# A Thread for the Mueller Investigation Results and Outcomes (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 28, 2017, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093 "2017-10-28T20:14:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 564
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2019, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/11263 "2019-05-03T17:39:49Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > Anyway, in news of the real world, Dotard had a conversation with Putin today in which he told Putin that he is not accepting the Mueller Reports conclusion that there was sweeping and systematic Russian interference. In addition, Dotard says that Putin agrees, and that is that. > > But, yeah, Asahi. We should just wait for the elections. After all, so many Americans… you included… apparently need popularity contests to tell you what the right thing is, and when to do it, and those popularity contests _just aren’t there yet_. Also, [in that call,](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/white-house/trump-putin-discussed-mueller-report-agreed-no-collusion-white-house-n1001706) Trump discussed with Putin whether to allow Don McGahn to testify. Because obviously Putin should have a say in that. _“Sanders said that the two leaders discussed whether the administration would allow former White House counsel Don McGahn to testify before Congress as Democrats ramp up their oversight investigations into the administration. McGahn was a key witness in one of the 10 episodes of potential obstruction of justice by Trump Mueller outlined in the report.”_ ---
**Author:** ![GreysonCarlisle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a87d85/32.png) [@GreysonCarlisle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreysonCarlisle)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2019, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/11264 "2019-05-03T17:58:07Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > Also, [in that call,](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/white-house/trump-putin-discussed-mueller-report-agreed-no-collusion-white-house-n1001706) Trump discussed with Putin whether to allow Don McGahn to testify. Because obviously Putin should have a say in that. > > _“Sanders said that the two leaders discussed whether the administration would allow former White House counsel Don McGahn to testify before Congress as Democrats ramp up their oversight investigations into the administration. McGahn was a key witness in one of the 10 episodes of potential obstruction of justice by Trump Mueller outlined in the report.”_ Corrected: > [@](#): > > CORRECTION (May 3,2019, 1:51 p.m. ET): An earlier version of this article incorrectly included one topic that White House press secretary Sarah Sanders said Presidents Trump and Putin discussed on Friday. They did not discuss the possibility of former White House counsel Don McGahn appearing before Congress. Sanders was answering a question from reporters about whether McGahn would testify before Congress. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2019, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/11265 "2019-05-03T18:00:33Z")
#DoNothing2020 ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2019, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/11266 "2019-05-03T18:09:31Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > We are in a situation where Trump is free to discuss the election attack with the man his campaign teamed up with to attack us, while simultaneously the Attorney General refuses to speak to the House of Representatives about that very topic. I know you’re angry about it. I am, too. Unfortunately, a clear majority of Americans just aren’t. And they won’t be until the next recession - then you can impeach all you want. But not until then. ---
**Author:** ![GreysonCarlisle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a87d85/32.png) [@GreysonCarlisle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreysonCarlisle)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2019, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/11267 "2019-05-03T18:18:51Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > I know you’re angry about it. I am, too. Unfortunately, a clear majority of Americans just aren’t. I’d say that the majorities in the majority of the states aren’t angry enough about it. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2019, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/11268 "2019-05-03T18:21:23Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > I know you’re angry about it. I am, too. Unfortunately, a clear majority of Americans just aren’t. > > And they won’t be until the next recession - then you can impeach all you want. But not until then. #DoNothing2020 ---
**Author:** ![CaptMurdock](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/captmurdock/32/11736_2.png) [@CaptMurdock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CaptMurdock)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2019, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/11269 "2019-05-03T18:24:03Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > I know you’re angry about it. I am, too. Unfortunately, a clear majority of Americans just aren’t. > > And they won’t be until the next recession - then you can impeach all you want. But not until then. Bread and Circuses. :rolleyes: “As long as you keep the trains rolling on time, you can shovel all the Jews into the gas ovens that you want.” _Lovely_. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2019, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/11270 "2019-05-03T18:26:26Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > Also, [in that call,](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/white-house/trump-putin-discussed-mueller-report-agreed-no-collusion-white-house-n1001706) Trump discussed with Putin whether to allow Don McGahn to testify. Because obviously Putin should have a say in that. > > _“Sanders said that the two leaders discussed whether the administration would allow former White House counsel Don McGahn to testify before Congress as Democrats ramp up their oversight investigations into the administration. McGahn was a key witness in one of the 10 episodes of potential obstruction of justice by Trump Mueller outlined in the report.”_ It’s almost like they’re trying to troll us. Seriously, what is the logic in sending SHS out to a press pool to talk about how Petain and Hitler spoke and agreed that Hitler didn’t invade France? By doing that they’re pretty much telling Democrats they can kiss his fat orange ass. This isn’t what people who are afraid of being impeached say or do. But go ahead JohnT, fight the good fight.:rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2019, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/11271 "2019-05-03T18:27:35Z")
> [@CaptMurdock](#): > > Bread and Circuses. :rolleyes: > > “As long as you keep the trains rolling on time, you can shovel all the Jews into the gas ovens that you want.” _Lovely_. Prove to the American people that Trump is putting Jews in ovens then you might be on to something. Otherwise, another bad argument for impeachment. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2019, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/11272 "2019-05-03T18:33:51Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > #DoNothing2020 No, not do nothing. But smart generals pick the right battlefield and the right time. Impeachment’s the wrong battlefield, and now is the wrong time. We should shift the battlefield to the election in 2020 - right battlefield, right time. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2019, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/11273 "2019-05-03T18:40:57Z")
I just read an editorial on _The Hill_ that complains that the DNC was [colluding with the Ukraine](https://thehill.com/opinion/white-house/441892-ukrainian-embassy-confirms-dnc-contractor-solicited-trump-dirt-in-2016) in the 2016 election, to get dirt on Individual-1. The headline is kind of misleading, though. It seems a person with the DNC chatted up the Ukrainian Embassy to try to get help finding out what Manafort was up to in Russia. This makes my head hurt. ---
**Author:** ![GreysonCarlisle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a87d85/32.png) [@GreysonCarlisle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreysonCarlisle)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2019, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/11274 "2019-05-03T18:45:40Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > I just read an editorial on _The Hill_ that complains that the DNC was [colluding with the Ukraine](https://thehill.com/opinion/white-house/441892-ukrainian-embassy-confirms-dnc-contractor-solicited-trump-dirt-in-2016) in the 2016 election, to get dirt on Individual-1. The headline is kind of misleading, though. It seems a person with the DNC chatted up the Ukrainian Embassy to try to get help finding out what Manafort was up to in Russia. > > This makes my head hurt. _The Hill_ headlines are often a little misleading. Especially the opinion pieces. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2019, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/11275 "2019-05-03T20:23:49Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > No, not do nothing. But smart generals pick the right battlefield and the right time. Impeachment’s the wrong battlefield, and now is the wrong time. We should shift the battlefield to the election in 2020 - right battlefield, right time. I agree 100%. ---
**Author:** ![UnwittingAmericans](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/d9b06d/32.png) [@UnwittingAmericans](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UnwittingAmericans)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2019, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/11276 "2019-05-03T20:26:48Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > #DoNothing2020 Whatever happened to Jon Stewart anyway? ---
**Author:** ![Tee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/73ab20/32.png) [@Tee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tee)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2019, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/11277 "2019-05-03T22:02:33Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > Impeachment would actually play right into the hands of those who want to go beyond polarization and into radicalization, because what it would do is to send the message to voters in Trump Land that their country is vote is being taken away from them, that their country is being stolen from them. On some level, they already believe that their country is being stolen from them in the figurative sense, but if they see women and minorities trying to use political power to impeach and remove their leader from office, we could very well be sitting on a powder keg. And again, the Russians would absolutely be more than willing to involve themselves and offer some guidance, and they have a lot of experience playing this game. That is why impeaching the president right now, absent of any major crash in his popularity is a dangerous idea. He must be defeated at the ballot box. Viewing this as best I can as a non-partisan, I agree with you. I don’t like the position, but I think that the Republicans and their helpers won this battle in the information war. Out on the street it is very likely that people think the report exonerated Trump of any wrongdoing, and it’s the Democrats that were intent on impeachment no matter what. If Mueller decides to use the voice that God gave him to actually enter the public debate and push back against that idea though, my answer changes. