# A Thread for the Mueller Investigation Results and Outcomes (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 28, 2017, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093 "2017-10-28T20:14:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 373
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2018, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7443 "2018-11-07T23:44:24Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > It was supposed to be a surprise— we all chipped in to get you this trophy. I know it’s not much, but I hope you’ll enjoy inserting it. I admit: I laughed. p.s. Do I suck on it, or shove it up my ass? ---
**Author:** ![Dag\_Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/439d5e/32.png) [@Dag\_Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dag_Otto)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2018, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7444 "2018-11-07T23:46:08Z")
Wait, tell me more how as a layperson I can reseach the law and advise my State AG, who obviously is ignorant of the law. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2018, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7445 "2018-11-07T23:47:40Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > Here’s a tip: stop being so fucking complacent? Don’t ask me what I’m doing; ask yourself what you’re going to do. Seriously, folks, enough about me. I was right. You’re the ones who are shocked and surprised and angered. You’re the ones who thought this couldn’t happen. What are you all going to do? Oh wait, I know…knock on doors and vote. BWAHAHAHAHAH!!! And what do YOU think I should do? Murder somebody? I bet that’s it, isn’t it! MURDER IS AWESOME, BABY!!! ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2018, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7446 "2018-11-07T23:51:34Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > Here’s a tip: stop being so fucking complacent? Don’t ask me what I’m doing; ask yourself what you’re going to do. Seriously, folks, enough about me. I was right. You’re the ones who are shocked and surprised and angered. You’re the ones who thought this couldn’t happen. What are you all going to do? Oh wait, I know…knock on doors and vote. BWAHAHAHAHAH!!! The reason I asked what you were doing is that, because I don’t recall you ever expressing any course of action (to this second, I still don’t know what exactly you are exhorting people to do) or indicating that you’re doing anything yourself besides yelling at people on a message board, your urgency comes across as insincere and hollow. You advocate radical action (I think; like I said, I have no idea what you think is actually necessary, and you seem to be going out of your way to avoid giving any answers), but you seem content to yell “I was right” and do absolutely nothing else. Even if you were wrong, I’m not even sure you’d admit it; I’ve seen you move the goalposts on an assertion of completely factual basis. So I asked because I was wanting to see if you’d offer a reason for me to take you seriously, think you are actually right, or that you actually practiced what you preached. For all I know, you could be a Russian troll sent to demoralize left wingers or push them into violent acts so they can be arrested. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2018, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7447 "2018-11-07T23:54:00Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > And what do YOU think I should do? > > Murder somebody? I bet that’s it, isn’t it! MURDER IS AWESOME, BABY!!! Ask yourself. I’m not the one who started threads about other posters talking about how stupid and outrageous they were merely for posting their thoughts on current and future political trends. You want to crap on my threads and posts? Okay, I’ll be a good sport. But now that we’ve seen the reality - and everyone here can attest - I think we can say that my pessimism was warranted. I’ve even made specific predictions, including the prediction that once this election was over, Trump would assault the constitution, and that’s exactly what’s happening. Don’t ask me what I’m doing. I never asserted that I was some sort of Martin Luther King. I merely defended myself against accusations that my posts were overly-alarmist, and clearly, my alarmism was warranted. You’re the ones who have to explain yourselves, not me. I’ve been vindicated. I will continue to post my insights, and hopefully, perhaps they won’t be so easily dismissed by right-thinking, analytical posters. ---
**Author:** ![MindsEye\_Watering](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mindseye_watering/32/3619_2.png) [@MindsEye\_Watering](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MindsEye_Watering)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2018, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7448 "2018-11-07T23:55:28Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > What are you all going to do? Oh wait, I know…knock on doors and vote. BWAHAHAHAHAH!!! What do you suggest? I, for one, am all ears. