# A puzzle for you. **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [June 8, 2014, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-puzzle-for-you/690353 "2014-06-08T21:25:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Idle\_Thoughts](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/838e76/32.png) [@Idle\_Thoughts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Idle_Thoughts)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2014, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-puzzle-for-you/690353/1 "2014-06-08T21:25:14Z")
There are three people: Jack, Frank, and Tina. Jack is married. Frank is not. And finally, Jack is looking at Tina, and Tina is looking at Frank. The question is: Is a married person looking at an unmarried person? A. Yes B. No C. The answer cannot be determined Answer in here before you look at the answer and feel free to explain how you figured your answer. Answer: [spoiler]The answer is yes. Let’s say Tina is MARRIED. Well, that would make the statement true. A married person (Tina) was looking at an unmarried person (Frank). Let’s say she’s UNMARRIED. The statement is still true. A married person (Jack) is looking at an unmarried person (Tina). No matter if Tina is married or unmarried, the answer is the same[/spoiler] ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2014, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-puzzle-for-you/690353/2 "2014-06-08T21:45:14Z")
The answer is [the same as the last time you posted this puzzle](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=704884). 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2014, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-puzzle-for-you/690353/3 "2014-06-08T23:08:55Z")
My answer (without looking at the spoiler) isYes. Tina is either married or unmarried. If Tina is married then married Tina is looking at unmarried Frank. If Tina is unmarried then married Jack is looking at unmarried Tina. So we know a married person is looking at an unmarried person even if we don’t know which people are in the pair.eta: Looking at Thudlow Boink’s link, I see I got it right last time also. ---
**Author:** ![magnusblitz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b4bc9f/32.png) [@magnusblitz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magnusblitz)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-puzzle-for-you/690353/4 "2014-06-09T00:12:31Z")
I like the idea in the last thread that the answer is only “yes” if we assume that all three people are persons (and not iguanas, or dogs, or mannequins, etc) ---
**Author:** ![Biotop](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biotop/32/321_2.png) [@Biotop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biotop)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-puzzle-for-you/690353/5 "2014-06-09T00:27:09Z")
Suppose Tina is married, but her marriage is only recognized in certain states. Further suppose our group is standing on the border of two states with different definitions of legal marriage, with two participants standing in a one state, and the third in the other state… Unlikely… but it can’ be determined for sure! ---
**Author:** ![donkeyoatey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47c2d/32.png) [@donkeyoatey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/donkeyoatey)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-puzzle-for-you/690353/6 "2014-06-09T00:57:10Z")
What if it’s Tina Louise and she refuses to participate in this obvious attempt to exploit her fame? ---
**Author:** ![Biotop](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biotop/32/321_2.png) [@Biotop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biotop)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-puzzle-for-you/690353/7 "2014-06-09T01:03:07Z")
> [@donkeyoatey](#): > > What if it’s Tina Louise and she refuses to participate in this obvious attempt to exploit her fame? I Don’t think Jack’s wife is going to like him staring at Tina Louise. ---
**Author:** ![Dead\_Cat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9fc29f/32.png) [@Dead\_Cat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dead_Cat)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 8:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-puzzle-for-you/690353/8 "2014-06-09T08:27:58Z")
Without looking at the answer, I can’t see how the answer is anything other than “C. The answer cannot be determined”. But that wouldn’t be very interesting, so I assume I have missed something. Ooh, wait: If Tina is unmarried, than the answer is Yes because Jack is looking at Tina. If Tina is married, then the answer is Yes because Tina is looking at Frank. Since these are the only two possibilities, the answer is A: Yes. And having looked at the posted answer before posting this, I see I got it right. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 10:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-puzzle-for-you/690353/9 "2014-06-09T10:03:30Z")
> [@Biotop](#): > > Suppose Tina is married, but her marriage is only recognized in certain states. Further suppose our group is standing on the border of two states with different definitions of legal marriage, with two participants standing in a one state, and the third in the other state… > > Unlikely… but it can’ be determined for sure! I’m not sure that really provides a loophole. Jack’s and Frank’s marital stati are given as part of the premise, so it doesn’t really matter where they stand, the status stays the same. So, once again, the puzzle hinges on Tina’s status. If she’s straddling a state line, one of which recognizes her marriage and one doesn’t, she could be considered to be simultaneously married and unmarried. But then the answer to the puzzle is still ‘yes’, because married Jack is looking at unmarried Tina, _and_ married Tina is looking at unmarried Frank. The only way out is to posit some scenario in which Tina is outside of any jurisdiction or definition of marriage (or isn’t a person, as **magnusblitz** suggested). ---
**Author:** ![Biotop](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biotop/32/321_2.png) [@Biotop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biotop)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 10:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-puzzle-for-you/690353/10 "2014-06-09T10:42:57Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > I’m not sure that really provides a loophole. Jack’s and Frank’s marital stati are given as part of the premise, so it doesn’t really matter where they stand, the status stays the same. I see you are correct. We might disagee on whether Tina is married or not, but that is not part of the answer. Hmm… there must be some variation that might change the answer. Back to the drawing board! ---
**Author:** ![Biotop](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biotop/32/321_2.png) [@Biotop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biotop)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 10:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-puzzle-for-you/690353/11 "2014-06-09T10:57:28Z")
Okay, I like this one: Same as above, Jack married, Frank not. Jack is looking at Tina. Tina is looking at Fred. Fred is looking at Mary. Mary is looking at Joe. Joe is looking at Susie. Susie is looking at Frank. So is a married person looking at an unmarried one? ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 11:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-puzzle-for-you/690353/12 "2014-06-09T11:52:59Z")
