# A Thread for the Mueller Investigation Results and Outcomes (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 28, 2017, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093 "2017-10-28T20:14:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 401
**Author:** ![garygnu](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/garygnu/32/2924_2.png) [@garygnu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/garygnu)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/8003 "2018-12-04T17:04:16Z")
Remember, John Oliver correctly dubbed this whole affair “Stupid Watergate.” ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/8004 "2018-12-04T17:50:03Z")
[According to experts on this newscast](https://youtu.be/URkobp-HEPc?t=240) Thrump’s tweets show a “pattern of behavior” that makes a compelling case for obstruction of justice and witness tampering. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/8005 "2018-12-04T18:31:42Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > [According to experts on this newscast](https://youtu.be/URkobp-HEPc?t=240) Thrump’s tweets show a “pattern of behavior” that makes a compelling case for obstruction of justice and witness tampering. I don’t suppose you have a non-video version? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/8006 "2018-12-04T18:36:57Z")
Dup. post deleted. (I’ve been Microsofted!) . ---
**Author:** ![Yllaria](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yllaria/32/3452_2.png) [@Yllaria](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yllaria)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/8007 "2018-12-04T19:08:46Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > That is hilarious. > > My guess: he accidentally left out the space, so Twitter parsed it as a url. Someone noticed that and quickly registered the domain, putting up the awesome web page. Giuliani hasn’t noticed, or doesn’t care, or something. Another example proving that nothing\* is important. - a missing space is close enough to nothing for government work ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/8008 "2018-12-04T19:24:41Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > I don’t suppose you have a non-video version? I suppose MSNBC will post a transcript of that broadcast eventually, but December transcripts seem to still be unavailable. [http://www.msnbc.com/transcripts/11th-hour-with-brian-williams](http://www.msnbc.com/transcripts/11th-hour-with-brian-williams) ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/8009 "2018-12-04T19:59:41Z")
I’m all a-twitter with anticipation! Come on, Bobby Boy! ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/8010 "2018-12-04T20:40:56Z")
Not Mueller, not even a spin-off, but the emoluments case was just in the news: [D.C., Maryland begin seeking Trump financial documents in case related to his D.C. hotel](https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/attorneys-general-issue-subpoenas-to-trump-entities-in-dc-hotel-case/2018/12/04/29e13dc0-f4db-11e8-bc79-68604ed88993_story.html) > [@](#): > > The attorneys general for Maryland and the District of Columbia are issuing subpoenaes for financial records and other documents from more than a dozen of President Trump’s private entities Tuesday as part of an ongoing lawsuit alleging that the president’s business violates the Constitution’s ban on gifts or payments from foreign governments. > > The subpoenas seek details on some of the most closely held secrets of Trump’s presidency: Which foreign governments have paid the Trump Organization money? How much? And for what? > > All of the documents relate to Trump’s D.C. hotel, which is at the center of the emoluments case because of events foreign governments have held there and the federal lease that allows the business to operate. > > … > > Also receiving subpoenas are a number of federal agencies that may have some information about Trump’s hotel, which operates in the federally owned Old Post Office Pavilion on Pennsylvania Avenue downtown. At the top of the list is the General Services Administration, which leases the property to Trump’s company. > > Other agencies receiving subpoenas are the Commerce Department, the Defense Department, the Agriculture Department and the Internal Revenue Service. The State of Maine also received a subpoena due to a visit Gov. Paul LePage (R) made to the hotel in early 2017. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/8011 "2018-12-04T21:05:59Z")
> [@Happy\_Lendervedder](#): > > I’m all a-twitter with anticipation! Come on, Bobby Boy! If he’s true to form, that report will drop around the dinner hour. He probably doesn’t want to knock the coverage of H.W. Bush’s memorial proceedings out of Top Story status. Give the guy the respect of his day to lie in state. There’s no way to know for sure, but it’s possible we may learn a bit more about Pence’s involvement with this Flynn sentencing memorandum. It has never made sense to me that Pence, as the _chairman_ of Trump’s transition team after Christie was given the heave-ho, wasn’t told by Sally Yates and/or Don McGahn of Flynn’s involvement with Russians, especially given’ Pence’s _written acknowledgement_ on November 28, 2016, of [Elijah Cummings’ letter to him](https://democrats-oversight.house.gov/news/press-releases/cummings-requests-documents-relating-to-michael-flynn-s-apparent-conflicts-of) detailing Flynn’s involvements with both Turkey and Russia on the same day Flynn became National Security Advisor. For Pence to then say that Flynn “lied to him” when he (Flynn) said his contacts with Kislyak did not involve discussion of Russian sanctions strikes me as more than a little unbelievable. Beggars the imagination, even. If we learn nothing else, the above would be worth it. I despise that hypocritical, faux-religious lizardy asshole. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/8012 "2018-12-04T21:14:41Z")
[A User’s Guide to Ending the Trump Presidency](https://www.lawfareblog.com/users-guide-ending-trump-presidency) is a very cool book review on **Lawfare** ; the book is about the constitutionally provided means and historical precedents that our country has for removing a president from office. > [@](#): > > When it comes to getting rid of this president, history may be a guide, but we are nevertheless deep in uncharted waters, facing the potential shipwreck of our constitutional democracy. ---