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2018, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7449 "2018-11-07T23:56:48Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > The reason I asked what you were doing is that, because I don’t recall you ever expressing any course of action (to this second, I still don’t know what exactly you are exhorting people to do) or indicating that you’re doing anything yourself besides yelling at people on a message board, your urgency comes across as insincere and hollow. You advocate radical action (I think; like I said, I have no idea what you think is actually necessary, and you seem to be going out of your way to avoid giving any answers), but you seem content to yell “I was right” and do absolutely nothing else. Even if you were wrong, I’m not even sure you’d admit it; I’ve seen you move the goalposts on an assertion of completely factual basis. > > So I asked because I was wanting to see if you’d offer a reason for me to take you seriously, think you are actually right, or that you actually practiced what you preached. For all I know, you could be a Russian troll sent to demoralize left wingers or push them into violent acts so they can be arrested. No, don’t come at me with this bullshit. If I had been criticized for proposing the wrong course of action, then we could have that conversation. But the goalposts are being moved. I was criticized merely for being someone who opined that we were headed down the shit chute. I committed the cardinal sin of not being the drooling, stupified smiling American optimist. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2018, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7450 "2018-11-07T23:59:58Z")
> [@MindsEye\_Watering](#): > > What do you suggest? > > I, for one, am all ears. I say keep voting, keep organizing. But also understand that we live in times when the assaults on our ‘normal’ might require extraordinary action. Let me be clear: violence almost never works. I am not an advocate of violence. But what has worked in this country and others is when masses of people come together and simply refuse to be governed. It happened in India. It happened in Selma. It happened in Eastern Europe. But understand that the costs of speaking truth to power are increasing. The further down this road we go, the more expensive it is to defend our libertarian values. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2018, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7451 "2018-11-08T00:01:48Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > No, don’t come at me with this bullshit. If I had been criticized for proposing the wrong course of action, then we could have that conversation. But the goalposts are being moved. I was criticized merely for being someone who opined that we were headed down the shit chute. I committed the cardinal sin of not being the drooling, stupified smiling American optimist. And there we go. Like I said, you seem to care much more about strangers on an internet message board telling you that you were right than (according to you) the entire system of American political governance being annihilated by evil forces. That’s what makes me wonder if you really believe what you’re saying, and thus, ironically, whether you truly are as right as you claim to be. To show off a geeky interest: “In the arms of tragedy, there is little comfort in being right.” - Arcum Daggson, Soldevi machinist ---
**Author:** ![MindsEye\_Watering](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mindseye_watering/32/3619_2.png) [@MindsEye\_Watering](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MindsEye_Watering)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2018, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7452 "2018-11-08T00:03:21Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > I say keep voting, keep organizing. But also understand that we live in times when the assaults on our ‘normal’ might require extraordinary action. What action? Not trying to be snarky, I’m genuinely interested. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2018, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7453 "2018-11-08T00:04:10Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > Ask yourself. I’m not the one who started threads about other posters talking about how stupid and outrageous they were merely for posting their thoughts on current and future political trends. You want to crap on my threads and posts? Okay, I’ll be a good sport. But now that we’ve seen the reality - and everyone here can attest - I think we can say that my pessimism was warranted. I’ve even made specific predictions, including the prediction that once this election was over, Trump would assault the constitution, and that’s exactly what’s happening. > > Don’t ask me what I’m doing. I never asserted that I was some sort of Martin Luther King. I merely defended myself against accusations that my posts were overly-alarmist, and clearly, my alarmism was warranted. You’re the ones who have to explain yourselves, not me. I’ve been vindicated. I will continue to post my insights, and hopefully, perhaps they won’t be so easily dismissed by right-thinking, analytical posters. Okay, two things. One: I didn’t start any threads about you, so don’t you get all snippy with _me_. Two: You’re not just saying “I was right, nya nya”. You’re calling people to action, and lambasting them when they fail to meet your standard for action. A standard that _doesn’t exist_. This is, obviously, bullshit. And forget whatever hysterical predictions you may or may not have made in the past; I don’t care about the past. This thing you’re doing now, yelling at people for failing to do what you’re not doing yourself, and that you can’t even _articulate_- - That makes you completely full of shit and any amount of criticism or mocking threads about you are justified. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2018, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7454 "2018-11-08T00:07:48Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > Okay, two things. > > One: I didn’t start any threads about you, so don’t you get all snippy with _me_. > > Two: You’re not just saying “I was right, nya nya”. You’re calling people to action, and lambasting them when they fail to meet your standard for action. A standard that _doesn’t exist_. This is, obviously, bullshit. And forget whatever hysterical predictions you may or may not have made in the past; I don’t care about the past. This thing you’re doing now, yelling at people for failing to do what you’re not doing yourself, and that you can’t even _articulate_- > > - That makes you completely full of shit and any amount of criticism or mocking threads about you are justified. Shut the fuck up. