# A Thread for the Mueller Investigation Results and Outcomes (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 28, 2017, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093 "2017-10-28T20:14:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 453
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2019, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/9043 "2019-01-18T03:47:21Z")
The Women’s March is this Sunday. ---
**Author:** ![jasg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f0a364/32.png) [@jasg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jasg)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2019, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/9044 "2019-01-18T03:51:03Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > In a normal world, we now have a [report](https://www.buzzfeednews.com/amphtml/jasonleopold/trump-russia-cohen-moscow-tower-mueller-investigation?__twitter_impression=true) that Trump absolutely obstructed justice by instructing Cohen to lie to Congress. This would absolutely end a normal presidency. > > I’m guessing that within 24 hours, this will have been forgotten. Yeah, but February 7th will be _lit_. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2019, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/9045 "2019-01-18T03:55:15Z")
> [@jasg](#): > > Yeah, but February 7th will be _lit_. [If it actually happens, that is](https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-usa-trump-russia-cohen/former-trump-lawyer-reconsidering-plan-to-testify-to-congress-adviser-idUSKCN1PB2YG). (Reuters) > [@](#): > > President Donald Trump’s former personal attorney Michael Cohen is reconsidering his plan to testify publicly to the U.S. Congress next month because of intimidation by the president, an adviser to Cohen said on Thursday. > > Lanny Davis, an attorney who has been advising Cohen on his media strategy, said in an interview with MSNBC that some remarks made by the Republican president about Cohen amounted to witness tampering and deserved to be criminally investigated. > > “There is genuine fear and it has caused Michael Cohen to consider whether he should go forward or not, and he has not made a final decision,” Davis said. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2019, 4:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/9046 "2019-01-18T04:13:32Z")
This doesn’t sound on the up and up: [President Trump Directed His Attorney To Lie To Congress About The Moscow Tower Project](https://www.buzzfeednews.com/amphtml/jasonleopold/trump-russia-cohen-moscow-tower-mueller-investigation) _Trump received 10 personal updates from Michael Cohen and encouraged a planned meeting with Vladimir Putin._ > [@](#): > > President Donald Trump directed his longtime attorney Michael Cohen to lie to Congress about negotiations to build a Trump Tower in Moscow, according to two federal law enforcement officials involved in an investigation of the matter. > > Trump also supported a plan, set up by Cohen, to visit Russia during the presidential campaign, in order to personally meet President Vladimir Putin and jump-start the tower negotiations. “Make it happen,” the sources said Trump told Cohen. > > And even as Trump told the public he had no business deals with Russia, the sources said Trump and his children, Ivanka and Donald Trump Jr., received regular, detailed updates about the real estate development from Cohen, whom they put in charge of the project. Poor Tiffany, being left out of all the crimes. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2019, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/9047 "2019-01-18T04:17:46Z")
I mean, the President subornating perjury is a big thing, right? ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2019, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/9048 "2019-01-18T04:22:35Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > I mean, the President subornating perjury is a big thing, right? Yes. I think the GOP will back him still. I think there are still more shoes to drop though. We’ll see how long they hold out. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2019, 4:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/9049 "2019-01-18T04:52:25Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > I mean, the President subornating perjury is a big thing, right? It’s a big Nothingberder! I mean, they have no proof, no witnesses! > [@](#): > > The special counsel’s office learned about Trump’s directive for Cohen to lie to Congress through interviews with multiple witnesses from the Trump Organization and internal company emails, text messages, and a cache of other documents. Oh. Nevermind. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2019, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/9050 "2019-01-18T04:55:25Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > Yes. > > I think the GOP will back him still. I think there are still more shoes to drop though. We’ll see how long they hold out. McConnell and the rest of the traitors will still be backing Trump when the Orange Shitgibbon gives a speech direct from his nice Dacha on the outskirts of Moscow. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2019, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/9051 "2019-01-18T04:57:07Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > McConnell and the rest of the traitors will still be backing Trump when the Orange Shitgibbon gives a speech direct from his nice Dacha on the outskirts of Moscow. I think they’ll abandon him once he gets on the plane. And then pretend they hated him all along and the GOP base will buy it. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2019, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/9052 "2019-01-18T04:57:39Z")
When Don Corleone met with Genco or Tom, he met his consigliere in a room in his home or office, alone, and only talked, no notes. Stringer Bell: “You taking notes on a motherfuckin’ criminal _conspiracy_, man?” Apparently Don Trump put out an inter-office memo entitled: “Make sure Mike lies to Congress - please pass the word.” ---
