# A theory I saw about how COVID may have escaped from the Wuhan lab **URL:** \ **Category:** The Quarantine Zone\ **Tags:** covid-quarantine\ **Created:** [February 17, 2021, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-theory-i-saw-about-how-covid-may-have-escaped-from-the-wuhan-lab/933082 "2021-02-17T03:49:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 26
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-theory-i-saw-about-how-covid-may-have-escaped-from-the-wuhan-lab/933082/502 "2023-02-28T18:00:43Z")
Actually the conclusion of the latest report was that it might, but the evidence is weak. So, base your tirade on weak evidence, you get weak and underwhelming arguments like the ones in your post. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-theory-i-saw-about-how-covid-may-have-escaped-from-the-wuhan-lab/933082/503 "2023-02-28T18:03:45Z")
If that’s the case, let’s hear your counter argument in support of the collusion between various institutions to suppress and censor legitimate inquiry? What are the benefits to censorship and suppression? ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-theory-i-saw-about-how-covid-may-have-escaped-from-the-wuhan-lab/933082/504 "2023-02-28T18:07:03Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > Actually the conclusion of the latest report was that it might, but the evidence is weak. So, base your tirade on weak evidence, you get weak and underwhelming arguments like the ones in your post. The reason it’s weak is because China destroyed the evidence and punished anyone who spoke up or any nation that suggested an investigation. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-theory-i-saw-about-how-covid-may-have-escaped-from-the-wuhan-lab/933082/505 "2023-02-28T18:17:53Z")
My impression has been that the claims for censorship are just the same as the ones from the right who claim that they are being silenced. > **[‘Lab-leak’ and natural origin proponents face off—civilly—in forum on...](https://www.science.org/content/article/lab-leak-and-natural-origin-proponents-face-civilly-forum-pandemic-origins)** > > Science-sponsored face-to-face debate was long overdue, scientists say In essence, even that frame that they want to use in the case of “hiding” or “censoring” is based on shaky evidence from right wing sources. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-theory-i-saw-about-how-covid-may-have-escaped-from-the-wuhan-lab/933082/506 "2023-02-28T18:20:28Z")
And that does not leave them off the hook, IMHO both origins can be considered, but it is really silly to ignore other possibilities as the right wing is demanding right now. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-theory-i-saw-about-how-covid-may-have-escaped-from-the-wuhan-lab/933082/507 "2023-02-28T18:29:51Z")
There was considerable effort to dismiss the theory at the start and it became political. Which is strange considering the efforts China went to prevent it from being investigated. When you say that it does not leave them off the hook seems to dismiss the seriousness of what they did. I would think that people from both sides of the political aisle would demand an accounting of what is known. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-theory-i-saw-about-how-covid-may-have-escaped-from-the-wuhan-lab/933082/508 "2023-02-28T18:31:02Z")
No, that will be if I had said that they were left off the hook, I did not say that. ---
**Author:** ![Tfletch1](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tfletch1/32/5340_2.png) [@Tfletch1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tfletch1)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2023, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-theory-i-saw-about-how-covid-may-have-escaped-from-the-wuhan-lab/933082/509 "2023-03-01T00:53:32Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > In essence, even that frame that they want to use in the case of “hiding” or “censoring” is based on shaky evidence from right wing sources. I know. The idea the lab leak theory is being censured is absolutely absurd. Even information having “low confidence” is plastered in headlines. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2023, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-theory-i-saw-about-how-covid-may-have-escaped-from-the-wuhan-lab/933082/510 "2023-03-02T01:16:29Z")
> [@Tfletch1](#): > > I know. The idea the lab leak theory is being censured is absolutely absurd. Even information having “low confidence” is plastered in headlines. The statement from the FBI chief stating China lab leak most likely is “low confidence”? ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2023, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-theory-i-saw-about-how-covid-may-have-escaped-from-the-wuhan-lab/933082/511 "2023-03-02T14:16:51Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > > [@Procrustus](#): > > > > Couldn’t that be true in either scenario? > > Yes. It could. But the lab adds a significant layer of direct involvement with the Chinese government. They shut down trade with Australia over remarks suggesting it. The much bigger issue is that China intentionally destroyed all the evidence they could get their hands on. That was widely reported at the time. Honestly, that seems like a much more germane issue than whether the virus first infected a human in the lab or in the market. It puzzles me that the letter gets tons of press and the former is rarely mentioned. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2023, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-theory-i-saw-about-how-covid-may-have-escaped-from-the-wuhan-lab/933082/512 "2023-03-02T14:44:33Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > > [@Tfletch1](#): > > > > You replied to my post. > > No, I didn’t. FWIW: > **Tfletch1** Guest > > Actually, I care if it’s one of the first two. Improving virus handling protocols is going to be way easier than preventing spillover from the wild. Even if hygiene in wet markets are improved, the chances of getting the virus from nature is so much higher. It’s what worries me the most. > > 2 Replies > > **Magiver** Guest > > Saying it was natural versus manufactured is not germane to the idea that it escaped from the Wuhan lab. > > **Novelty\_Bobble** Guest > > I agree, having some certainty about where it came from can only be a good thing no matter what the answer is… ---
