# A question about witnessing in Great Debates **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [May 1, 2014, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-about-witnessing-in-great-debates/687453 "2014-05-01T18:14:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2014, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-about-witnessing-in-great-debates/687453/1 "2014-05-01T18:14:53Z")
**Boyo Jim** just posted this in GD: > [@Why do I believe in God?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-i-believe-in-god/687073/133): > > This thread is a perfect example of what is wrong with this forum. > > The thread was not posted as a debate topic. It is witnessing, and though it is in the “correct” forum for witnessing threads, IMO this is the worst forum for them. > > The thread has not claimed that the stated reasons are in any way superior to other reasons either for or against the existence of a God. The OP does not want to debate anyone about the validity of his reasons. > > Yet here the thread lies in a place where just about everyone else _assumes_ the intent is to debate reasons for God, or to proclaim the reasons and insist they are unassailable. And so the pile-on begins. Does he have a point, and would the result be any different if witnessing threads were moved to any other forum? ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2014, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-about-witnessing-in-great-debates/687453/2 "2014-05-01T18:20:25Z")
I think there would be a great deal more direct humor and mockery if they were posted in MPSIMS, IMHO, or the Pit. I don’t know that that would be an improvement. Also, to me, the entire purpose of GD is to post things you want to discuss, but we seem to have relatively few people who actually want to discuss their religious viewpoints… they just want to run them up the flagpole and expect everybody to salute, and that ain’t gonna happen here. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2014, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-about-witnessing-in-great-debates/687453/3 "2014-05-01T18:38:02Z")
What can you do in GD that you can’t do in another forum? I can’t see which response to a thread like this wouldn’t also show up someplace else. It’s not like GD is the only place people argue. Perhaps if someone is really trying to see their religious product and doesn’t want any argument, they can post it in Marketplace. But if they don’t want backtalk the SDMB isn’t the place to post. We could make them post in the Pit. That would be fun. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![TubaDiva](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tubadiva/32/507_2.png) [@TubaDiva](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TubaDiva)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2014, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-about-witnessing-in-great-debates/687453/4 "2014-05-01T18:47:29Z")
If you look at the description of the forum it says clearly: > [@](#): > > For long-running discussions of the great questions of our time. **This is also the place for religious debates and (if you feel you must) witnessing.** [Bolding mine] That’s really the best place for it – so many of these religious discussions are “long-running.” Just because you don’t support someone else’s point of view doesn’t mean they’re not entitled to state it. (Within reasonable limits, of course.) You’re not even required to read it. You don’t have to agree; in fact, the very soul of Great Debates is just that, discussion and debate, opposing views. You have semi-free will and can choose your discussions and debates. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2014, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-about-witnessing-in-great-debates/687453/5 "2014-05-01T19:30:07Z")
As I understand it, **Boyo Jim** ’s point was that maybe there was a place to post these witnessing OPs in which they would be protected from being criticized from mean old GD denizens. (Like me.) I’m fine with the current rule myself. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2014, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-about-witnessing-in-great-debates/687453/6 "2014-05-01T20:00:37Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > As I understand it, **Boyo Jim** ’s point was that maybe there was a place to post these witnessing OPs in which they would be protected from being criticized from mean old GD denizens. (Like me.) Like, say, stuck to the OP’s refrigerator with a magnet? ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2014, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-about-witnessing-in-great-debates/687453/7 "2014-05-01T20:05:38Z")
> [@](#): > > Now is there anybody, got a sweet little woman like mine? > There got to be somebody, got a, got a sweet little woman like mine? Yeah! > Can I get a witness? > Can I get a witness? > Can I get a witness? Yeah… > Can I get a witness? Ohhh… > Can I get a witness? Yeah… > Can I get a witness? Yes. … ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2014, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-about-witnessing-in-great-debates/687453/8 "2014-05-01T20:31:00Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > As I understand it, **Boyo Jim** ’s point was that maybe there was a place to post these witnessing OPs in which they would be protected from being criticized from mean old GD denizens. (Like me.) > I’m fine with the current rule myself. I thought the point is that if the OP has no desire to actually discuss/debate the topic, that they should have a way to say that or post to a place where its obvious that ‘discussion is irrelevant’ to the OP. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2014, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-about-witnessing-in-great-debates/687453/9 "2014-05-01T20:33:24Z")