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2019, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/11278 "2019-05-03T22:29:29Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > No, not do nothing. But smart generals pick the right battlefield and the right time. Impeachment’s the wrong battlefield, and now is the wrong time. We should shift the battlefield to the election in 2020 - right battlefield, right time. Really? The same battlefield, using the same tactic, which lost last time? This time against an opponent with the power to rig the game… and is using it, to boot? In a system which is designed to give greater weight to people in States which no longer share the demographic characteristics of the country as a whole? With a political party willing, eager, to open political investigations into their opponents as they are already doing? With a President who literally courts interference in elections by people who agree to allow him to _brand a hotel in his name in their country?_ (What, Asahi, you think Russia is going to be the only country to help throw 2020 to Trump? Don’t be naive. Saudi Arabia owes him big-time with this Khashoggi murder, Japan knows to butter him up, Putin… well, we know what happened there.) You’re not picking the battlefield. You’re conceding it. The conditions for the Democrats to win the WH in 2020 is far worse than it was in 2016, even if they pick the most brilliant and personable candidate ever, and to risk it all on a single throw of the dice _after_ you’ve shown you don’t have the moral or legislative leadership to fight our way out of this mess is a stupid, stupid gamble. But it’s what you’re asking for. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2019, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/11279 "2019-05-03T22:35:38Z")
Think Trump supporters are going to be fired up over impeachment? What is the impact on the Democratic voter if they _don’t_ impeach? ---
**Author:** ![UnwittingAmericans](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/d9b06d/32.png) [@UnwittingAmericans](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UnwittingAmericans)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2019, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/11280 "2019-05-03T22:48:24Z")
Let things progress and play out. It’s only May 3, 2019. Whaddaya, really wanna free up space to watch fuckin’ Democratic town halls and debates every night for the next 18 months? Any of the cable networks running a countdown bug to the next one yet? As soon as it’s clear the Dems investigation/impeachment process is over, I’m going no news/no politics until the day of the election. This presidential campaign is going to amount to a public health crisis. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_stamos_left_ear/32/3198_2.png) [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Stamos_Left_Ear)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2019, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/11281 "2019-05-03T22:58:29Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > Anyway, in news of the real world, Dotard had a conversation with Putin today in which he told Putin that he is not accepting the Mueller Reports conclusion that there was sweeping and systematic Russian interference. In addition, Dotard says that Putin agrees, and that is that. > > But, yeah, Asahi. We should just wait for the elections. After all, so many Americans… you included… apparently need popularity contests to tell you what the right thing is, and when to do it, and those popularity contests _just aren’t there yet_. Not only that, what makes anyone think that this gleaming shit stain of corruption will decide that a fair election is not something he would mess with? That this slimeball will draw the line at doing whatever he can do using his influence and power to tilt things in his favor? The administration is famously doing nothing to address 2020’s election security and still siding with the foreign power that, even if he didn’t directly collaborate with, still likely did tilt the election? I’m not a conspiracy theorist. I realize the difficulty in doing anything meaningful on a national level when each state holds their own elections with very different people who are running them. But if anyone is willing to give the benefit of the doubt that Trump wouldn’t put his finger on the scale in 2020 if he had the chance, or that there’s not enough Trumpers in key positions in battleground states (it doesn’t take a national conspiracy to win, just flip a few thousand votes in a half dozen states). Anyone who feels that a free election whose integrity can be trusted is guaranteed really isn’t paying attention. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2019, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093/11282 "2019-05-03T22:59:30Z")
That 2nd to last paragraph in post 11,368 was using the royal “you” and was not referring to Asahi personally. I tried to edit it, but was too late. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093.md?page=563) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-thread-for-the-mueller-investigation-results-and-outcomes-part-1/800093.md?page=565)