**Author:** ![Dacien](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dacien/32/5663_2.png) [@Dacien](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dacien)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2019, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/9053 "2019-01-18T05:05:12Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > I think they’ll abandon him once he gets on the plane. And then pretend they hated him all along and the GOP base will buy it. Seriously though, impeachment or no, Republicans are never going to hear the end of it that Trump was our guy. I feel like we’re going to have to wait maybe 50 years before it’s not a relevant gloat any more. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2019, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/9054 "2019-01-18T05:07:18Z")
Josh Marshall, Talking Points Memo: “Look. He lied. He told someone to lie. But it’s not like he was lying about a serious issue. Only about $300 million he hoped to make by allying himself with a foreign autocrat and betraying his own country.” > I’ve already called Cruz and Cornyn, told them flat out they need to get that son of a bitch out. Will call tomorrow as well. ---
**Author:** ![jasg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f0a364/32.png) [@jasg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jasg)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2019, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/9055 "2019-01-18T05:08:36Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > [If it actually happens, that is](https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-usa-trump-russia-cohen/former-trump-lawyer-reconsidering-plan-to-testify-to-congress-adviser-idUSKCN1PB2YG). (Reuters) > > > [@](#): > > > > President Donald Trump’s former personal attorney Michael Cohen is reconsidering his plan to testify publicly to the U.S. Congress next month because of intimidation by the president, an adviser to Cohen said on Thursday. > > > > Lanny Davis, an attorney who has been advising Cohen on his media strategy, said in an interview with MSNBC that some remarks made by the Republican president about Cohen amounted to witness tampering and deserved to be criminally investigated. > > > > “There is genuine fear and it has caused Michael Cohen to consider whether he should go forward or not, and he has not made a final decision,” Davis said. Ok, add witness intimidation to the list… ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2019, 5:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/9056 "2019-01-18T05:13:09Z")
> [@Dacien](#): > > Seriously though, impeachment or no, Republicans are never going to hear the end of it that Trump was our guy. I feel like we’re going to have to wait maybe 50 years before it’s not a relevant gloat any more. Is that what you think this is about? Gloating? Jesus. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2019, 5:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/9057 "2019-01-18T05:14:08Z")
> [@jasg](#): > > Ok, add witness intimidation to the list… And suborning perjury! ---
**Author:** ![Dacien](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dacien/32/5663_2.png) [@Dacien](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dacien)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2019, 5:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/9058 "2019-01-18T05:14:57Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > Is that what you think this is about? Gloating? > > Jesus. Assuming this is all about lying about a legal real estate project, and there’s no criminal conspiracy with Russia to influence the election, then yeah. Or hush money payments to porn stars. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2019, 5:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/9059 "2019-01-18T05:15:08Z")
[https://twitter.com/justinjm1/status/1086105094037356544](https://twitter.com/justinjm1/status/1086105094037356544) “If a President…suborns perjury, or induces a witness to change testimony, or commits any act deliberately impairing the integrity of available evidence, then he, like anyone else, commits the crime of obstruction.” — William Barr, June 2018. The Barr hearing has to stop. ---
**Author:** ![Dacien](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dacien/32/5663_2.png) [@Dacien](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dacien)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2019, 5:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/9060 "2019-01-18T05:17:40Z")
We do have precedent of a president suborning perjury, and committing perjury himself, and being acquitted by the Senate, so it’s not out of this world to imagine the GOP-led Senate doing the same. Love it or hate it, that’ll be the talking point. If the Moscow Tower deal itself was illegal it might be a different story. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2019, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/9061 "2019-01-18T05:19:46Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > [https://twitter.com/justinjm1/status/1086105094037356544](https://twitter.com/justinjm1/status/1086105094037356544) > > “If a President…suborns perjury, or induces a witness to change testimony, or commits any act deliberately impairing the integrity of available evidence, then he, like anyone else, commits the crime of obstruction.” — William Barr, June 2018. > > The Barr hearing has to stop. Amy Klobuchar nailed Barr to the wall on those exact concerns yesterday in her questioning, point by point. He did not equivocate. He responded “yes” to each of her questions. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2019, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/9062 "2019-01-18T05:20:46Z")
> [@Dacien](#): > > We do have precedent of a president suborning perjury, and committing perjury himself, and being acquitted by the Senate, so it’s not out of this world to imagine the GOP-led Senate doing the same. Love it or hate it, that’ll be the talking point. If the Moscow Tower deal itself was illegal it might be a different story. Here’s a hint: It’s illegal. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093.md?page=452) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093.md?page=454)