# A U.S. Marshals scenario and real world consequences \[bulk grain freighters\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** movies\ **Created:** [December 12, 2025, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-u-s-marshals-scenario-and-real-world-consequences-bulk-grain-freighters/1025646 "2025-12-12T19:37:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2025, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-u-s-marshals-scenario-and-real-world-consequences-bulk-grain-freighters/1025646/21 "2025-12-13T13:56:35Z")
Great picture of a bulk carrier hold. These ships are huge. There will be multiple large holds like this on a ship. The load still has to be distributed along and across the ship for stability reasons. You don’t want the load to shift dramatically. Bulk cargoes will ‘flow’ like liquids; grains, coal, sand😯, ores, etc … ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2025, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-u-s-marshals-scenario-and-real-world-consequences-bulk-grain-freighters/1025646/22 "2025-12-13T14:32:22Z")
Yep - that’s the free surface effect ai was talking about ---
**Author:** ![GaryM](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/garym/32/241_2.png) [@GaryM](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GaryM)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2025, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-u-s-marshals-scenario-and-real-world-consequences-bulk-grain-freighters/1025646/23 "2025-12-13T14:35:21Z")
A fellow I know died in a grain bin about 3 weeks ago. They were off loading with an auger and his grandson ran to the truck driver and said “Grandpa’s gone” So sad. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2025, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-u-s-marshals-scenario-and-real-world-consequences-bulk-grain-freighters/1025646/24 "2025-12-13T15:13:40Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > There’s a bulk freighter in Cleveland that’s been turned into a floating museum, the Mather. I’ve toured the _Mather_. Can recommend. They cut a large opening in the forward end of the hold so you can see in from the area below the forward superstructure. They’ve got lights strung off into the distant gloom at the far end of the ship. It’s just a giant nearly featureless steel room. But somehow it’s the creepiest damned thing I’ve looked into in a long time. > [@Friedrich Nietzsche](#): > > If you gaze long into an abyss, the abyss also gazes into you. The fact the water line is well above the bottom of the hold makes it extra weird. [Shudder]. ---
**Author:** ![Spiderman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spiderman/32/230_2.png) [@Spiderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiderman)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2025, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-u-s-marshals-scenario-and-real-world-consequences-bulk-grain-freighters/1025646/25 "2025-12-13T15:15:37Z")
Although I’ve never done it I know a little bit about rescuing someone from one. There is a rescue tube that is assembled from three (or four?) pieces that nestle for more compact storage. Assemble them on scene, & lower it around the person. Now grain between the person & the tube can be removed, this allows them to breathe easier if they were up to their chest. Next you can get a harness around them & pull them up & out. Like any other confined space rescues, the rescuer(s) should be harnessed & roped so they can be pull out if they get into difficulty ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2025, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-u-s-marshals-scenario-and-real-world-consequences-bulk-grain-freighters/1025646/26 "2025-12-13T15:16:09Z")
[Moderating] Oh, and I’ve edited the title of the thread to make it clearer what it’s about. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2025, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-u-s-marshals-scenario-and-real-world-consequences-bulk-grain-freighters/1025646/27 "2025-12-13T15:17:36Z")
Regarding bulk grain freighters, I assume the ones that are used for transporting grain don’t also transport crude oil or coal or something else not consumable? ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2025, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-u-s-marshals-scenario-and-real-world-consequences-bulk-grain-freighters/1025646/28 "2025-12-13T15:23:22Z")
Liquids, solids, and gasses need very different bulk arrangements. So any ship has to exclusively carry the state of matter it was built for. Beyond that I’m not competent to say. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2025, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-u-s-marshals-scenario-and-real-world-consequences-bulk-grain-freighters/1025646/29 "2025-12-13T15:31:53Z")
The Mather, that I mentioned upthread, carried all three of grain, iron ore, and coal at various points. Contamination is only possible at surfaces, and with a ship that big, there’s an awfully high ratio of volume to surface area. There’s probably a lot more contamination of food from other sources, and we eat it anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2025, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-u-s-marshals-scenario-and-real-world-consequences-bulk-grain-freighters/1025646/30 "2025-12-13T16:30:42Z")
