# A thread for Gulftiger to discuss politics **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 30, 2024, 12:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-gulftiger-to-discuss-politics/1005006 "2024-07-30T12:02:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![bobsmom101](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobsmom101/32/2867_2.png) [@bobsmom101](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobsmom101)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2024, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-gulftiger-to-discuss-politics/1005006/41 "2024-07-30T19:04:51Z")
The article is paywalled so I couldn’t read it. I believe Trump when he says he didn’t read the Project 2025 manifesto and doesn’t know what’s in it – there are plenty of reports from his own WH staff about his reluctance to read anything of substance. I truly believe he doesn’t even care what it says, apart from guaranteeing sovereign-like powers to the chief executive. So it’s of little consequence to him who is in charge of P2025. . ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2024, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-gulftiger-to-discuss-politics/1005006/42 "2024-07-30T19:14:51Z")
> [@bobsmom101](#): > > The article is paywalled so I couldn’t read it. Here is a non-paywalled version. > **[Head of pro-Trump Project 2025 steps down as Democrats ramp up attacks](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/project-2025-paul-dans-steps-down-heritage-foundation/)** > > Project 2025, overseen by the Heritage Foundation, includes a sweeping policy agenda that seeks to serve as a blueprint for the next Republican presidential administration. Don’t take the departure of Dans as a sign that the plans are canceled. Far from it. > A Project 2025 advisory board member said the initiative’s work is likely to continue, adding it was a “natural progression of the project” to submit its work, including a database of potential hires and a list of policy recommendations for the first six months of a potential second Trump term, to the former president’s campaign for review. Dans himself is a former member of the Trump administration, and other people who were in the Trump administration are involved. > Trump [appointed](https://www.ncpc.gov/news/item/131/) Dans in January 2021 to serve as chairman of the National Capital Planning Commission, though President Biden removed him from the post after taking office, according to the [Washington Post](https://www.washingtonpost.com/entertainment/biden-removes-trump-appointees/2021/02/10/6b449a90-6ba9-11eb-9f80-3d7646ce1bc0_story.html). Other former officials with the Trump administration who contributed to Project 2025’s policy guide include Russ Vought, who led the Office of Management and Budget; former acting Defense Secretary Chris Miller; and Ben Carson, who led the Department of Housing and Urban Development. Suggestions that Trump has no involvement are laughable. I also believe that Trump doesn’t really know everything in it, he’s not the kind of person to bother himself with minutiae according to people who have attended briefings with Trump. But neither is he fully ignorant of it, that just doesn’t seem plausible to me. Lest people forget, **cooperation with Trump is the whole point of it** , it’s part of their official agenda as attested to above by someone with the project. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2024, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-gulftiger-to-discuss-politics/1005006/43 "2024-07-30T20:28:26Z")
I don’t claim familiarity with Project 2025 except in the most general terms, but I see at least potential parallels between it and the now-defunct Project for a New American Century (PNAC) which heavily influenced the GWB administration. Bush himself didn’t seem to be much involved, much as Trump isn’t apparently involved at all in P2025, but that doesn’t matter. PNAC principals and founders like Cheney and Wolfowitz and many others became key strategists in the Bush administration, largely ran its foreign policy, and were directly responsible for instigating the war in Iraq as part of the PNAC plan to advance American hegemony in the Middle East and around the world. I suspect the same will happen if Trump is elected, except that P2025 seems largely concerned with fascist domestic policy rather than hegemonistic foreign policy. Trump is a vapid idiot and will simply do what P2025 plotters and the Heritage Foundation tell him to do, much as the Federalist Society dictated his choice of Supreme Court nominees. The election of Trump and the empowerment of these dangerous fascists may portend the most dangerous period in American history since the Revolutionary War that secured its independence and Americans thought they had established a stable democracy. