# A question on tax cuts for Obama supporters **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 6, 2008, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-on-tax-cuts-for-obama-supporters/462262 "2008-09-06T00:43:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 7\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-on-tax-cuts-for-obama-supporters/462262/21 "2008-09-06T13:07:23Z")
I suspect Obama’s math has something to do with just how wealthy the super-wealthy are getting. This phenomenon manifests itself both in terms of personal income… [Richest Are Leaving Even the Rich Far Behind](http://www.commondreams.org/headlines05/0605-01.htm) > [@](#): > > The average income for the top 0.1 percent was $3 million in 2002, the latest year for which averages are available. That number is two and a half times the $1.2 million, adjusted for inflation, that group reported in 1980. No other income group rose nearly as fast. > > The share of the nation’s income earned by those in this uppermost category has more than doubled since 1980, to 7.4 percent in 2002 And in terms of net worth… [The Rich Get Richer](http://www.fivecentnickel.com/2008/02/08/net-worth-values-the-rich-get-richer/) > [@](#): > > [T]here is currently a huge disparity between the median and mean net worth values in the United States… > > …For those that need a statistics refresher, the median is the value separating the higher half of the sample from the lower half, whereas the mean is the plain old arithmetic average. So what this disparity indicates is that some fraction of those individual in the upper half of the sample are way, way, way above the median, thereby dramatically inflating the mean… > > **1960** : Median = $8,690; Mean = $10,420 (Median is 83% of mean.) > **1976** : Median = $13,549; Mean = $16,893 (Median is 80% of mean.) > **1982** : Median = $19,446; Mean = $26,259 (Median is 74% mean.) > **2004** : Median = $93,100; Mean = $448,200 (Median is 21% mean.) > > As you can see, the numbers have become increasingly skewed over the years. In fact, since 1960, the median household net worth in the United States has increased 10.7-fold, whereas the mean has increased 43-fold. I’d say those in the upper echelons can certainly stand to carry considerably more weight in taxes than they’ve been carrying the past couple of decades. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-on-tax-cuts-for-obama-supporters/462262/22 "2008-09-06T13:18:20Z")
> [@spoke-](#): > > And in terms of net worth… > > [The Rich Get Richer](http://www.fivecentnickel.com/2008/02/08/net-worth-values-the-rich-get-richer/) This cite isn’t credible. I followed this cite, and eventually I get to some guy writing as ‘g’ who left this as a comment on someone’s blog. ‘g’ cites historical Federal reserve data, and provides one link. I couldn’t find any obvious substantiation of g’s data at the link he gave. Dead end. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-on-tax-cuts-for-obama-supporters/462262/23 "2008-09-06T20:43:07Z")
Well, at least when I’m wrong I don’t do it by any half measures! Thanks for the replies…will check out the links when I get home. The new improved board doesn’t seem as friendly to my ohone. -XT ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-on-tax-cuts-for-obama-supporters/462262/24 "2008-09-06T21:05:15Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > The new improved board doesn’t seem as friendly to my ohone. You’re right about that! Whatever you’re doing with your ohone, we’d appreciate it if you didn’t involve the board, OK? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2008, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-on-tax-cuts-for-obama-supporters/462262/25 "2008-09-07T02:20:20Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > This cite isn’t credible. [This site](http://allfinancialmatters.com/2007/03/12/who-was-or-is-the-richest-man-in-the-u-s/) provides similar numbers for 2004 (see the first comment), and cites a (pdf)[Federal Reserve survey](http://www.federalreserve.gov/PUBS/oss/oss2/2004/bull0206.pdf). Do you doubt the numbers? And if so, which ones? ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2008, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-on-tax-cuts-for-obama-supporters/462262/26 "2008-09-07T02:53:47Z")
> [@SmartAleq](#): > > [here’s a link to an Obama and McCain plan tax calculator](http://econ4obama.blogspot.com/2008/09/obama-tax-policy-and-mccain-tax-policy.html) Either this site is wrong, or [this doper recommended one](http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/factchecking_obama.html) is. (one of the “three facts” cited twice on your site is supposedly wrong by 40 million, another by 14%) Since the factcheck site doesn’t have a candidate’s name in the URL and has been evenhandedly correcting both McCain and Obama, I’m inclined to think it’s the more reliable. If two out of three facts they cite are embellished, how truthful should we consider their calculations? ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2008, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-on-tax-cuts-for-obama-supporters/462262/27 "2008-09-07T03:08:30Z")
Hmm. You are right **RTF**. The numbers on net worth don’t check out. Going to the source (the Federal Reserve surveys), here are the numbers I can confirm (warning- pdf links): [1962](http://www.federalreserve.gov/pubs/oss/oss2/6263/bull0364.pdf): Median net worth = $7,550 Mean net worth = $22,588 (Median is 33% of mean) [1983](http://www.federalreserve.gov/pubs/oss/oss2/89/bull0192.pdf): Median net worth = $42,700 Mean net worth = $149,100 (Median is 29% of mean) [1989](http://www.federalreserve.gov/pubs/oss/oss2/89/bull0192.pdf): Median net worth = $47,200 Mean net worth = $183,700 (Median is 26% of mean) [1995](http://www.federalreserve.gov/PUBS/oss/oss2/2004/bull0206.pdf): Median net worth = $70,800 Mean net worth = $260,800 (Median is 27% of mean) [2004](http://www.federalreserve.gov/PUBS/oss/oss2/2004/bull0206.pdf): Median net worth = $93,100 Mean net worth = $448,200 (Median is 21% of mean) Median net worth increased 12.33 fold while mean net worth increased 19.84 fold. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-question-on-tax-cuts-for-obama-supporters/462262.md?page=1)