# A Thread for the Mueller Investigation Results and Outcomes (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 28, 2017, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093 "2017-10-28T20:14:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 543
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2019, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/10843 "2019-04-18T18:43:49Z")
So, after having seen the report, I’m actually pleasantly surprised at how unredacted it is. I don’t think that the Dems should spend too much effort trying to get the unredacted version. It sounds like the only redactions that Congress won’t get to see is those regarding the grand jury. These are relatively small in number and short in length, so it seems unlikely that they hide the smoking gun, particularly given how much damaging information was left unredacted. Also, regarding the Grand Jury testimony, the law might be on Barr’s side. If the Dems fight hard for the full report and lose, or fight hard and it turns out that the portions have nothing substantial to add, it think it weakens the Dems case. Finally from a purely Machiavellian point of view: the redactions are like lingerie. Leaving a little bit to imagination can be enticing. What people speculate was in the 18 1/2 gap in the Nixon tapes is probably much more nefarious than what was actually there. ---
**Author:** ![GreysonCarlisle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a87d85/32.png) [@GreysonCarlisle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreysonCarlisle)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2019, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/10844 "2019-04-18T18:48:36Z")
> [@the report](#): > > the investigation established that the Russian government perceived it would benefit from a Trump presidency and worked to secure that outcome, and that the campaign expected it would benefit electorally from information stolen and released through Russian efforts In a sane world, that would be impeachment and conviction right there. ---
**Author:** ![cuauhtemoc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ecb155/32.png) [@cuauhtemoc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cuauhtemoc)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2019, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/10845 "2019-04-18T19:01:31Z")
> [@Knowed\_Out](#): > > So, is Trump not guilty of obstruction of justice because his aides refused to follow his orders? The Oval Office is vacant. Nobody is in charge. Executive decisions are being made by self-interested, unelected political operatives who are accountable to nobody. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2019, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/10846 "2019-04-18T19:01:59Z")
The more I read, the more it seems clear that yes, Barr was extremely and almost certainly purposefully misleading about the findings of the Mueller report. I don’t know why anyone would be surprised about this possibility, considering all the blatant lies of the administration over the past couple of years. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2019, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/10847 "2019-04-18T19:03:00Z")
Richard Burr has some explaining to do before he resigns: > **[Mueller report ropes in Senate GOP](https://www.politico.com/story/2019/04/18/burr-mueller-probe-white-house-1282098)** > > Senate Intelligence Chairman Richard Burr apparently supplied the White House counsel’s office with information about the Russia probe. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2019, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/10848 "2019-04-18T19:05:41Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > So, after having seen the report, I’m actually pleasantly surprised at how unredacted it is. > > I don’t think that the Dems should spend too much effort trying to get the unredacted version. It sounds like the only redactions that Congress won’t get to see is those regarding the grand jury. These are relatively small in number and short in length, so it seems unlikely that they hide the smoking gun, particularly given how much damaging information was left unredacted. Also, regarding the Grand Jury testimony, the law might be on Barr’s side. If the Dems fight hard for the full report and lose, or fight hard and it turns out that the portions have nothing substantial to add, it think it weakens the Dems case. > > Finally from a purely Machiavellian point of view: the redactions are like lingerie. Leaving a little bit to imagination can be enticing. What people speculate was in the 18 1/2 gap in the Nixon tapes is probably much more nefarious than what was actually there. There’s no reason for Congress not to ask for it. And if they get it, that’s for Congress, not necessarily for the public. There’s plenty of juicy stuff to get into and investigate while it works its way through the courts. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2019, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/10849 "2019-04-18T19:07:22Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > Richard Burr has some explaining to do before he resigns: > [https://www.politico.com/story/2019/04/18/burr-mueller-probe-white-house-1282098](https://www.politico.com/story/2019/04/18/burr-mueller-probe-white-house-1282098) Thank you for the cite on this. I’d been looking for one. Of the new information we’ve learned today via the Mueller report, this was one of the most disappointing to me. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2019, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/10850 "2019-04-18T19:08:53Z")
I have felt that it would be to Trump’s advantage to release the whole thing all in one go. The slow drip of bad news is almost always worse. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2019, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/10851 "2019-04-18T19:15:28Z")
Surprise, surprise. We also learn that Sarah Huckabee Sanders is a lying piece of shit too ([from here (Yahoo News](https://news.yahoo.com/mueller-report-sarah-sanders-invented-story-about-fbi-agents-reaction-to-comey-firing-175925718.html?soc_src=newsroom&soc_trk=com.apple.UIKit.activity.PostToTwitter&.tsrc=newsroom))): > [@](#): > > "The day after President Trump fired FBI Director James Comey, then-deputy press secretary Sarah Sanders stood at the podium in the White House briefing room and told reporters that the president had had “countless conversations” with members of the FBI who said morale at the bureau was low and they had lost confidence in Comey. > > … > > But in her testimony to federal investigators probing whether Trump obstructed justice, Sanders admitted that she made it up. > > According to special counsel Robert Mueller’s report on the Trump campaign’s contacts with Russia and the president’s interference in the investigation released Thursday, there was “no evidence” suggesting Trump had heard from FBI agents who had lost confidence in Comey before his firing, and “Sanders acknowledged to investigators that her comments were not founded on anything.” ---
