# A Thread for the Mueller Investigation Results and Outcomes (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 28, 2017, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093 "2017-10-28T20:14:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 390
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2018, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7783 "2018-11-29T14:22:37Z")
He is pleading guilty for lying to Congress. Link: [Michael Cohen pleads guilty to lying to Congress in new deal with Mueller in Trump-Russia probe - ABC News](https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/michael-cohen-expected-plead-guilty-lying-congress-collusion/story?id=59491450) ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2018, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7784 "2018-11-29T14:27:04Z")
About Trump’s [Russian real estate project](https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1068149041467412486)… ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2018, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7785 "2018-11-29T14:28:45Z")
> [@pool](#): > > I’m not a legal or constitutional scholar at all but theoretically isn’t the president’s pardon power pretty absolute. My power to give somebody fifty bucks (assuming I have fifty bucks of legitimately obtained money) is pretty absolute, but I’ll probably get in a lot of trouble if I try introducing the cop who just pulled me over to my friend Ulysses. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2018, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7786 "2018-11-29T14:31:49Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > About Trump’s [Russian real estate project](https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1068149041467412486)… I’m anxious to read the specifics of what the lie was and what the truth is. Could be wildly different levels of implication. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2018, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7787 "2018-11-29T14:32:38Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > I’m anxious to read the specifics of what the lie was and what the truth is. Could be wildly different levels of implication. Well, apparently the guilty plea came with about 70 hours of testimony from Cohen, so specifics should be in strong supply. And as the GOP tries to distance itself from Cohen, remember that he was the goddamn [deputy finance chairman](https://www.cnn.com/2018/06/20/politics/cohen-resigns-from-rnc/index.html) of the RNC. Until a few months ago. ---
**Author:** ![Defensive\_Indifference](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/defensive_indifference/32/6502_2.png) [@Defensive\_Indifference](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Defensive_Indifference)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2018, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7788 "2018-11-29T14:37:37Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > He is pleading guilty for lying to Congress. > > Link: [Michael Cohen pleads guilty to lying to Congress in new deal with Mueller in Trump-Russia probe - ABC News](https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/michael-cohen-expected-plead-guilty-lying-congress-collusion/story?id=59491450) From the linked article: > [@](#): > > “The potential significance of Cohen’s cooperation is immense,” said Kendall Coffey, a former United States Attorney in Florida. > > \ > > “It cannot be determined if Cohen’s cooperation will lead to other criminal allegations,” Coffey said. “But for most high-powered business people with complex business interests, having one’s personal attorney become a star witness for the prosecution is the worst possible legal nightmare.” After his guilty plea in the SDNY case, Cohen has spent 70 hours talking to Mueller. Dayum. Cohen is scheduled to be sentenced in yet another separate federal case in a couple of weeks. He could face around 4 years in prison. The President’s long-time enforcer is cooperating with prosecutors and looking at a good stretch in the federal pen, and this _might not even be the craziest shit going on right now._ > [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > And Deutsche Bank [raided](https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/29/business/deutsche-bank-money-laundering-raid.html) this morning in money laundering case. Trump’s favorite bank. The article makes it sound like this is related to the “Panama Papers”. I can’t remember if Trump was implicated in them. But anyway, when 170 investigators descend on your HQ, they’re probably going to find some shit. Maybe after Mueller is done, the Germans will have a chance to take a swing at Trump. We helped rescue Germany from a fascist a few decades ago; maybe they can return the favor. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2018, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7789 "2018-11-29T14:43:26Z")
Apparently the lie is that he stopped trying to negotiate Trump Tower Moscow in 2016. He actually was still negotiating for it in 2017. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2018, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7790 "2018-11-29T14:46:03Z")
> [@Defensive\_Indifference](#): > > The article makes it sound like this is related to the “Panama Papers”. I can’t remember if Trump was implicated in them. But anyway, when 170 investigators descend on your HQ, they’re probably going to find some shit. Maybe after Mueller is done, the Germans will have a chance to take a swing at Trump. We helped rescue Germany from a fascist a few decades ago; maybe they can return the favor. I know this approaches tinfoil hattery, but the [Deutche Bank lending Trump a billion dollars](https://www.businessinsider.com/anthony-kennedy-son-loaned-president-trump-over-a-billion-dollars-2018-6?utm_source=reddit.com) when no one else would touch him, under the leadership of recently retired justice Anthony Kennedy’s son, seems somewhat sketchy. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2018, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7791 "2018-11-29T15:01:36Z")
