# A Thread for the Mueller Investigation Results and Outcomes (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 28, 2017, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093 "2017-10-28T20:14:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 376
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2018, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7503 "2018-11-09T20:29:57Z")
I have not followed this thread or this aspect of things closely. I have been waiting for… something. I think this may be it. Thanks, I will look at that link later. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2018, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7504 "2018-11-09T20:57:27Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > Thanks. I appreciate your story. This is so important! I’ll be attending future protests, too. > … Is there anyplace that give the total attendance at protests yesterday across the country? My google-fu is failing me. ---
**Author:** ![Defensive\_Indifference](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/defensive_indifference/32/6502_2.png) [@Defensive\_Indifference](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Defensive_Indifference)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2018, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7505 "2018-11-09T20:59:03Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > Our event was (as all the others I’ve attended) respectful, upbeat and decently attended, especially considering the short notice and that it was very cold for our part of the world. I’d estimate a crowd size of about 300. > > Favorite sign: “Beneath contempt but not above the law.” > > We had good speakers, including a constitutional scholar who made a compelling argument that Whitaker is not lawfully appointed, and someone representing Senator Ron Wyden’s office. > > I’m glad I went, despite adversities of a barking knee and a long drive. > > How was yours? Not bad. In St. Louis it was in the low 40s, so a bit chilly. I’d guess there were 200-300 there. We also had a law professor speaking. He also hit on the idea of whether the appointment of Whitaker was legal. He mostly talked about the importance of focusing on protecting Mueller and not getting wound up over impeachment, which is not gonna happen. The next two speakers were the outgoing and incoming State rep for part of St. Louis County. It was pretty subdued but I’m glad I was there. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2018, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7506 "2018-11-09T21:07:05Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > Is there anyplace that give the total attendance at protests yesterday across the country? My google-fu is failing me. I was curious if my estimate was close, so after I posted, I just checked my local paper’s coverage. They estimated the crowd size at 250, so I was off by 50 folks. You might try that. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2018, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7507 "2018-11-09T21:13:01Z")
> [@Defensive\_Indifference](#): > > Not bad. In St. Louis it was in the low 40s, so a bit chilly. I’d guess there were 200-300 there. We also had a law professor speaking. He also hit on the idea of whether the appointment of Whitaker was legal. He mostly talked about the importance of focusing on protecting Mueller and not getting wound up over impeachment, which is not gonna happen. The next two speakers were the outgoing and incoming State rep for part of St. Louis County. > > It was pretty subdued but I’m glad I was there. Me, too. Agreed, impeachment is not going to happen with a corrupt, demagogue Senate. It’s going to be a long two years with a lot more protests ahead. The more warm bodies and loud voices, the better. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2018, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7508 "2018-11-09T22:49:28Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > Instead of starting a whole nother thread, let me ask you smart guys in this one: Is there any way to interpret the firing of Sessions as an innocent, justifiable move? Because to me it screams, “Trump is guilty.” Guilty of what? Not sure, but there must be a there there to take such an extraordinary step. > > Any reason I can’t in all seriousness start referring to President Crook? What do we make of his supporters now? If there really is a deep state conspiracy that was fabricating evidence to frame the president and prevent him from making America Great again, then it might make sense to try to shut it down. Otherwise, no not really. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2018, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7509 "2018-11-09T22:57:36Z")
> [@](#): > > …It’s going to be a long two years with a lot more protests ahead… I hate the goddam things, hated the first one, hated almost all of them. Self righteous speeches give me the creeps, even when I totally agree with every word said. And if I have to listen to one more Maya Angelou wannabe… One recently, here in the People’s Republic of Minnesota, about the immigrant children. Calm, orderly, intelligent. Politely asked a cop for direction, she politely advised. “When the introverts protest, you know things have gotten serious!” read a sign. Some marginal efforts to get a group chant going with Radio Shack battery powered bullhorns, calmly ignored. No tear gas, no idiots starting fires. Free water: “The Revolution will not be dehydrated!”. I saw it, which only means it can happen. Maybe we can force Fox News to run Garrison Keillor re-runs rather than Hannity. Something like that. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2018, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7510 "2018-11-09T23:50:33Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > I hate the goddam things, hated the first one, hated almost all of them. Self righteous speeches give me the creeps, even when I totally agree with every word said. And if I have to listen to one more Maya Angelou wannabe… > > One recently, here in the People’s Republic of Minnesota, about the immigrant children. Calm, orderly, intelligent. Politely asked a cop for direction, she politely advised. “When the introverts protest, you know things have gotten serious!” read a sign. Some marginal efforts to get a group chant going with Radio Shack battery powered bullhorns, calmly ignored. No tear gas, no idiots starting fires. Free water: “The Revolution will not be dehydrated!”. > > I saw it, which only means it can happen. Maybe we can force Fox News to run Garrison Keillor re-runs rather than Hannity. Something like that. Ain’t it the truth? Dislodging oneself from a comfortable, cozy refuge complete with warm adult beverage to go out and freeze in the cutting wind with the obligatory backpack and purple hat, hold a sign and chant rhetoric one step above nursery rhymes is not an adventure that beckons. Especially when one thinks of copycat Thousand Oaks shooters hanging about in the shadows. I thought I was done with this shit 45 years ago. Happily, all we get here are sympathetic toots on horns. The cops are unfailingly kind, you have to be a complete asshole to get arrested and parking is free after 6:00 p.m. It’s nice and makes the effort worthwhile. ---