**Author:** ![Tfletch1](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tfletch1/32/5340_2.png) [@Tfletch1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tfletch1)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2023, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-theory-i-saw-about-how-covid-may-have-escaped-from-the-wuhan-lab/933082/513 "2023-03-02T23:45:09Z")
The statement that bumped this thread was from the energy department, as you well know since you’re the one who bumped the thread. Now FBI chief, Wray, is saying that it is likely (after I posted). Even his own FBI says this with “moderate confidence”. Meanwhile other intelligence agencies, and scientists who investigated it, favor the wet market hypothesis. One of the authors of the investigations walks you through this in several tweets. > ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2023, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-theory-i-saw-about-how-covid-may-have-escaped-from-the-wuhan-lab/933082/514 "2023-03-03T01:20:45Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > The much bigger issue is that China intentionally destroyed all the evidence they could get their hands on. That was widely reported at the time. Honestly, that seems like a much more germane issue than whether the virus first infected a human in the lab or in the market. I agree. Destroying evidence speaks volumes. ---
**Author:** ![wguy123](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wguy123/32/3161_2.png) [@wguy123](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wguy123)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2023, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-theory-i-saw-about-how-covid-may-have-escaped-from-the-wuhan-lab/933082/515 "2023-03-03T01:55:11Z")
AFAIK, click the “reply” button at the bottom of the thread versus the “reply” button from the last poster if you want to reply to the thread, versus the last poster. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2023, 7:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-theory-i-saw-about-how-covid-may-have-escaped-from-the-wuhan-lab/933082/516 "2023-03-03T07:47:56Z")
> [@Tfletch1](#): > > One of the authors of the investigations walks you through this in several tweets. But the problem with that investigation, and with any investigation done so far is that we can have little confidence in any analysis performed on data supplied by China when we know for a fact that they have destroyed and otherwise withheld information and also have a oft-stated motivation to have one preferred outcome from any investigation undertaken. Might this be the full story? Sure, but what confidence should we have that it is? ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2023, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-theory-i-saw-about-how-covid-may-have-escaped-from-the-wuhan-lab/933082/517 "2023-03-03T17:13:12Z")
It’s semi-hilarious that many pundits and news outlets hyping FBI support for the lab leak theory are the same ones who earlier denounced FBI investigations for being politically motivated and unreliable. Beyond having a preponderance of evidence favoring a wild source for the virus, those doubting a lab leak can’t help noting that the most vociferous lab leak proponents tend to be antivaccine, anti-masking and denouncers of Fauci and other public health experts. These folks want us to think that if they can implicate scientists and government entities in genesis of the pandemic, then all pandemic control measures can be dismissed. It’s an asinine, self-destructive viewpoint but popular among a certain demographic. As for China, it may well be concealing information relating to its role in disease spread, but it also is secretive and uncooperative with outside entities in general. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2023, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-theory-i-saw-about-how-covid-may-have-escaped-from-the-wuhan-lab/933082/518 "2023-03-03T19:11:46Z")
> [@Tfletch1](#): > > Meanwhile other intelligence agencies, and scientists who investigated it, favor the wet market hypothesis. Scientists have no bearing on the conversation since all the evidence was destroyed. All they can comment on is whether or not the virus appeared to be manipulated and that is not germane to this thread A government agency has access to intel that is outside of the scientific community. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2023, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-theory-i-saw-about-how-covid-may-have-escaped-from-the-wuhan-lab/933082/519 "2023-03-03T19:12:29Z")
> [@wguy123](#): > > AFAIK, click the “reply” button at the bottom of the thread versus the “reply” button from the last poster if you want to reply to the thread, versus the last poster. I didn’t know there was a difference. Thanks ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2023, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-theory-i-saw-about-how-covid-may-have-escaped-from-the-wuhan-lab/933082/520 "2023-03-03T20:53:08Z")
First lets have evidence of suppression. Note that a bunch of scientists saying a particular theory is probably false and so not including it in their consensus report is not suppression. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2023, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-theory-i-saw-about-how-covid-may-have-escaped-from-the-wuhan-lab/933082/521 "2023-03-03T22:15:58Z")
It’s widespread knowledge at this point that social media companies were censoring the lab leak origin of the pandemic. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-theory-i-saw-about-how-covid-may-have-escaped-from-the-wuhan-lab/933082.md?page=25) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-theory-i-saw-about-how-covid-may-have-escaped-from-the-wuhan-lab/933082.md?page=27)