# A thought for Excalibre **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 15, 2006, 6:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thought-for-excalibre/360782 "2006-06-15T06:17:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Ensign\_Edison](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ab992/32.png) [@Ensign\_Edison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ensign_Edison)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thought-for-excalibre/360782/81 "2006-06-15T19:00:33Z")
[QUOTE=Left Hand of Dorkness] Hmm, what to do? On the one hand, I always look forward to **Excalibre’s** posts. Even when I disagree with him, they’re always well-written, and they’re very often chock full of fascinating stuff. On the other hand, I also really like **FinnAgain’s** posts, and look forward to reading them, too. I don’t know what grudge the two of them have against each other, but I’m sad that it exists. Oh well. Daniel [/QUOTE] You think that’s rough? I’m trying to figure out what grudge Good Daniel has against Bad Daniel and why they’re both trying to confuse the hell out of me. Half the time I agree with you completely, and the other half I want to shake you until some sense falls out. I’m pretty sure this means that I’m the one who’s wrong somewhere, but I can’t figure out on which end, exactly. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thought-for-excalibre/360782/82 "2006-06-15T19:07:05Z")
[QUOTE=Ensign Edison] You think that’s rough? I’m trying to figure out what grudge Good Daniel has against Bad Daniel and why they’re both trying to confuse the hell out of me. Half the time I agree with you completely, and the other half I want to shake you until some sense falls out. I’m pretty sure this means that I’m the one who’s wrong somewhere, but I can’t figure out on which end, exactly. 😉 [/QUOTE] Or it could be that the half you agree with is the half that I post when I’m not utterly stressed out by school. Or it could be that you agree with the half of me that doesn’t post about messageboard issues (for some reason I get more grief over my posts **about** the Straight Dope than I do about all my other posts combined). I’m trying to cut down on my vitriol; hopefully I’m succeeding. I don’t admire vitriol in others, so I ought to minimize it in myself. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thought-for-excalibre/360782/83 "2006-06-15T19:08:37Z")
LHoD posts with vitriol? Color me shocked. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thought-for-excalibre/360782/84 "2006-06-15T19:12:48Z")
OK. Anaamika 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Ponder\_Stibbons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ponder_stibbons/32/343_2.png) [@Ponder\_Stibbons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ponder_Stibbons)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thought-for-excalibre/360782/85 "2006-06-15T19:12:53Z")
[QUOTE=Anaamika] LHoD posts with vitriol? Color me shocked. [/QUOTE] Me, too. I could’ve sworn he posted in Asheville. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thought-for-excalibre/360782/86 "2006-06-15T19:31:22Z")
[QUOTE=Excalibre] Not that you harbor a grudge, exactly, but you remember the _exact_ circumstances in which I wronged you and you’re going to share them with the class, eh? [/quote] Believe it or not, we have trackers. And yes, it stands out in my mind as an example of true freakin’ over the top paranoid lunacy. Which I notice you didn’t touch on. Must be hard thinking that people who apologize are out to get you. Unless you were trolling, but I don’t think that’s the case, I just think you’re batshit nuts. [QUOTE=Excalibre] I don’t fault you for wanting to take the opportunity to pile on someone else in order to raise your social standing [/QUOTE] That’s it exy, that’s it exactly. And if I’d tried to be polite and bury the hatchet again, it’d be an attack on you! Get over yourself you fucking lunatic. Oh, and, you twit, irraitonal meltdowns? You mean the ones that are always substantiated with facts, cites, and correct reasoning? You mean, valid anger? Or does that not translate in paranoid-land? Fuck off nutcase. ---
**Author:** ![Excalibre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/898d66/32.png) [@Excalibre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Excalibre)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thought-for-excalibre/360782/87 "2006-06-15T20:25:04Z")
[QUOTE=Starving Artist] Sheesh…I entered one thread – and one thread only – in which I vigorously defended **Liberal** [/QUOTE] Incidentally, while I suspect I didn’t find nearly all of them, because of the difficulty on searching for “liberal” and his own skill at turning unrelated threads into Liberal pittings, I _have_ thus far found these _three_ pit threads in which you defended him. [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=322706&highlight=liberal](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=322706&highlight=liberal) Your first post in this one is “I like ol’ Lib, and I usually enjoy and agree with what he has to say. I’ll open threads I ordinarily wouldn’t just from seeing his name as the last poster. Lib is da bomb!” and