# A question for MLB fans **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [May 10, 2002, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-for-mlb-fans/108359 "2002-05-10T20:37:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2002, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-for-mlb-fans/108359/21 "2002-05-12T22:26:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by lurkernomore \* > \*\*One interesting point I heard about Montreal - there is a school of thought that the area has become “more French” in recent years with the separatist feelings, with the French-leaning moving to Quebec and the English-leaning out. The English speakers supposedly support baseball better. Any locals have an opinion? Maybe the best they can support is a AAA teams like the old Royals? There is a AAA-level team in Milwaukee…oops, that 's the Brewers… \*\* This doesn’t make any sense. Separatist sentiment and government anti-Anglophonism in Montreal ran at its all-time high between 1976 (election of the Parti Quebecois) to the early 80’s (repatriation of the Constitution and the PQ’s first fall from power.) It was in those years that Expo attendance was actually pretty darned good. The Expos have been horribly, horribly mismanaged (In a business sense; they have at times made good on-field moves.) I believe the team would have failed if they’d been based in St. Louis; it was that bad. ---
**Author:** ![sfwarlock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b19c9b/32.png) [@sfwarlock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sfwarlock)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2002, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-for-mlb-fans/108359/22 "2002-05-12T23:17:31Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Green Bean \* > \*\*Re: the Giambi situation– > > Giambi wanted a no-trade clause. The A’s wouldn’t give it to him. They could have locked him in for a lot less than the Yankees are paying him. > > The A’s don’t have him because the A’s didn’t want him. > > Say what you will about the big bad Yankees. Hell, I may even agree with you. But Giambi is a bad example. \*\* The A’s couldn’t give him the no trade because at that point no one knew if the previous year had been a fluke (and indeed, for half of 2001, it sure looked that way) - as a small market team, they \*\*couldn’t afford \*\* to commit to that contract if they needed to go through another rebuilding. When’s the last time Yankees fans had to suffer through almost a decade of losing years (for Oakland, 1993 through 1998) to be over .500 again? ---
**Author:** ![sfwarlock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b19c9b/32.png) [@sfwarlock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sfwarlock)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2002, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-for-mlb-fans/108359/23 "2002-05-12T23:30:14Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by BobT \* > **When a “small market” team has a breakout year and then has players it can’t afford, they go and replace him with a younger player who makes less. It’s really not that hard to figure out.** Which means they go through the following cycle - build team through farm system and trades, get good players, players want too much money, goto 10. Whereas teams like the Yankees do this - build team through outbidding others for free agents, get great players, players want big contracts, pay them easily. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickM](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7feea3/32.png) [@PatrickM](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickM)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2002, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-for-mlb-fans/108359/24 "2002-05-13T00:20:21Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by BobT \* > \*\* > > \ > Also if you configure the contracts correctly, you can keep players for most of their high-producing years. Cleveland did this in the early 1990s and enabled them to grow into a powerhouse and make it to the World Series twice. Eventually Cleveland was able to turn its success in the field to success at the box office and the Indians became a “large market” team. > \ > \*\* Of course, it also helps to build a team when it can trade Felix Fermin for a young Omar Vizquel and Eddie Taubensee for a young Kenny Lofton, and have a farm system that produces Albert Belle, Manny Ramirez and Jim Thome all at the roughly the same time! As far as “configuring the contracts correctly” that means sweet-talking the young players into ignoring their agents’ advice and signing a long-term contract at below the going rate. At least that’s what John Hart claims he did in building the 1990’s era Indians. That’s great if you can do it, but it isn’t something that’s readily repeatable. ---
**Author:** ![lurkernomore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d6d6ee/32.png) [@lurkernomore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lurkernomore)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2002, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-for-mlb-fans/108359/25 "2002-05-13T03:19:07Z")
Hart signed the kids he believed in - it turned out to be less than market, because they panned out. If they had failed, he’d have benchwarmers making a couple of million each. Good moves, unlike the get-Rocker\_wherever-I\_go. ---
**Author:** ![Nanook\_of\_the\_North\_Shore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bc8723/32.png) [@Nanook\_of\_the\_North\_Shore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nanook_of_the_North_Shore)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2002, 4:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-for-mlb-fans/108359/26 "2002-05-13T04:13:41Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by sfwarlock \* > \*\* > > The A’s couldn’t give him the no trade because at that point no one knew if the previous year had been a fluke (and indeed, for half of 2001, it sure looked that way) - as a small market team, they \*\*couldn’t afford \*\* to commit to that contract if they needed to go through another rebuilding. When’s the last time Yankees fans had to suffer through almost a decade of losing years (for Oakland, 1993 through 1998) to be over .500 again? \*\* You mean like the majority of the 80’s and early 90’s? > [@](#): > > Which means they go through the following cycle - build team through farm system and trades, get good players, players want too much money, goto 10. > > Whereas teams like the Yankees do this - build team through outbidding others for free agents, get great players, players want big contracts, pay them easily. Thats not how the Yankees do it now. Thats how they attempted to do it throughout the 80’s, and they stunk then. What they do now is “build team through farm system and trades, get good players, players want too much money” they give it to them, with a sprinkling of the later part of what you said. ---
**Author:** ![BobT](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8e8cbc/32.png) [@BobT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobT)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2002, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-for-mlb-fans/108359/27 "2002-05-13T04:57:42Z")
The Yankees are actually fairly discriminating when it comes to acquiring free agents. They usually focus on one or two that they want and give that guy what he wants. It’s not like the Yankees are trying to corner the market on all the good players. And the Yankees of 2002 aren’t in first place anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2002, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-for-mlb-fans/108359/28 "2002-05-13T05:24:14Z")
> [@](#): > > And the Yankees of 2002 aren’t in first place anyway. They will be. Williams, Giambi, Johnson, and White will have markedly better offensive numbers by the end of the season, and they’re getting Pettite back. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2002, 7:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-for-mlb-fans/108359/29 "2002-05-13T07:38:57Z")
No work stoppage. Nope. No way, Jose. No, no, no, no… I don’t like the big greedy salaries, but what business is it of mine? Just because someone says he’s worth 15 mil, that’s no reason to actually _give_ him 15 mil. The Dodgers are finally learning the lesson of what happens when you overpay players. Owners have to learn not to be pushed around by agents. ---
**Author:** ![DynoSaur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DynoSaur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DynoSaur)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2002, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-for-mlb-fans/108359/30 "2002-05-14T04:57:39Z")
**Gadarene** , I think you’re overconfident about the improvement to be expected from Giambi, Johnson, and White. Giambi’s getting to the age where he can reasonably be expected to get worse. Johnson’s in his first year in the league. And the only numbers Rondell White will rack up will be days spent on the DL. Of course, they’re still going to win the AL East. ---
**Author:** ![JonScribe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/3be4f8/32.png) [@JonScribe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JonScribe)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2002, 6:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-for-mlb-fans/108359/31 "2002-05-14T06:01:28Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by spooje \* > \*\*The Dodgers are finally learning the lesson of what happens when you overpay players. Owners have to learn not to be pushed around by agents. \*\* And so are the Rangers. I can’t tell you the joy it brings me to watch a Mariners-Rangers game and watch A-Rod (whom I do not blame for leaving) have a multi-hit, multi-RBI game and still watch Texas lose to Seattle. Texas did not have to pay him that much. Sure, if they were hot for him they needed to outbid the other contenders, but Texas paid Alex much more than they needed. And look where it’s gotten them. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-for-mlb-fans/108359.md?page=1)