The [documents](https://www.lawfareblog.com/document-michael-cohen-criminal-information-mueller-probe) are enlightening. Individual 1 (who is the unidentified nominee for president of the United States) and family members of Individual 1 sure seem like they might be in trouble. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2018, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7792 "2018-11-29T15:15:41Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > I know this approaches tinfoil hattery, but the [Deutche Bank lending Trump a billion dollars](https://www.businessinsider.com/anthony-kennedy-son-loaned-president-trump-over-a-billion-dollars-2018-6?utm_source=reddit.com) when no one else would touch him, under the leadership of recently retired justice Anthony Kennedy’s son, seems somewhat sketchy. I don’t think anything is tinfoil hattery at this point. The entire family is just one big criminal organization. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2018, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7793 "2018-11-29T15:17:38Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > I know this approaches tinfoil hattery, but the [Deutche Bank lending Trump a billion dollars](https://www.businessinsider.com/anthony-kennedy-son-loaned-president-trump-over-a-billion-dollars-2018-6?utm_source=reddit.com) when no one else would touch him, under the leadership of recently retired justice Anthony Kennedy’s son, seems somewhat sketchy. Sketchy as fuck but old news at this point. It’s hard to keep up with all the different ways Trump and his administration could plausibly be corrupt. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2018, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7794 "2018-11-29T15:37:46Z")
> [@enipla](#): > > I don’t think anything is tinfoil hattery at this point. The entire family is just one big criminal organization. When they make the movie, they should get Al Pacino to play Barron… ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2018, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7795 "2018-11-29T15:39:53Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > The [documents](https://www.lawfareblog.com/document-michael-cohen-criminal-information-mueller-probe) are enlightening. Individual 1 (who is the unidentified nominee for president of the United States) and family members of Individual 1 sure seem like they might be in trouble. :eek: That’s a pretty specific bunch of information there, that is. And Cohen pleading guilty means he’s saying “aye; that’s all true”, right? ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2018, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7796 "2018-11-29T16:05:12Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > :eek: That’s a pretty specific bunch of information there, that is. And Cohen pleading guilty means he’s saying “aye; that’s all true”, right? Mueller would not accept a plea for any charge he could not prove. My guess is that he has supporting evidence (remember all those Cohen tape recordings?) that will support all statements made in the plea. Again, Mueller uses his indictments/informations/court filings to speak to the public. People who are waiting for a “report” should just continue to read those. It’s all there. Oh, and… this does score another one for Christopher Steele. (Page 32 of Dossier.) ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2018, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7797 "2018-11-29T16:05:34Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > When they make the movie, they should get Al Pacino to play Barron… He probably has some little friends we could say hello to. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2018, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7798 "2018-11-29T16:17:40Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > Mueller would not accept a plea for any charge he could not prove. My guess is that he has supporting evidence (remember all those Cohen tape recordings?) that will support all statements made in the plea. > > Again, Mueller uses his indictments/informations/court filings to speak to the public. People who are waiting for a “report” should just continue to read those. It’s all there. > > Oh, and… this does score another one for Christopher Steele. (Page 32 of Dossier.) In the end, we will find the report in the indictments and supplementary materials. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2018, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7799 "2018-11-29T16:26:25Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > He is pleading guilty for lying to Congress. > > Link: [Michael Cohen pleads guilty to lying to Congress in new deal with Mueller in Trump-Russia probe - ABC News](https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/michael-cohen-expected-plead-guilty-lying-congress-collusion/story?id=59491450) Looks like Mueller’s got his very own John Dean here. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2018, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7800 "2018-11-29T16:28:50Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > Mueller would not accept a plea for any charge he could not prove. My guess is that he has supporting evidence (remember all those Cohen tape recordings?) that will support all statements made in the plea. > > Again, Mueller uses his indictments/informations/court filings to speak to the public. People who are waiting for a “report” should just continue to read those. It’s all there. > > Oh, and… this does score another one for Christopher Steele. (Page 32 of Dossier.) For those of us who have not committed the Steele Dossier to memory: > [@](#): > > That Cohen played a “key role” in the Trump–Russia relationship[3] by maintaining a “covert relationship with Russia”,[109][110][111] arranging cover-ups and “deniable cash payments”,[60][35] and that his role had grown after Manafort had left the campaign.[112][108] (Dossier, pp. 18, 30, 32, 34–35) > > That “COHEN now was heavily engaged in a cover up and damage limitation operation in the attempt to prevent the full details of TRUMP’s relationship with Russia being exposed.”[108][101] (Dossier, p. 32) > **[Steele dossier](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trump%E2%80%93Russia_dossier)** > > The Steele dossier, also known as the Trump–Russia dossier, is a controversial political opposition research report compiled by Christopher Steele that was published without permission as an unfinished 35-page compilation of "unverified, and potentially unverifiable"\[a\] raw intelligence reports—"not established facts, but a starting point for further investigation". It was written from June to December 2016 and contains allegations of misconduct, conspiracy, and cooperation between D ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2018, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7801 "2018-11-29T16:54:25Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > For those of us who have not committed the Steele Dossier to memory:[Steele dossier - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trump%E2%80%93Russia_dossier) Thanks for that. I was remiss in not posting a link. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2018, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/7802 "2018-11-29T17:20:51Z")
I’ve got your back, brother; same team. 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093.md?page=389) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093.md?page=391)