you go on to suggest that you and he are persecuted members of a minority on the boards. The self-pity gets sorta thick; you might not want to read down too far. [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=319875&highlight=liberal](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=319875&highlight=liberal) This pit thread concerns an instance in which Liberal deliberately invited people to pile on him, ostensibly to “protect” another poster who was being pitted. You defended Liberal’s habit of attention-whoring (and arguably trolling, since deliberately provoking a pile-on seems to qualify.) [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=300811&highlight=liberal](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=300811&highlight=liberal) You first post in this thread: > [@Starving Artist](#): > > I like Liberal! Quite a lot, actually. Always have. I like the often succinct way he cuts through superfluous bullshit. I like the fact that he’s…well…let’s face it…smarter than most of us. He has a better vocabulary, too. I like the way you never know how he’s going to come down on any particular issue. And I find his posts in general to be more insightful, accurate, unemotional, and intellectually superior (or at least more intellectually mature) than those of most of us around here. > > I enjoy Lib. Again with the ass-kissing; it’s not enough, of course, to state that you enjoy a poster’s contributions - for you, it seems to be something of a habit to abase yourself in comparison to him. It’s actually not just ol’ **Libby** , though: In one of those threads, you said this to me: > [@Starving Artist](#): > > Hoo, boy, this is rich! You dare to condescend to Shodan like this? What are you, crazy??? > > You remind of the feisty kid in an old western who’s a quick draw but no match for the seasoned gunfighter he insists upon provoking. The gunfighter knows the kid is no match and tries to go easy on him, but the kid persists in his silly provocations until finally the gunfighter has little choice but to waste him. > > So I’d proceed with caution if I were you. Pit wits wit’ Shodan, my friend, and you won’t have a wit to pit wit’. And those things are not particularly unusual coming from you; you lay down oddly effusive praise of virtually anyone who shares your politics; this is not the only time in which you explicitly declared me stupider than some other poster ( **Harborwolf** ’s response: “Seriously, you’re starting to sound like that little terrier from the Warner Bros. cartoons that follows the bulldog around going ‘Yeah boss! Sure thing boss!’”). This thread is a good illustration; it’s full of these posts in which you quote something someone sharing your politics said and then - exactly as **Harborwolf** described, yapping about how _incredibly_ right the other person is. Paging through a few of your old posts, I’m actually struck my how often you explicitly contrasted my intelligence with that of other posters and found me lacking - and this, even with the likes of **Shodan** (bless his heart, he tries). This is long before the “falling out” between us you describe above; for a very long time, you’ve made a habit of jumping into arguments between me and your “friends” to simply assert that I’m stupider than they are. It’s sort of pathetic to read these threads and see folks like **Liberal** being pursued by you, making desperate attempts to kiss up to them; it’s also quite interesting to see that your obsessive focus on my intelligence actually predated us having any real contact; it seems that the complex here is yours, and whenever you and I find ourselves on opposite sides of a disagreement, you show this desperation to prove that I’m stupider than the people on your side, _even though you won’t make that assertion for yourself_. The only real explanation I can come up with for this behavior is that it appears you feel as if you’re stupid, so you follow after the likes of **Liberal** and **Shodan** and brag about how much smarter _they_ are than your opponents. Incidentally, your claim about only having defended **Liberal** in one thread? Hogwash. It was easy to find these three; I personally remember others but I can’t find them - nevertheless, this is enough to prove that you were, quite simply, making up a lie that sounded good to you. I have to say that, seeing your ill treatment of me prior to our little disagreement, I have to wonder how it is that you manage to feel that I wronged you or mistreated you in that incident. You were abominably patronizing to me for months; even then, I felt a good deal of pity for you, as you didn’t seem to be able to argue your points competently, but you can hardly claim that what I said to you was undeserved or that I treated you in any way worse than you treated me. You’re not a very nice person, **Starving Artist**. You’re nice selectively; you’re effusive to certain people, but you’re consistently patronizing to others, even when you can’t formulate an argument to save your life. I’m certain you have allies around here; what puzzles me is why you expected that I might become one of them. As for your obsession with trying to quantify my intelligence and trying to kiss the asses of