**Author:** ![Fair\_Rarity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fair_rarity/32/153_2.png) [@Fair\_Rarity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fair_Rarity)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2018, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7511 "2018-11-10T00:26:44Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > And that’s the wild card here… it’s been suggested several times that Trump \*wants \* to testify, to show that he’s better than Mueller and that he can beat him. Yeah, it’d be stupid, and he’d be advised against it, but when has that ever stopped him? I’m sure this joke has been made 1000 times, so here it is for 1001. It’d be A Few Good Men. “You’re damn right I ordered the code red!” I can’t imagine any scenario where it wouldn’t be the case unless the questioner was allowed no follow up questions. The new revelations by the WSJ today about the trail leading directly to Trump paying off all his rando hook ups seems to indicate that even if he can dodge this stuff at a federal level, he’s toast in New York state. I want him in a federal orange jumpsuit, but I’m ok with a humiliating and successful state prosecution. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2018, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7512 "2018-11-10T01:42:34Z")
I mean, Rikers is lovely this time of fall… ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2018, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7513 "2018-11-10T02:01:12Z")
> [@Fair\_Rarity](#): > > It’d be A Few Good Men. “You’re damn right I ordered the code red!” I’m betting he’ll look more like Commander Queeg than Colonel Jessup. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2018, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7514 "2018-11-10T02:20:53Z")
> [@Fair\_Rarity](#): > > I’m sure this joke has been made 1000 times, so here it is for 1001. > > It’d be A Few Good Men. “You’re damn right I ordered the code red!” I can’t imagine any scenario where it wouldn’t be the case unless the questioner was allowed no follow up questions. > > The new revelations by the WSJ today about the trail leading directly to Trump paying off all his rando hook ups seems to indicate that even if he can dodge this stuff at a federal level, he’s toast in New York state. > > I want him in a federal orange jumpsuit, but I’m ok with a humiliating and successful state prosecution. Or something like, _“For an attorney, you sure are ugly and ask really dumb questions. It must be your low I.Q.”_ And THEN, _“You’re damn right, I ordered the code red!”_ ---
**Author:** ![China\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/779978/32.png) [@China\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/China_Guy)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2018, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7515 "2018-11-10T02:49:04Z")
I wish people would STFU about impeachment until Mueller presents his findings. It just lets the right wing base feel like they are persecuted and the serves as a feel good salve to the left. Innocent until proven guilty and all that. (Note: I say this believing firing Comney, forcing Sessions to retire, almost blowing Putin on stage, etc seem pretty clear cut attempts to silence investigation into Russian collusion. And I’ll be shocked, shocked I tell you, if Mueller doesn’t show with a pretty bow on top that Trump/Trump Inc laundered less than a billion dollars worth of oligarch dollars. BUT, I will accept if Mueller comes out and says “incompetence is not a crime and there is no there there.”) ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2018, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7516 "2018-11-10T03:50:55Z")
Liking this. \*\* Mueller Has a Way Around Trump and His Minions \*\* > **[Opinion | Mueller Has a Way Around Trump and His Minions (Published 2018)](https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/09/opinion/trump-whitaker-mueller-watergate.html)** > > A road map from the Watergate prosecution shows a potential route for the special counsel to send incriminating evidence directly to Congress. > [@](#): > > … > But a 44-year-old “road map” from the Watergate prosecution shows a potential route for Mr. Mueller to send incriminating evidence directly to Congress. The road map was devised in 1974 by the Watergate special prosecutor, Leon Jaworski, with our assistance. We wrote the road map — actually a report —to be conveyed to Congress; it was called “Report and Recommendation” and served as a guide to a collection of grand jury evidence contained in a single document. That evidence included still-secret presidential tape recordings that had been acquired through grand jury subpoena — but which had been withheld from Congress by President Nixon. > > The recent decision by Washington’s Federal District Court chief judge, Beryl Howell, to release the document from the National Archives provides a historic legal precedent that could be a vehicle for Mr. Mueller and the grand jury assisting him to share the fruits of their investigation into possible criminal conduct within the Trump presidential campaign and subsequent administration. > … ---
**Author:** ![Batano](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b487fb/32.png) [@Batano](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Batano)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2018, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7517 "2018-11-10T05:07:20Z")
> [@Fair\_Rarity](#): > > I’m sure this joke has been made 1000 times, so here it is for 1001. > > It’d be A Few Good Men. “You’re damn right I ordered the code red!” I can’t imagine any scenario where it wouldn’t be the case unless the questioner was allowed no follow up questions. > > The new revelations by the WSJ today about the trail leading directly to Trump paying off all his rando hook ups seems to indicate that even if he can dodge this stuff at a federal level, he’s toast in New York state. > > I want him in a federal orange jumpsuit, but I’m ok with a humiliating and successful state prosecution. “You can’t handle the truth, but you can handle a pussy”. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2018, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7518 "2018-11-11T15:57:51Z")