> [@simster](#): > > I thought the point is that if the OP has no desire to actually discuss/debate the topic, that they should have a way to say that or post to a place where its obvious that ‘discussion is irrelevant’ to the OP. Are we talking about a special forum where no discussion at all is allowed when someone “witnesses”, or would only approving posts be allowed? ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2014, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-about-witnessing-in-great-debates/687453/10 "2014-05-01T20:37:02Z")
If anyone wants to witness, I think it only proper that they be sworn in. ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2014, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-about-witnessing-in-great-debates/687453/11 "2014-05-01T20:39:16Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > If anyone wants to witness, I think it only proper that they be sworn in. On a Bible. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2014, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-about-witnessing-in-great-debates/687453/12 "2014-05-01T20:43:13Z")
I think **Boyo Jim** feels that witnessing would be a better fit in IMHO/MPSIMS, where they can be openly mocked from the get-go, without wasting time attempting to engage them. An idea I totally support. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2014, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-about-witnessing-in-great-debates/687453/13 "2014-05-01T20:55:43Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Are we talking about a special forum where no discussion at all is allowed when someone “witnesses”, or would only approving posts be allowed? Some MBs (even VB MBs) have blogging. Let them blog it. Someone wants to read it or not read it, fine. Wacky Witnessing rarely leads to informative, reasonable debate. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2014, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-about-witnessing-in-great-debates/687453/14 "2014-05-01T21:41:48Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > If anyone wants to witness, I think it only proper that they be sworn in. And then sworn at. Drive-by posters don’t work in any forum. In GD the mocking may be more subtle, but it is still there. If only we had a time machine or precog to allow us to close threads where the poster is fated to never return. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2014, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-about-witnessing-in-great-debates/687453/15 "2014-05-01T21:43:12Z")
Do people object to the witnessing or to the drive-by nature of the witnessing in many cases? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2014, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-about-witnessing-in-great-debates/687453/16 "2014-05-01T21:49:43Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > Do people object to the witnessing or to the drive-by nature of the witnessing in many cases? Personally, I object to witnessing threads where the OP is fishing for admiration/approval. Everything is fine and/or dandy when people agree with the OP, but when people that don’t buy in start asking questions the barriers go up faster than a helium balloon in an express elevator. How many times have we seen variations of “But I’m not here to convince/convert anybody-I’m just giving my opinion!” I’ve seen threads that go on for many pages just filled with the OP “not trying to convert anybody”. ---
**Author:** ![Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a587f6/32.png) [@Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freddy_the_Pig)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2014, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-about-witnessing-in-great-debates/687453/17 "2014-05-01T22:03:28Z")
I wasn’t around when **Cecil** divided up the forms–I believe it was on the fourth day of Creation–but I’ve always assumed witnessers were directed to Great Debates as warning that witnessing was _inherently_ debate-provoking, whether the witnesser wanted it or not. If you want to post that you got engaged or saw a pretty bird or heard a funny joke, you can drop it into MPSIMS and be justified in not expecting or wanting a debate. If you just accepted Christ as your personal savior, that’s different. It’s a profound assertion about how the universe works, and a challenge to everybody of a different religion or of no religion. Expect a debate. We can’t force you to participate, but don’t be surprised when it breaks out. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2014, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-about-witnessing-in-great-debates/687453/18 "2014-05-01T22:16:41Z")
When someone witnesses they often don’t want to debate. But there is a line around the block of those that do want to debate the topic. GD is the best place for it. If you don’t like those types of threads don’t open them. No one is forcing you to read a Pit thread with naughty words, a thread about baseball or even worse a Skald hypothetical. ---
**Author:** ![kayT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayt/32/3633_2.png) [@kayT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayT)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2014, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-about-witnessing-in-great-debates/687453/19 "2014-05-01T23:14:11Z")
Well, **kayaker** , since you put that as a quote I can’t quote you easily, but thanks for that. I’ll be asking for a witness for the rest of the night, I expect. ---
**Author:** ![Ranger\_Jeff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranger_jeff/32/2065_2.png) [@Ranger\_Jeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranger_Jeff)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2014, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-about-witnessing-in-great-debates/687453/20 "2014-05-02T00:12:13Z")
I feel it’s sort of a toss up whether witnessing belongs in GD or IMHO. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-about-witnessing-in-great-debates/687453.md?page=2)