**Author:** ![MindsEye\_Watering](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mindseye_watering/32/3619_2.png) [@MindsEye\_Watering](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MindsEye_Watering)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/8013 "2018-12-04T23:20:28Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > Not Mueller, not even a spin-off, but the emoluments case was just in the news: > > [D.C., Maryland begin seeking Trump financial documents in case related to his D.C. hotel](https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/attorneys-general-issue-subpoenas-to-trump-entities-in-dc-hotel-case/2018/12/04/29e13dc0-f4db-11e8-bc79-68604ed88993_story.html) **YES! It’s REALLY starting now! Just in time for Christmas!** ---
**Author:** ![Locrian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/locrian/32/14146_2.png) [@Locrian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Locrian)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/8014 "2018-12-04T23:33:15Z")
> [@MindsEye\_Watering](#): > > **YES! It’s REALLY starting now! Just in time for Christmas!** There better not be any coal in the stocking like Trump found guilty of not paying three parking tickets… 😃 I’m counting on the emoluments case too. This is where the meltdown will happen. “Don’t you touch my fucking money!” is all we’ll hear from The Howling Yam. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/8015 "2018-12-04T23:34:54Z")
The Emoluments case is the one that is going to take Trump apart, even if nothing else does. Although I have complete confidence in Bobby Three Sticks, too. By the time all the various law enforcement agencies are done, there will be nothing left except ground-up Trump family bones, all blown away in the wind. Nothing less than what they deserve, for all the harm they have visited on our country for the sake of their selfish personal enrichment. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/8016 "2018-12-04T23:47:13Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > The Emoluments case is the one that is going to take Trump apart, even if nothing else does. Although I have complete confidence in Bobby Three Sticks, too. > > By the time all the various law enforcement agencies are done, there will be nothing left except ground-up Trump family bones, all blown away in the wind. > > Nothing less than what they deserve, for all the harm they have visited on our country for the sake of their selfish personal enrichment. Unless we assume that Trump is a crooked businessman, and the data requests for establishing emoluments just happen to tangentially reveal that, all we should expect from the emoluments case would be that Trump has to put his businesses into a blind trust or sell them off or something. And, likely, by the time that sort of determination could be made, he’ll be out of the White House, so they’ll let him keep everything. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2018, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/8017 "2018-12-04T23:51:47Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > **Unless we assume that Trump is a crooked businessman** , and the data requests for establishing emoluments just happen to tangentially reveal that, all we should expect from the emoluments case would be that Trump has to put his businesses into a blind trust or sell them off or something. And, likely, by the time that sort of determination could be made, he’ll be out of the White House, so they’ll let him keep everything. My. Why on earth would we assume that? :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2018, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/8018 "2018-12-05T00:05:52Z")
I’ll also note that unless we expect Trump’s main finance guy to flip on him, we probably can’t expect the requests for data to get anywhere. … 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2018, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/8019 "2018-12-05T00:13:51Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > [According to experts on this newscast](https://youtu.be/URkobp-HEPc?t=240) Thrump’s tweets show a “pattern of behavior” that makes a compelling case for obstruction of justice and witness tampering. Well, of course it does. But nothing will happen unless the big money donors start to feel that they’d do better in a world without President Trump than in a world with President Trump. (Because then the GOP Senate would leap into action, the Cabinet would eagerly go for the 25th Amendment, etc.) Hint as to how this could happen: > [@](#): > > Markets plunge as Trump declares ‘I’m a tariff man’ [https://www.theglobeandmail.com/investing/video-markets-plunge-as-trump-declares-im-a-tariff-man/](https://www.theglobeandmail.com/investing/video-markets-plunge-as-trump-declares-im-a-tariff-man/) ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2018, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/8020 "2018-12-05T00:26:11Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > I’ll also note that unless we expect Trump’s main finance guy to flip on him, we probably can’t expect the requests for data to get anywhere. > > … 😃 You don’t know much about subpoenas duces tecum, do you? ---
**Author:** ![Superdude](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/superdude/32/13450_2.png) [@Superdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superdude)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2018, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/8021 "2018-12-05T00:29:18Z")
> [@Locrian](#): > > There better not be any coal in the stocking like Trump found guilty of not paying three parking tickets… 😃 Stocking stuffers from Robert Murray? ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2018, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/8022 "2018-12-05T00:36:34Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > You don’t know much about subpoenas duces tecum, do you? So… would you comment on this, please: > [@](#): > > Roger Stone to plead the fifth in Senate Russia investigation > > Trump’s longtime political ally Roger Stone invoked his Fifth Amendment right and refused to share documents and testimony with members of the Senate Judiciary Committee, according to the letter posted by the panel’s ranking Democrat, senator Dianne Feinstein. > … > [The Guardian](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/live/2018/dec/04/trump-live-latest-news-michael-flynn-mueller-russia-investigation-us-politics-today) Does a committee subpoena carry the same weight as a court subpoena? If it’s NOT like a court, then how can he take the fifth? I got my law degree (equivalent) from watching 5,000 hours of _Law & Order._ Besides, I’m having a hard time keeping up with the players, crimes, subpoenas, indictments, prison sentences, etc. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093.md?page=400) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093.md?page=402)