# A Thread for the Mueller Investigation Results and Outcomes (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 28, 2017, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093 "2017-10-28T20:14:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 234
**Author:** ![CaptMurdock](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/captmurdock/32/11736_2.png) [@CaptMurdock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CaptMurdock)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2018, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/4662 "2018-05-17T18:02:12Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Ha! Another fish hunting witch expedition! 😃 I am _so_ stealing this. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2018, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/4663 "2018-05-17T18:05:54Z")
> [@Crotalus](#): > > Mnuchin [replaced the head of FinCEN](https://talkingpointsmemo.com/muckraker/democrats-crew-ask-mnuchin-recusal-cohen-sara) days after Manafort was indicted. Fuck me. Looks like our whistleblower already had an inkling of what was going to happen. Another avenue of inquiry for Mueller and his team. They must be so exhausted. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2018, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/4664 "2018-05-17T18:08:44Z")
Seen some stuff floating about which suggests that the records are not removed so much as “masked”. Which explains why other data which refers to the records in question are still there. To totally delete a record, you’d have to remove all referrals to that record. So, maybe Mueller or others asked that those records be temporarily unavailable, but haven’t actually gone into a bit bucket under the desk. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2018, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/4665 "2018-05-17T18:14:15Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > My guess is that the guy saw everyone else with access to inside info leaking like mad and decided to get in on the action. Let’s go to the quarry and throw stuff down there! You can’t possibly be serious! “In on the action” of leaking classified info? That’s fucking hilarious! ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2018, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/4666 "2018-05-17T18:18:36Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > I know I shouldn’t bother: > > _Sater told Cohen that GenBank operates “through Putin’s administration and nothing gets done there without approval from the top. The meetings in Moscow will be with ministers — in US, that’s cabinet-level and with Putin’s top administration people. This likely will include Dmitry Peskov, Putin’s press secretary. To discuss goals, meeting agenda and meeting time between Putin and Trump.”_ > > I’m sure that you know that you backed the wrong horse by now. Do you have you exit strategy for backtracking? You have a remarkable propensity for misunderstanding and misrepresenting stories that you post to this board. And your suggested “exit strategy for backtracking” is an interesting one in that you yourself rarely acknowledge your errors when these are pointed out, let alone bother with a strategy for backtracking. Generally you either ignore the issue or obfuscate. Let’s see what you go for this time. Your assertion - which I quoted earlier - was about “_promised meeting between Putin and Trump after the convention to finalize the deal_”. But this quote which purports to back it up is about a message sent “New Year’s Eve 2015”. Trump wasn’t even close to winning the nomination at that time - it was well before the first caucus or primary. What apparently confused you was that months later, after negotiations broke down Sater attempted to restart them and suggested a visit to Moscow, and Cohen said if Trump could come it would be after the convention. But at that point it wasn’t about a meeting with Putin. It’s pretty evident that you’re unable or indisposed to understand what you’re reading, which accounts for much of what you post to these threads. > [@Crotalus](#): > > ETA: The whistle-blower understood his/her legal jeopardy before releasing the information. Those of us who handle banking data get frequent training on the laws surrounding this stuff. There’s a difference between understanding the technical aspects of what could happen and understanding what’s likely to actually happen. As I wrote, “… the guy saw everyone else with access to inside info leaking like mad and decided to get in on the action. Then the feds opened an investigation into this particular leak …” > [@Eonwe](#): > > So, what he claimed happened gets a shrug from you; the real story, the thing worth commenting on here, is whether or not he’s self-serving in making the claim? What does “he claim happened” that you’re referring to? Regardless, what I comment on or don’t has to do with what interests me, and in general, anything already being said by many other people will not interest me. So your implication that something or other is getting “a shrug” from me is probably baseless. ---
**Author:** ![aurora\_maire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aurora_maire/32/328_2.png) [@aurora\_maire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aurora_maire)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2018, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/4667 "2018-05-17T21:11:31Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > So many witches… so little time. As an aside here, Jill Wine Banks is a prosecutor who worked on Watergate and is a MSNBC talking head. As someone who has an extensive collection of brooches, I noticed that she is always wearing interesting ones. Today she is wearing a witch on a broom. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2018, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/4668 "2018-05-17T21:25:26Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > My guess is that the guy saw everyone else with access to inside info leaking like mad and decided to get in on the action. Then the feds opened an investigation into this particular leak and it suddenly hit him that he was in some serious legal jeopardy. Further to this point, from [Bloomberg](https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-05-17/who-leaked-secret-bank-report-on-cohen-answer-may-come-soon) > [@Bloomberg](#): > > The identity of the law enforcement official who supplied details of Michael Cohen’s banking activities to media-savvy lawyer Michael Avenatti probably won’t remain secret for long, according to people who work in the field. > > Anyone who gains access to the government’s Financial Crimes Enforcement Network database of bank-generated suspicious activity reports, known as SARs, leaves an audit trail, they explained. So whoever searched for FinCEN reports filed against personal or business accounts associated with Cohen, President Donald Trump’s longtime personal lawyer, left a digital record that is almost certainly under review. > > Once the information became public through news reports, the Treasury Department’s inspector general began an inquiry into the suspected leak. So one it was announced that the leak was being investigated the guy probably pickeup pretty quickly that the jig was up. In addition: > [@Bloomberg](#): > > The official’s concern about disappearing bank records may have been overstated. Banks are required to keep all SARs for five years in their computers, according to Sanford Brown, a partner at Alston & Bird law firm and former bank regulator. > > According to people involved in SARs work, reports don’t vanish from the FinCEN database, either. Sometimes they are restricted, for example when the disclosure might compromise a criminal investigation, or when they involve a law enforcement employee who might himself be suspected of corruption or other wrongdoing. > > In the latter case, investigators would not want to let the person learn, by poring over his own suspicious activity reports, that he’s being watched. So it’s also most likely that the professed concern was groundless to begin with. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2018, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/4669 "2018-05-17T22:09:14Z")
[Happy Birthday, Mr. President](https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-russia-manafort-exclusive/exclusive-manaforts-former-son-in-law-cuts-plea-deal-to-cooperate-with-government-sources-idUSKCN1II2YM). (Reuters) 😃 > [@](#): > > The former son-in-law of Paul Manafort, the one-time chairman of President Donald Trump’s campaign, has cut a plea deal with the Justice Department that requires him to cooperate with other criminal probes, two people with knowledge of the matter said. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2018, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/4670 "2018-05-17T22:10:34Z")
