatically** a great thing for the student, as long as the student is male and the teacher is female and hot. If the genders of the teacher and student (or even just the teacher) were reversed, the default assumption would be quite different. But in a sexist society we’re not supposed to see sexually mature males as victims in (hetero)sexual situations, since we’re conditioned to consider that “weak” and “unmanly”. So when we hear about a relationship between a male student and female teacher we automatically lapse into the _WOO-HOO YEAH BRO_ reaction, to reinforce the gender-roles assumption that the male must have full power and autonomy in a sexual situation. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2017, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-prep-school-math-teacher-arrested-for-having-inappropriate-sexual-contact-with-male-students/788790/90 "2017-06-15T15:51:03Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > So when we hear about a relationship between a male student and female teacher we automatically lapse into the _WOO-HOO YEAH BRO_ reaction, to reinforce the gender-roles assumption that the male must have full power and autonomy in a sexual situation. We can also see this in the implications that the woman in question is damaged because of her willingness to put herself in a vulnerable situation. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2017, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-prep-school-math-teacher-arrested-for-having-inappropriate-sexual-contact-with-male-students/788790/91 "2017-06-15T16:03:30Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > We can also see this in the implications that the woman in question is damaged because of her willingness to put herself in a vulnerable situation. Yup, and also in the fact that frequently, if there **are** negative consequences for the situation, it’s the underage male student who is [blamed](https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/he-was-abused-by-a-female-teacher-but-he-was-treated-like-the-criminal/2015/01/09/3f2e7980-96d5-11e4-aabd-d0b93ff613d5_story.html?utm_term=.d4138bf3f47d): > [@](#): > > Cameron Clarkson was a 16-year-old football player when he suddenly landed in the middle of a sex crime investigation at his St. Paul, Minn., high school. […] > > “People kept reminding me that I ruined that poor girl’s life,” Clarkson says. > > The “poor girl” was a teacher at his school. Gail Gagne, a 25-year-old basketball and lacrosse coach […] But in the investigations that followed, Clarkson was treated more like the perpetrator than the victim. […] > > Growing evidence shows that boys who are sexually preyed upon by older female authority figures suffer psychologically in much the same way that girls do when victimized by older men. But in schools, courts and law offices, male victims are treated openly with a double standard, according to interviews with a dozen experts in law, psychology and social work. […] Male victims typically receive lower awards in civil cases, the experts say, and female perpetrators get lighter sentences. […] jurors and prosecutors don’t have nearly the same outrage for abusive female teachers, Ring says: “ ‘So what? Good for him.’ That’s how society looks at it.” ---
**Author:** ![Don\_t\_Panic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/don_t_panic/32/398_2.png) [@Don\_t\_Panic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_t_Panic)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2017, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-prep-school-math-teacher-arrested-for-having-inappropriate-sexual-contact-with-male-students/788790/92 "2017-06-15T16:05:23Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Where did I say anyone **in this thread** was laughing about prison rape? What I said is that it’s **typically** treated as a joke. Which it is. Oh. Well, fair enough. I wasn’t aware of that. Maybe I don’t go to the right comedy clubs. ---
**Author:** ![sitchensis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sitchensis/32/4892_2.png) [@sitchensis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sitchensis)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2017, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-prep-school-math-teacher-arrested-for-having-inappropriate-sexual-contact-with-male-students/788790/93 "2017-06-15T16:17:23Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Suddenly it’s rather less hilarious, isn’t it? A guy barely 18 gets seduced by his 20something or 30something teacher and ends up dealing with paternal responsibilities for the rest of his life; totally worth it to score some of that fantasy hot-schoolma’am sex, right? Or maybe not? From my experience this same thing could have happened with any of the 15, 16 or 17 year old girls I had also had sex with. The more mature women was actually a lot more adamant about protection. > [@Kimstu](#): > > I don’t see anybody denying that that can **sometimes** happen, even though in general the innate power imbalance in the situation makes some form of coercion more likely than full consent. From my experience there is zero power imbalance after the first kiss, in