**Author:** ![Tee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/73ab20/32.png) [@Tee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tee)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2019, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/10852 "2019-04-18T19:19:23Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > For the record, here is the full quote: > > “Although the investigation established that the Russian government perceived it would benefit from a Trump presidency and worked to secure that outcome, and that the Campaign expected it would benefit electorally from information stolen and released through Russian efforts, **[T]he investigation did not establish that members of the Trump Campaign conspired or coordinated with the Russian government in its election interference activities.**” > > Anyone wanna argue that this is an honest parsing of that quote? The language of that quote is from the report’s first pages, it says “We applied the term coordination in that sense when stating in the report that the investigation did not establish that the Trump Campaign did not coordinate with the Russian government in its election interference activities.” It’s explanatory. ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2019, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/10853 "2019-04-18T19:28:06Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > Finally from a purely Machiavellian point of view: the redactions are like lingerie. Leaving a little bit to imagination can be enticing. What people speculate was in the 18 1/2 gap in the Nixon tapes is probably much more nefarious than what was actually there. That is a great analogy. And I’m just swiping through the report, giving it a quick skim, stopping at parts that catch my interest. Nothing earth-shattering that I didn’t know, at leas not yet, but some details that are interesting and , yes, amusing. Like how Cohen’s contacts with Russian business interests were delayed because he sent an email using the extension [gob.ru](http://gob.ru) instead of [gov.ru](http://gov.ru). And how a few weeks after the infamous “sexual harassment\*” Comey dinner, Trump had a Valentines Day meeting with Chris Christie and told him to call Comey and let him know Trump really really liked him. Christie said he would but didn’t because he knew how weird it was. \*i think of that Comey dinner thing as the sexual harassment dinner because that’s such a classic sexual harassment technique. The executive invites his target to a dinner party, she lets down her guard and goes because she thinks it’s a party with other people and stuff, and she ( or he) gets there only to realize she’s the only guest and she’s stuck alone with the guy she’s been trying to avoid. And I’m still convinced that Trump had a boy crush on Comey at first solely because he’s really tall. And that goes a long way with Trump. Who is shallow. ---
**Author:** ![UnwittingAmericans](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/d9b06d/32.png) [@UnwittingAmericans](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UnwittingAmericans)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2019, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/10854 "2019-04-18T19:38:52Z")
I really wanna hear from Mueller why he didn’t subpoena Trump. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2019, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/10855 "2019-04-18T19:43:42Z")
> [@UnwittingAmericans](#): > > I really wanna hear from Mueller why he didn’t subpoena Trump. The report basically says because they already had enough information to show that he obstructed justice that it wasn’t worth the hassle and protracted legal battle. From page 418: > [@](#): > > Recognizing that the President would not be interviewed voluntarily, we considered > whether to issue a subpoena for his testimony. We viewed the written answers to be inadequate. > But at that point, our investigation had made significant progress and had produced substantial > evidence for our report. We thus weighed the costs of potentially lengthy constitutional litigation , > with resulting delay in finishing our investigation , against the anticipated benefits for our > investigation and report. As explained in Volume II, Section H.B., we determined that the > substantial quantity of information we had obtained from other sources allowed us to draw relevant > factual conclusions on intent and credibility , which are often inferred from circumstantial evidence > and assessed without direct testimony from the subject of the investigation. ---
**Author:** ![UnwittingAmericans](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/d9b06d/32.png) [@UnwittingAmericans](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UnwittingAmericans)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2019, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/10856 "2019-04-18T19:49:54Z")
Ah never mind. Page 2 of Volume II. They decided not to try to determine intent. ---
**Author:** ![UnwittingAmericans](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/d9b06d/32.png) [@UnwittingAmericans](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UnwittingAmericans)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2019, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/10857 "2019-04-18T19:50:56Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > The report basically says because they already had enough information to show that he obstructed justice that it wasn’t worth the hassle and protracted legal battle. > > From page 418: Ok, thx. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2019, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/10858 "2019-04-18T20:00:36Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > Richard Burr has some explaining to do before he resigns: > [https://www.politico.com/story/2019/04/18/burr-mueller-probe-white-house-1282098](https://www.politico.com/story/2019/04/18/burr-mueller-probe-white-house-1282098) I had hope for Burr, but one thing I noticed a while ago is that in terms of total NRA spending…Burr is the head of the pack. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2019, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/10859 "2019-04-18T20:12:45Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > The more I read, the more it seems clear that yes, Barr was extremely and almost certainly purposefully misleading about the findings of the Mueller report. I don’t know why anyone would be surprised about this possibility, considering all the blatant lies of the administration over the past couple of years. Maybe I’m rushing headlong into things, but I’m beginning to feel that we may want to at least consider thinking about possibly putting together a timetable for not giving William Barr the benefit of the doubt anymore. There, I said it. Flame me if you must. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2019, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/10860 "2019-04-18T20:15:30Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > The more I read, the more it seems clear that yes, Barr was extremely and almost certainly purposefully misleading about the findings of the Mueller report. [House Judiciary Chairman Jerrold Nadler agrees.](https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2019/04/nadler-will-subpoena-full-mueller-report/) ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2019, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/10861 "2019-04-18T20:16:19Z")
Whoa, there, buddy! Let’s have a few exploratory meetings about this “plan” of yours before we rush into things, OK? ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2019, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/10862 "2019-04-18T20:26:34Z")
From the Daily Beast: QAnon Believers Crushed After Mueller Report Fails to Lead to Hillary Clinton’s Arrest [QAnon Believers Crushed After Mueller Report Fails to Lead to Hillary Clinton’s Arrest](https://www.thedailybeast.com/qanon-believers-crushed-after-mueller-report-fails-to-lead-to-hillary-clintons-arrest)? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093.md?page=542) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093.md?page=544)