> [@aurora\_maire](#): > > As an aside here, Jill Wine Banks is a prosecutor who worked on Watergate and is a MSNBC talking head. As someone who has an extensive collection of brooches, I noticed that she is always wearing interesting ones. Today she is wearing a witch on a broom. 🙂 Isn’t she something? I adore her. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![aurora\_maire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aurora_maire/32/328_2.png) [@aurora\_maire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aurora_maire)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2018, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/4671 "2018-05-17T23:54:34Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > Isn’t she something? I adore her. 😃 Her pins have a webpage. I had no idea she was wearing them as commentary. I just always thought they were cool. > **[Jill's Pins Content — Jill Wine-Banks](https://www.jillwinebanks.com/jills-pins-content?category=Jill%27s%20Pins)** ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2018, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/4672 "2018-05-18T00:50:27Z")
Bleach/dyed blonde of a certain (ie: my) age? Nixon prosecutor? Be still, my heart! ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2018, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/4673 "2018-05-18T13:34:08Z")
Giuliani now claiming that Mueller has[agreed to limit the scope](https://www.cnn.com/2018/05/18/politics/rudy-giuliani-mueller-interview-cnntv/index.html) of the questioning. Based on Giuliani’s recent credibility issues, we will likely hear by noon that Mueller has told them that he is expanding the scope of the questioning. ---
**Author:** ![Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/malleus_incus_stapes/32/3293_2.png) [@Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malleus_Incus_Stapes)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2018, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/4674 "2018-05-18T15:09:10Z")
> [@SaneBill](#): > > Yes, come to think of it, they actually are a lot like parabolic antennas. I wonder who developed them. CIA ? Now THAT is a Devilish plot. [Indeed.](http://web.archive.org/web/20100708230258/http://people.csail.mit.edu/rahimi/helmet/) ---
**Author:** ![Eonwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eonwe/32/240_2.png) [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2018, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/4675 "2018-05-18T15:55:33Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > What does “he claim happened” that you’re referring to? > > Regardless, what I comment on or don’t has to do with what interests me, and in general, anything already being said by many other people will not interest me. So your implication that something or other is getting “a shrug” from me is probably baseless. Oh, come on. Pretending like you don’t understand what’s being talked about makes you look like a liar or an idiot. Didn’t you read the article, or are you just making everything up? Heck, even if you didn’t read the article, it’s right there in the headline: “Whistleblower Leaked Damning Cohen Financial Documents Because They Were Disappearing From Government Financial Crimes Database.” That’s what “he claimed” happened. It’s the whole point of the article. And, my question, or accusation, to be more direct, is that you clearly think that the degree of selflessness or lack thereof involved in this guy coming forward is more important than whether or not the President and other members of the federal government are engaged in destroying evidence of illegal activity. You’re purposefully attempting to minimize the story by turning the focus of the conversation to the motivations of the whistleblower. How convenient that “what interests” you is how selfish the whistleblower is, and not how corrupt the current administration is. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2018, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/4676 "2018-05-18T16:45:35Z")
I don’t see anything that calls for me to add anything over my prior comment, so I’m going to let that stand. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2018, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/4677 "2018-05-18T17:00:49Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > I don’t see anything that calls for me to add anything over my prior comment, so I’m going to let that stand. Wrap it up boys. The defense rests, Elvis has left the building and good day to you all… he said, good day! Nobody flounces like you, Barmy. \*‘Cyril Phipps was tall and willowy, a young Englishman of the type so common in the Drones Club, Dover Street London, an institution of which… he remained a member in good standing. His disposition was intensely amiable, his hair the colour of creamery butter and his face one of those open, engaging faces which arose the maternal instinct in women…’Barmy in Wonderland . But in the opinion of Barmy’s employer, J.G. Anderson, Barmy has ‘…an I.Q. somewhat lower than that of a backward clam – a clam, let us say, which had been dropped on its head when a baby…’ \* - Barmy in Wonderland ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2018, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/4678 "2018-05-18T17:42:19Z")
Your frustration is understandable. But you need to learn to suck it up, IMO. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2018, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/4679 "2018-05-18T18:24:49Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > Your frustration is understandable. But you need to learn to suck it up, IMO. It is true that he should learn that inveterate liars with the intelligence of melted butter will never, and indeed _cannot_ change. Live is much more zen once you realize that the shit isn’t your fault and doesn’t have to be your problem. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2018, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/4680 "2018-05-18T18:26:30Z")
Based on that post, it doesn’t appear that you’ve reached that stage yet. But keep at it, it will be worthwhile in the end if you can get there. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2018, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/4681 "2018-05-18T18:28:34Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > Based on that post, it doesn’t appear that you’ve reached that stage yet. But keep at it, it will be worthwhile in the end if you can get there. Hmm? You didn’t see me trying to convince you to _stop_ being an inveterate liar with the intelligence of melted butter, did you? I don’t see how you could possibly infer a drive to correct you from that post. Well, aside from the whole “intelligence of melted butter” thing you have going on. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093.md?page=233) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093.md?page=235)