those on your side, I guess that I no longer have the same contempt for you - at this point, I’m left only with the pity that I mentioned earlier. I wish, for your sake, that you felt better about yourself, and that you didn’t need to try to make yourself feel better by inflating those around you and insulting those who don’t share your opinions. > [@Liberal](#): > > I believe that that comment goes to the heart of how to discern criticism from attacks. It seems to me that most of the useful criticism has already been offered, and all that remains is pointless bashing from people who say that I bash too much. It is amusing, but not useful, so I think I’ll sign out of here now. Thanks, Artist, not only for sticking up for me, but for giving me insights that I had not explored. I will forever remember your kindness. And I see from your example just how important kindness can be. > [@Starving Artist](#): > > Thank you very much, Liberal. I hardly know what to say. I can’t recall a time here when I’ve been so touched or honored. You’ve certainly made the time I’ve spent here worthwhile. I can’t tell you how much I appreciate the things you said. > > Regards, > SA It’s amazing to see the way you and **Liberal** massaged each other’s [del]penises[/del] egos in that thread and how desperate you both seemed to be for approval. I wish I’d been nicer to **Liberal** now - he wasn’t usually very nice to me, but looking back at some of these posts, I just wonder how badly he was hurting deep down to be so hungry for affection that you “forever remember” a compliment from a stranger on an internet messageboard. Now I’m sad. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Excalibre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/898d66/32.png) [@Excalibre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Excalibre)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thought-for-excalibre/360782/88 "2006-06-15T20:31:30Z")
[QUOTE=FinnAgain] Oh, and, you twit, irraitonal meltdowns? You mean the ones that are always substantiated with facts, cites, and correct reasoning? You mean, valid anger? Or does that not translate in paranoid-land? [/quote] I don’t believe I’ve seen those. > [@](#): > > Fuck off nutcase. Look, dude, I just used up my pity quota for the next month on **Starving Artist**. Look, you’re a smart kid. I understand that you are dyslexic and that makes posting on these boards a particular effort for you, and I admire that. I’m sorry that something I said to you was so obviously deeply upsetting to you. I stand by the basic fact that you attacked me unnecessarily in that first thread; I also stand by my right not to accept your apology - and obviously, I was quite right not to, because judging by your further behavior in that thread, you didn’t mean a word of it. I don’t think I owe you an apology for disliking you, given your behavior. But I am sorry that my dislike has been so painful for you. ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thought-for-excalibre/360782/89 "2006-06-15T20:35:47Z")
[QUOTE=Excalibre] Now I’m sad. ☹ [/QUOTE] Here’s a Kleenex, honey. Don’t ask me why I came up here just to add that. It just seemed like the right thing to do. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thought-for-excalibre/360782/90 "2006-06-15T21:05:00Z")
[QUOTE=bup] 😃 And, for the rest of you, how is holding a contrary literary opinion proof of ignorance? [/QUOTE] What the fuck, we’re not supposed to call people ignorant anymore? I thought fighting ignorance was the whole point of this place? ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thought-for-excalibre/360782/91 "2006-06-15T21:06:54Z")
I think it’s no secret that **Excalibre** and I dislike each other. Nevertheless, in all honesty, he contributes ten times as much value to the SDMB as those pinnacles of pretentious pontificatory **Roger Thornhill** and **Starving Artist** put together. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thought-for-excalibre/360782/92 "2006-06-15T21:10:25Z")
[QUOTE=Frank] I think it’s no secret that **Excalibre** and I dislike each other. Nevertheless, in all honesty, he contributes ten times as much value to the SDMB as those pinnacles of pretentious pontificatory **Roger Thornhill** and **Starving Artist** put together. [/QUOTE] there’s a **ratings chart?!?!?!** where!!! ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thought-for-excalibre/360782/93 "2006-06-15T21:14:25Z")
[QUOTE=wring] there’s a **ratings chart?!?!?!** where!!! [/QUOTE] :smack: I was supposed to pass it on to you when I was done making my edits to it, but I totally forgot, and it’s been on my desk for weeks. My fault, dude; it’s in your email. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thought-for-excalibre/360782/94 "2006-06-15T21:18:08Z")
[QUOTE=wring] there’s a **ratings chart?!?!?!** where!!! [/QUOTE] In my mind. I’ll elaborate, just to make sure I completely kill your joke. 🙂 I frequently learn something from the former, even if sometimes it’s only how to better control my blood pressure. I cannot think of one thing I’ve learned from either of the latter, unless it’s how to put together a sentence that sounds nice but doesn’t mean anything. ---