> [@Fair\_Rarity](#): > > \I want him in a federal orange jumpsuit, but I’m ok with a humiliating and successful state prosecution. Yep. And let him live long enough to endure the trials and eventual prison. I don’t want this ass to die before the country is shown what he is. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2018, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7519 "2018-11-11T16:55:49Z")
> [@China\_Guy](#): > > I wish people would STFU about impeachment until Mueller presents his findings. It just lets the right wing base feel like they are persecuted and the serves as a feel good salve to the left. Innocent until proven guilty and all that. > > (Note: I say this believing firing Comney, forcing Sessions to retire, almost blowing Putin on stage, etc seem pretty clear cut attempts to silence investigation into Russian collusion. And I’ll be shocked, shocked I tell you, if Mueller doesn’t show with a pretty bow on top that Trump/Trump Inc laundered less than a billion dollars worth of oligarch dollars. BUT, I will accept if Mueller comes out and says “incompetence is not a crime and there is no there there.”) I am one who believes Trump committed impeachable offenses on the first day he stepped into the White House. Violations of the Emoluments Clause, shocking lack of character and conflicts of interest. Had Republicans taken their oaths of office seriously and not protected Trump as they have, he’d already be behind bars. The Republicans are as guilty as Trump. Since he took office, he has done nothing but continue to abuse his oath and his office. His conspiracy with the Russians, ongoing, is right out in the open. His energetic efforts (to the extent anything about Trump is energetic) to politicize and taint the very institutions upon which our Constitution rests, is criminal. A president who defends Putin in public against the conclusions of his own intelligence agencies is a lawless man who deserves to be impeached. This is a simple truth and we have never needed Mueller’s report to determine it is so. When we have Mueller’s report, it will make exactly _zero_ difference to Republicans and how they respond. They have not only looked the other way as regards Trump’s behavior, they have actively enabled and encouraged it. If you were an incurable cynic like me, you might begin to wonder why. At this stage, I think discussions of impeachment are useless and a distraction – but that’s because even though a prima facie case could easily be made to impeach Trump, the criminals who presently control the levers of power in the Senate will do everything in their power to prevent it. So now we need to focus on bringing the full extent of this corruption to light, and hope enough citizens grasp the implications of the peril it poses to our country and our entire way of life. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2018, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7520 "2018-11-11T17:33:17Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > I am one who believes Trump committed impeachable offenses on the first day he stepped into the White House. Violations of the Emoluments Clause, shocking lack of character and conflicts of interest. Had Republicans taken their oaths of office seriously and not protected Trump as they have, he’d already be behind bars. The Republicans are as guilty as Trump. > > Since he took office, he has done nothing but continue to abuse his oath and his office. His conspiracy with the Russians, ongoing, is right out in the open. His energetic efforts (to the extent anything about Trump is energetic) to politicize and taint the very institutions upon which our Constitution rests, is criminal. > > A president who defends Putin in public against the conclusions of his own intelligence agencies is a lawless man who deserves to be impeached. This is a simple truth and we have never needed Mueller’s report to determine it is so. When we have Mueller’s report, it will make exactly _zero_ difference to Republicans and how they respond. They have not only looked the other way as regards Trump’s behavior, they have actively enabled and encouraged it. If you were an incurable cynic like me, you might begin to wonder why. > > At this stage, I think discussions of impeachment are useless and a distraction – but that’s because even though a prima facie case could easily be made to impeach Trump, the criminals who presently control the levers of power in the Senate will do everything in their power to prevent it. So now we need to focus on bringing the full extent of this corruption to light, and hope enough citizens grasp the implications of the peril it poses to our country and our entire way of life. All very well said. That piece of shit has been tripping over the line of the law his entire life. How many lawsuits? 3000 or so. Give a stupid bully a club, and this is what you get. ---
**Author:** ![Ambrosio\_Spinola](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9de0a6/32.png) [@Ambrosio\_Spinola](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambrosio_Spinola)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2018, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7521 "2018-11-12T22:13:18Z")
There have been hints that Mueller is working his way to charging Roger Stone with something. Today, Stone’s associate [Jerome Corsi](https://twitter.com/KenDilanianNBC/status/1062099141944360960) told NBC that Mueller’s team has notified him that he will shortly be indicted for perjury. I don’t know why he’d lie about that and it seems plausible enough (we know that Corsi gave testimony before Mueller’s grand jury), but given the source I’d still wait for official confirmation before staking my life on it or anything. ---
**Author:** ![Defensive\_Indifference](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/defensive_indifference/32/6502_2.png) [@Defensive\_Indifference](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Defensive_Indifference)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2018, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7522 "2018-11-12T22:21:07Z")
Another reporter on Twitter says Corsi is saying the same thing on a “live stream”, but he doesn’t link to the source or say where the stream is being carried. > Corsi is on YouTube: [- YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVNl5m8V4UM&feature=youtu.be) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093.md?page=375) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093.md?page=377)