> [@Biotop](#): > > Okay, I like this one: > > Same as above, Jack married, Frank not. > > Jack is looking at Tina. Tina is looking at Fred. Fred is looking at Mary. Mary is looking at Joe. Joe is looking at Susie. Susie is looking at Frank. > > So is a married person looking at an unmarried one? Nope, Susie’s still an iguana. Otherwise, yes: somewhere in the lookin’ at chain there’s got to be a married person looking at an unmarried one. ---
**Author:** ![Biotop](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biotop/32/321_2.png) [@Biotop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biotop)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-puzzle-for-you/690353/13 "2014-06-09T19:38:07Z")
How about this then… * * * 6 people are in our room. All named characters are human. Jack is married. Frank is not. Jack is looking at Tina. Tina is looking at Fred. Fred, distracted, is looking at the iguana. Mary is looking at Joe Joe is looking at Susie Susie is looking at Frank. Given that the number of married people in the room is not equal to the number of unmarried people, is a married person looking at an unmarried one? ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-puzzle-for-you/690353/14 "2014-06-09T19:46:51Z")
> [@Biotop](#): > > How about this then… > > * * * > > 6 people are in our room. All named characters are human. Jack is married. Frank is not. > > Jack is looking at Tina. > > Tina is looking at Fred. > > Fred, distracted, is looking at the iguana. > > Mary is looking at Joe > > Joe is looking at Susie > > Susie is looking at Frank. > > Given that the number of married people in the room is not equal to the number of unmarried people, is a married person looking at an unmarried one? I think the answer is yes. It could be that Jack, Tina, and Fred are all married, and Mary, Joe, and Susie are not married, and in that case no married person is looking at an unmarried person. But then the numbers are equal. There could be loopholes–for example, a character is also looking at someone else and you didn’t mention that, or Mary also goes by the name Tina, and there’s an unnamed sixth person in the room, or something–but that’s all a stretch. ---
**Author:** ![Biotop](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biotop/32/321_2.png) [@Biotop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biotop)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-puzzle-for-you/690353/15 "2014-06-09T19:59:52Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > There could be loopholes–for example, a character is also looking at someone else and you didn’t mention that, or Mary also goes by the name Tina, and there’s an unnamed sixth person in the room, or something–but that’s all a stretch. I like the way you think! ---
**Author:** ![Biotop](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biotop/32/321_2.png) [@Biotop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biotop)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-puzzle-for-you/690353/16 "2014-06-09T20:12:49Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > There could be loopholes–for example, a character is also looking at someone else and you didn’t mention that, or Mary also goes by the name Tina, and there’s an unnamed sixth person in the room, or something–but that’s all a stretch. Interestingly enough, I don’t think any of the loopholes you mention change the answer from a definitive “yes” as long as we assume that distracted Fred is a different person from Jack, Joe and Frank… ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-puzzle-for-you/690353/17 "2014-06-09T20:37:38Z")
> [@Biotop](#): > > Interestingly enough, I don’t think any of the loopholes you mention change the answer from a definitive “yes” as long as we assume that distracted Fred is a different person from Jack, Joe and Frank… First there’s a problem in your story: the characters are Jack, Tina, Fred, Mary, Joe, Susie, and Frank. That’s seven characters, not six. If we take Fred out of the story and have Tina look at an iguana, we’re down to six characters. Second, the extra name scenario works, although I think it has to be Mary Susie and not Mary Tina: Jack and Tina are unmarried. Frank, Joe, Mary Susie, and LarryBobJimmy are all married. Jack is looking at Tina. Tina, distracted, is looking at the iguana. Mary [Susie] is looking at Joe Joe is looking at Susie [Mary] Susie is looking at Frank. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-puzzle-for-you/690353/18 "2014-06-09T20:43:26Z")
> [@Biotop](#): > > How about this then… > > * * * > > 6 people are in our room. All named characters are human. Jack is married. Frank is not. > > Jack is looking at Tina. > > Tina is looking at Fred. > > Fred, distracted, is looking at the iguana. > > Mary is looking at Joe > > Joe is looking at Susie > > Susie is looking at Frank. > > Given that the number of married people in the room is not equal to the number of unmarried people, is a married person looking at an unmarried one? Actually, given the original scenario, it’s undetermined. If there are six people in the room, obviously one of the people named is not in the room. The Jack/Tina/Fred group are all unmarried; Fred is the dude outside, looking at an iguana. The Mary/Joe/Susie/Frank group are unmarried and are all in the room. 2 married, four unmarried. Other combinations match the rules and have a married person looking at an unmarried one. ---
**Author:** ![Biotop](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biotop/32/321_2.png) [@Biotop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biotop)\ **Post date:** [June 9, 2014, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-puzzle-for-you/690353/19 "2014-06-09T20:43:27Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > First there’s a problem in your story: the characters are Jack, Tina, Fred, Mary, Joe, Susie, and Frank. That’s seven characters, not six. :smack: Dang! They didn’t tell me there would be counting here. Frank could have been looking in from the window… Meanwhile…I am still trying to work out what happens if Joe is Jack or Frank… Grrr…