**Author:** ![Excalibre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/898d66/32.png) [@Excalibre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Excalibre)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thought-for-excalibre/360782/95 "2006-06-15T21:32:37Z")
[QUOTE=Frank] even if sometimes it’s only how to better control my blood pressure. [/QUOTE] Clinical studies suggest that the DASH diet is as effective as most common blood-pressure drugs. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thought-for-excalibre/360782/96 "2006-06-15T21:36:57Z")
[QUOTE=Anaamika] LHoD posts with vitriol? [/QUOTE] Now with New! Improved! _ **VITRIOL!** _[sup]TM[/sup] Strong enough to handle the toughest shitstains! ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thought-for-excalibre/360782/97 "2006-06-15T21:37:26Z")
[QUOTE=Guinastasia] What the fuck, we’re not supposed to call people ignorant anymore? I thought fighting ignorance was the whole point of this place? [/QUOTE] You’re ignorant. Did I just fight ignorance? And, in case you think I’m calling for a rule or something; no, I’m just saying that if **Excalibre** does ever actually change someone’s mind rather than condescend, he might consider another tack. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thought-for-excalibre/360782/98 "2006-06-15T21:40:12Z")
Thing is, **bup** , it seems to me that, when faced with the honey-or-vinegar options for dealing with flies, **Excalibre** goes for the flyswatter. ---
**Author:** ![Antinor01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecae2f/32.png) [@Antinor01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antinor01)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thought-for-excalibre/360782/99 "2006-06-15T21:56:04Z")
[QUOTE=EddyTeddyFreddy] Thing is, **bup** , it seems to me that, when faced with the honey-or-vinegar options for dealing with flies, **Excalibre** goes for the flyswatter. [/QUOTE] Or perhaps he just likes the smell of napalm in the morning. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Excalibre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/898d66/32.png) [@Excalibre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Excalibre)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2006, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thought-for-excalibre/360782/100 "2006-06-15T21:56:48Z")
[QUOTE=bup] You’re ignorant. Did I just fight ignorance? And, in case you think I’m calling for a rule or something; no, I’m just saying that if **Excalibre** does ever actually change someone’s mind rather than condescend, he might consider another tack. [/QUOTE] I find it fascinating that you’re basing your entire appraisal of me upon one single incident; actually, based upon emails and other off-board interactions with people on here, I know that there are actually a number of occasions in which I’ve changed people’s minds on things. That said, I’m not always that patient. I don’t think what you said merited all that much patience. It’s way too much effort to try to argue an aesthetic opinion, frankly. Especially since there’s always people who will pop up to claim that any aesthetic judgment whatsoever is entirely subjective and the very idea of suggesting that different works of art are different in quality is wrong. I disagree with those people. Frankly, your opinion that Harry Potter constitutes the greatest literature of our era is _stupid_. I’m sorry if you find that condescending. I assure you that I didn’t mean to condescend at all; I meant to insult you. Sometimes, I’ve discovered that people who are entirely impervious to reason _will_ go away and shut up if you insult them enough. When that’s all you can do, well, it’s nice to have peace and be able to have real conversations with interesting people. Besides, what would I gain out of a discussion with someone like you? If I really, really worked hard, I’d have a small chance of getting you to change a stupid opinion. Why in the world do you keep implying that that is, or should be, my goal? I have a life; even if I didn’t, the SDMB is full of conversations that are far more interesting than one with you could be. Why the hell would I want to waste that much of my time, when the opinion in question is so irrelevant and so profoundly dumb? > [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > Thing is, bup, it seems to me that, when faced with the honey-or-vinegar options for dealing with flies, Excalibre goes for the flyswatter. Certainly I do, at times. I hope that’s not always the case; there’s a lot of things I’ve very willing to discuss to death, and I’ve probably spent enough time here patiently explaining why “nucular” is a valid pronunciation of the word that I could have learned Mycaenean Greek instead. Some discussions are interesting enough that they’re worth it to me. Some of them aren’t. There’s going to be flies out there to matter what; sometimes it’s useful just to clear the room with a few good whacks of the flyswatter and be able to converse in peace afterwards. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thought-for-excalibre/360782.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thought-for-excalibre/360782.md?page=6)