fact it swings wildly the opposite direction. My 17 year old girlfriend could ruin my whole life. She could potentially destroy me socially in a way that I couldn’t recover from until I left for college. The worst some teacher could do is flunk me. The worst my manager at work could do is fire me from some minimum wage job. ---
**Author:** ![Don\_t\_Panic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/don_t_panic/32/398_2.png) [@Don\_t\_Panic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_t_Panic)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2017, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-prep-school-math-teacher-arrested-for-having-inappropriate-sexual-contact-with-male-students/788790/94 "2017-06-15T16:27:53Z")
> [@sitchensis](#): > > From my experience there is zero power imbalance after the first kiss, in fact it swings wildly the opposite direction. Right. Although, there is of course, a possible power fantasy aspect. I’m your teacher, do as I say! Or I’ll spank you! Or however the hell that would work, I’ve never been in one of those situations. But there is such a thing as feeling powerful and in control, which isn’t necessarily related to being powerful and in control. Your young girlfriend could, indeed, ruin your life. But when she flutters her eyelashes and does the Lolita face, how does that make you feel? ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2017, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-prep-school-math-teacher-arrested-for-having-inappropriate-sexual-contact-with-male-students/788790/95 "2017-06-15T16:48:07Z")
> [@sitchensis](#): > > From my experience this same thing could have happened with any of the 15, 16 or 17 year old girls I had also had sex with. Which is why **that** situation **also** shouldn’t get an automatic _WOO-HOO YEAH BRO WAY TO GET SOME!_ reaction from outsiders. The fact that men tend to react to the hearsay sexual experiences of other men as some kind of spectator sport in which they reflexively cheer their “player” for “scoring”, as I said, is more about sexist gender-roles conditioning than rational thought. The fact that that reflexive reaction persists even in situations where a male student is the victim of statutory rape by a female teacher just underlines how dissociated it is from rationality. As a traditionally patriarchal society, we really have a lot invested in the insistent assumption that males must be sexually in control. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2017, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-prep-school-math-teacher-arrested-for-having-inappropriate-sexual-contact-with-male-students/788790/96 "2017-06-15T17:00:48Z")
IMO you can call the disparate treatment by gender the result of a “sexist society” but (mostly) not in the manner that kimstu is saying with all this “power” stuff. It’s mostly something else – two other factors come to mind as being more important. In general, men are assumed to want sex more than women. (IMO this largely true on average, and probably partially biological and partially sociological.) Women are perceived as wanting other things as part of relationships which involve sex. Therefore, in a relationship which is (or is perceived as being) largely about sex and little or nothing else, the man is perceived as having “won” and the woman as having “lost”, since he got his ”no strings attached” sexual relationship. (This is what accounts for the stud/slut disparity, since the man has the aura of a winner and the woman the aura of a loser.) This is particularly magnified in instances where one party is perceived as taking advantage of another party, specifically in these statutory rape cases. It’s very easy to portray the older man as taking advantage of and using the younger woman for his carnal purposes because that fits in with the stereotype above: he’s getting the sex he wants and she’s not getting a genuine and positive relationship out of it. By contrast, when it’s the older woman and younger man, then the guy is getting the sex, which is a positive for him, and if she’s not getting anything else either, well that’s her choice but no big harm to the guy. [As I suggested in an earlier post, IMO there actually is more harm to a female victim in this circumstance than to the male victim, this being due to the stud/slut disparity mentioned above. I think the reasons for this disparity are as above but even if you disagree with that, the disparity exists, and societal attitudes of this sort are a strong factor in psychological harm.] Independent of all the above, there’s a general tendency of people to view – or be willing to view women as helpless victims and men as more responsible for their actions. You see this a lot in cases of crimes committed by groups which include both genders, in which women tend to be successful at portraying themselves as victims and pawns in the hands of controlling men, even when on closer look that turns out to not be the case (or the opposite in some cases). As a result of the above, when you get to statutory rape situations where the evil and criminal aspect is based on the notion that the older person is leading, controlling and manipulating the younger one, that rings more true to most people when it’s the older man leading, controlling, and manipulating the younger female, as compared to when it’s the notion of the older female leading, controlling, and manipulating the younger male. Bottom line is that as a result of the two factors mentioned above, cases in which underage males have relationships with older women don’t fit the mold of the victims being damaged by a predator nearly to the same extent as underage females having relationships with older males. (Again, I think it’s actually true that the harm is not the same, but I think the above factors tend to exaggerate that perceived disparity.) ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2017, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-prep-school-math-teacher-arrested-for-having-inappropriate-sexual-contact-with-male-students/788790/97 "2017-06-15T17:15:30Z")
[QUOTE=Fotheringay-Phipps] In general, men are assumed to want sex more than women […] there’s a general tendency of people to view – or be willing to view women as helpless victims and men as more responsible for their actions […] Bottom line is that as a result of the two factors mentioned above, cases in which underage males have relationships with older women don’t fit the mold of the victims being damaged by a predator nearly to the same extent as underage females having relationships with older males. [/QUOTE] Your post basically boils down to the fact that our strongly gendered societal expectations assume that males are supposed to always have sexual autonomy. So in a sexual situation, we tend to insist on seeing the male either as a predator or as an autonomous participant who’s not the victim of a predator. Because for a male to be a victim in such a situation would be perceived as unnatural and unmanly. Which is essentially the same as what I’ve been saying, and for the same reason: it’s down to entrenched sexist preconceptions about gender. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2017, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-prep-school-math-teacher-arrested-for-having-inappropriate-sexual-contact-with-male-students/788790/98 "2017-06-15T17:18:57Z")
No, it has nothing to do with that at all. If you insist on forcing the terms “sexual autonomy” and “unmanly” in there when paraphrasing then you can make it sound alike, but that’s not anything I said or meant. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2017, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-prep-school-math-teacher-arrested-for-having-inappropriate-sexual-contact-with-male-students/788790/99 "2017-06-15T17:45:15Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > No, it has nothing to do with that at all. > > If you insist on forcing the terms “sexual autonomy” and “unmanly” in there when paraphrasing then you can make it sound alike, but that’s not anything I said or meant. Sure it is. You’re talking about cultural stereotypes of sexual relationships as intrinsically a “positive” for men, for whom “getting the sex” automatically causes them to be perceived as “winners” and “getting what they want”. In other words—and yes, to me these seem to be very analogous words—there’s a stereotype that **men are expected to have control and autonomy in sex**. “Getting what they want” is pretty much synonymous with control and autonomy. Consequently, it’s stereotypically perceived as unnatural for men, _un-manly_, if their sexual encounters are **not** about men “getting what they want” and **not** a “positive” for them. You’re apparently trying to claim that you’re making some entirely different kind of point from mine, but AFAICT it’s potayto, potahto. ---
**Author:** ![sitchensis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sitchensis/32/4892_2.png) [@sitchensis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sitchensis)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2017, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-prep-school-math-teacher-arrested-for-having-inappropriate-sexual-contact-with-male-students/788790/100 "2017-06-15T17:46:20Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Which is why **that** situation **also** shouldn’t get an automatic _WOO-HOO YEAH BRO WAY TO GET SOME!_ reaction from outsiders. Yes it should, because it’s awesome. The only thing better than sex as a 15 year old is sex as a 16 year old…ect. Should it be shamed and hidden? Should young people be made to feel bad about it? Should their peers condemn them? > [@Kimstu](#): > > The fact that men tend to react to the hearsay sexual experiences of other men as some kind of spectator sport in which they reflexively cheer their “player” for “scoring”, as I said, is more about sexist gender-roles conditioning than rational thought. If there is a stud/slut dynamic you seem to be advocating the slut part is the good part. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-prep-school-math-teacher-arrested-for-having-inappropriate-sexual-contact-with-male-students/788790.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-prep-school-math-teacher-arrested-for-having-inappropriate-sexual-contact-with-male-students/788790.md?page=6)