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2018, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7455 "2018-11-08T00:09:32Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > I say keep voting, keep organizing. But also understand that we live in times when the assaults on our ‘normal’ might require extraordinary action. Let me be clear: violence almost never works. I am not an advocate of violence.\*\* But what has worked in this country and others is when masses of people come together and simply refuse to be governed. It happened in India. It happened in Selma. It happened in Eastern Europe.\*\* But understand that the costs of speaking truth to power are increasing. The further down this road we go, the more expensive it is to defend our libertarian values. I’m still not quite clear what you mean by the bolded part: a general strike maybe? A revolution? ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2018, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7456 "2018-11-08T00:10:25Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > Shut the fuck up. Ha! Struck a nerve, didn’t I, by being _completely right_. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![MindsEye\_Watering](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mindseye_watering/32/3619_2.png) [@MindsEye\_Watering](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MindsEye_Watering)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2018, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7457 "2018-11-08T00:19:25Z")
**asahi** probably is completely correct and his assessment is accurate, but it’s clear that he has no more of a clue on what to do about it than any of us have. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2018, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7458 "2018-11-08T00:20:25Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > Ha! Struck a nerve, didn’t I, by being _completely right_. 😃 I struck a nerve in YOU!!!😃 ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2018, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7459 "2018-11-08T00:20:59Z")
I’m reminded of this thing that happened in the 60s and 70s, the folks that were screaming the loudest for violence at protests? Well, it turned out they weren’t really protesters. CMC fnord! ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2018, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7460 "2018-11-08T00:25:27Z")
> [@MindsEye\_Watering](#): > > **asahi** probably is completely correct and his assessment is accurate, but it’s clear that he has no more of a clue on what to do about it than any of us have. Actually, I do. But it’s going to require hyper-activism. White Americans don’t have a true appreciation of what it means to fight authoritarianism. This is part about American democracy that minorities understand better than whites. For whites, Trump is a shock, a horror. For minorities, Trump is going back to the stories of their parents and grandparents. It’s the white Americans who have taken democracy for granted. Whites are confused, scared, angry - to the point of attacking other whites who have the same opinion. I already referenced India, Selma, and Eastern Europe. Those are examples of people successfully asserting their human rights and their rights to have a democracy and freedom. White Americans live in a mythical world in which they believe that freedom can only be achieved through extreme violence, as in firebombing the Nazis in Dresden or the Japanese in Tokyo. In reality, asserting freedom doesn’t need to involve violence, and the lessons of Julius Caesar and Abraham Lincoln make clear that violence can often backfire. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2018, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7461 "2018-11-08T00:26:33Z")
> [@crowmanyclouds](#): > > I’m reminded of this thing that happened in the 60s and 70s, the folks that were screaming the loudest for violence at protests? Well, it turned out they weren’t really protesters. > > CMC fnord! You aren’t reminded of shit; you’re just a shit talker. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2018, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7462 "2018-11-08T00:29:17Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > Actually, I do. > > But it’s going to require hyper-activism. > > White Americans don’t have a true appreciation of what it means to fight authoritarianism. This is part about American democracy that minorities understand better than whites. For whites, Trump is a shock, a horror. For minorities, Trump is going back to the stories of their parents and grandparents. It’s the white Americans who have taken democracy for granted. Whites are confused, scared, angry - to the point of attacking other whites who have the same opinion. > > I already referenced India, Selma, and Eastern Europe. Those are examples of people successfully asserting their human rights and their rights to have a democracy and freedom. White Americans live in a mythical world in which they believe that freedom can only be achieved through extreme violence, as in firebombing the Nazis in Dresden or the Japanese in Tokyo. In reality, asserting freedom doesn’t need to involve violence, and the lessons of Julius Caesar and Abraham Lincoln make clear that violence can often backfire. So, what, you want me to sit at the front of a bus? (But I don’t _ride_ busses!:() [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093.md?page=372) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093.md?page=374)