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2024, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-gulftiger-to-discuss-politics/1005006/44 "2024-07-30T20:40:03Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > Trump is a vapid idiot and will simply do what P2025 plotters and the Heritage Foundation tell him to do, much as the Federalist Society dictated his choice of Supreme Court nominees. Precisely. Trump _is_ the plan, regardless of whether or not he criticizes it. It would be the equivalent of anyone else who griped about their boss, but then did what their boss told them anyway. You can’t take their griping as evidence that they aren’t going to go along with it. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2024, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-gulftiger-to-discuss-politics/1005006/45 "2024-07-30T20:46:05Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > I also believe that Trump doesn’t really know everything in it, he’s not the kind of person to bother himself with… … reading. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2024, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-gulftiger-to-discuss-politics/1005006/46 "2024-07-30T20:49:26Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > … reading. I’m not even talking about reading. I’m talking about paying attention to things people are telling him. [https://www.usnews.com/opinion/thomas-jefferson-street/articles/2018-02-09/why-it-matters-that-trump-doesnt-read-his-daily-intelligence-briefings](https://www.usnews.com/opinion/thomas-jefferson-street/articles/2018-02-09/why-it-matters-that-trump-doesnt-read-his-daily-intelligence-briefings) As reported, he just wants pictures and an oral presentation, and that isn’t going to get into the particulars. ---
**Author:** ![Mundane\_Super\_Hero](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mundane_super_hero/32/6304_2.png) [@Mundane\_Super\_Hero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mundane_Super_Hero)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2024, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-gulftiger-to-discuss-politics/1005006/47 "2024-07-30T21:03:00Z")
> [@Beckdawrek](#): > > I’m out. Troll. > > (Meant for gulf-whathisface) \< fist-bump \> Seconded. So, motion carried? ---
**Author:** ![Mundane\_Super\_Hero](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mundane_super_hero/32/6304_2.png) [@Mundane\_Super\_Hero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mundane_Super_Hero)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2024, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-gulftiger-to-discuss-politics/1005006/48 "2024-07-30T21:04:28Z")
> [@GulfTiger](#): > > Haven’t read yet but saw this come across the wire that the P25 guy quit after Trump’s criticism. > > [https://www.wsj.com/politics/elections/project-2025-head-steps-down-89cba52b?mod=e2tw](https://www.wsj.com/politics/elections/project-2025-head-steps-down-89cba52b?mod=e2tw) Means he has full control, albeit indirect control. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2024, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-gulftiger-to-discuss-politics/1005006/49 "2024-07-30T21:19:11Z")
> [@Beckdawrek](#): > > (Meant for gulf-whathisface) I keep reading it as **Gutfinger**. (But then I read **Wookinpanub** as **Wookie In A Pub**.) ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2024, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-gulftiger-to-discuss-politics/1005006/50 "2024-07-30T21:26:17Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > I keep reading it as **Gutfinger**. (But then I read **Wookinpanub** as **Wookie In A Pub**.) HOLY CRAP, I read both those names that way. 🤯 ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2024, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-gulftiger-to-discuss-politics/1005006/51 "2024-07-30T21:27:28Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > Wookie In A Pub Pubs are all the wrong places! ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2024, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-gulftiger-to-discuss-politics/1005006/52 "2024-07-30T21:28:04Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > > [@Beckdawrek](#): > > > > (Meant for gulf-whathisface) > > I keep reading it as **Gutfinger** I dunno what I read it as, but it makes me feel like having a shrimp cocktail with spicy horseradish cocktail sauce, featuring of course gulf tiger shrimp (aka Asian tiger shrimp [_Penaeus monodon_]) that used be exclusively found in Asia and Indonesia but are now found in US gulf waters. How did they get there? Perhaps our friend **Gulftiger** ’s username is a veiled comment on illegal immigration? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2024, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-gulftiger-to-discuss-politics/1005006/53 "2024-07-30T21:30:28Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > I dunno what I read it as, but it makes me feel like having a shrimp cocktail with spicy horseradish cocktail sauce And you’d pair it with a Caesar to drink, wouldn’t you? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![bobsmom101](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobsmom101/32/2867_2.png) [@bobsmom101](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobsmom101)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2024, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-gulftiger-to-discuss-politics/1005006/54 "2024-07-30T21:30:57Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > Here is a non-paywalled version. Thank you. I am still hoping GT will report back with his list of the policies and characteristics that motivate him to support DJT. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2024, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-gulftiger-to-discuss-politics/1005006/55 "2024-07-30T21:31:10Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > And you’d pair it with a Caesar to drink, wouldn’t you? The perfect combo! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![SuntanLotion](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suntanlotion/32/16165_2.png) [@SuntanLotion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SuntanLotion)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2024, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-gulftiger-to-discuss-politics/1005006/56 "2024-07-30T21:32:32Z")
[/quote] I keep reading it as **Gutfinger**. (But then I read **Wookinpanub** as **Wookie In A Pub**.) [/quote] I read it as Gutfeld, who I admire. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2024, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-gulftiger-to-discuss-politics/1005006/57 "2024-07-30T21:33:27Z")
> [@GulfTiger](#): > > Haven’t read yet but saw this So, you _want_ to continue to be seen as another pointless rightwing troll? ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2024, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-gulftiger-to-discuss-politics/1005006/58 "2024-07-30T21:33:30Z")
> [@bobsmom101](#): > > I am still hoping GT will report back with his list of the policies and characteristics that motivate him to support DJT. As long as GT is being sincere (which I know is a big if, after the reveal that they were indeed concern trolling), I do find it interesting to see their rationale. I’m not a believer that the Dope needs diversity in the sense that we need to bend over backward if a conservative posts here, and we can’t criticize them or be too harsh to not scare them off. (An attitude that has been expressed in the past.) But at the same time, when there is a little diversity, I welcome it for as long as it lasts (if it doesn’t come with undue disruption at the same time). ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2024, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-gulftiger-to-discuss-politics/1005006/59 "2024-07-30T21:40:26Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > t claim familiarity with Project 2025 except in the most general terms, but I see at least potential parallels between it and the now-defunct Project for a New American Century (PNAC) which heavily influenced the GWB administration. Y’know? I like the cut of your jib: > [@Project 2025 -- a RW blueprint for Autocracy](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/project-2025-a-rw-blueprint-for-autocracy/993262): > > A couple of Dopers have touched on it. It shows up in [a couple of threads](https://boards.straightdope.com/search?expanded=true&q=%22project%202025%22). But I think it deserves a bright light. Meet [Project 2025](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_2025): There is structure, infrastructure, planning, organization, and money behind this. Remember the [NeoConservatives](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoconservatism)? Remember [Project for the New American Century](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_for_the_New_American_Century)? Same shit, different day. “I’m not a member of any organized political party…. I’m a Democrat.” –Will Rogers Again: these people have machinery at their disposal that I’m not even sure Dem… ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2024, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-gulftiger-to-discuss-politics/1005006/60 "2024-07-30T21:56:38Z")
I didn’t see those other posts, but I obviously agree with you. The operative principle here is “Same shit, different day”. Far-right radicals are fairly consistent on promoting American hegemony in foreign policy, but only when it suits American interests. Thus they have no problem meddling in the Middle East, but when it comes to things like Putin’s invasion of Ukraine, one can quote the Orange Menace as saying “Putin can do whatever the hell he wants”. On domestic policy, it’s all about autocratic dictatorial powers to do what they want, with a generous side order of theocracy, without any messy meddling by intellectual thinkers or courts. Liberal thinkers and brown people have all got to go. In the MAGA mindset, the ideal fascist president would be a cross between Hitler and an Iranian Ayatollah. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-gulftiger-to-discuss-politics/1005006.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-gulftiger-to-discuss-politics/1005006.md?page=4)