Thanks but with grain, iron ore and coal, I expect the contamination to be minimal; perhaps some coal dust. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2025, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-u-s-marshals-scenario-and-real-world-consequences-bulk-grain-freighters/1025646/31 "2025-12-13T17:41:34Z")
Crap. I’m sorry to hear that. Farming is dangerous business in general. One of the last really hazardous occupations. I wonder what it would take to eliminate the need for anyone ever to enter a non-empty grain bin? ---
**Author:** ![Tripler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripler/32/21807_2.png) [@Tripler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tripler)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2025, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-u-s-marshals-scenario-and-real-world-consequences-bulk-grain-freighters/1025646/32 "2025-12-13T17:47:46Z")
I honestly did not know this, thank you! And thank you @LSLGuy I always thought Mr Katanga’s accommodations in _ROTLA_ was just a plot device. Tripler “Where did he get a copy to the headpiece to the Staff of Ra?” [and all those prepositions?] ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2025, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-u-s-marshals-scenario-and-real-world-consequences-bulk-grain-freighters/1025646/33 "2025-12-13T17:59:36Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > The Mather, that I mentioned upthread, carried all three of grain, iron ore, and coal at various points. Contamination is only possible at surfaces, and with a ship that big, there’s an awfully high ratio of volume to surface area. I recall that the ship also had something like a sprinkler system installed in the overhead of the hold. Such that they could wash down the sidewalls to get most of the dust & leftover bits of e.g. coal out of there before loading e.g. taconite pellets. Or vice versa. For sure the result would not be food grade clean, but bulk grain handling isn’t all that food grade clean at any of the early steps of the process. It’d be neat if we had anyone in the wheat farm → flour biz who could enlighten us to all the steps and where and how cleanliness gets added along the way. Sadly I don’t know of anyone like that. Small chance @Baker or @thorny_locust know a bit about it from their positions near but not directly in that workflow. ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2025, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-u-s-marshals-scenario-and-real-world-consequences-bulk-grain-freighters/1025646/34 "2025-12-13T18:19:01Z")
Not a farmer, but I grew up in a farm country. Definitely not clean in those silos and large storage facilities as they were crawling with rats and birds eating whatever they were storing. I got bite by a rat when I was four when I was playing outside of a silo, there were dozens of them around. I image the storage bins on a ship are no better. ---
**Author:** ![Dorjan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dorjan/32/12440_2.png) [@Dorjan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dorjan)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2025, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-u-s-marshals-scenario-and-real-world-consequences-bulk-grain-freighters/1025646/35 "2025-12-13T23:07:45Z")
Here’s a great video detailing cleaning a bulk carrier’s cargo hold for corn after carrying coal: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NlrybyqDSAU](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mAXiE6_vIXk) ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2025, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-u-s-marshals-scenario-and-real-world-consequences-bulk-grain-freighters/1025646/36 "2025-12-13T23:45:49Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > It’d be neat if we had anyone in the wheat farm → flour biz who could enlighten us to all the steps and where and how cleanliness gets added along the way. Sadly I don’t know of anyone like that. Small chance @Baker or @thorny_locust know a bit about it from their positions near but not directly in that workflow. I grow fresh market vegetables, some fruits, some herbs. I’m afraid that about all I know about grain bins and silos is what they look like from the outside, what the grain dryers sound like when they’re running, and to stay the hell out of them; including, that if someone went in and didn’t come out, you don’t go in after them; not even if you can look in and see they’re in trouble but visible. You call 911 and they’ll come out with scuba gear. It’ll be too late; but if you go in after them without both the gear and the training, it’ll just be too late for you too. — if the problem is that they’re down in the grain but head and hands are still out, I think you can throw them a rope, if you can get it tied off to something first. Maybe such ropes are kept handy, I don’t know. The problem with safety measures on farms is that they often slow things down and they’d often need to be used by someone who’s both exhausted and in a hurry; and who got away without them so many previous times. Until the time when they don’t. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2025, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-u-s-marshals-scenario-and-real-world-consequences-bulk-grain-freighters/1025646/37 "2025-12-14T00:06:38Z")
I knew you’d be a long shot as to relevant experience but I don’t know much about your early life history; maybe you grew up on a wheat farm. > [@thorny\_locust](#): > > is that they often slow things down and they’d often need to be used by someone who’s both exhausted and in a hurry; and who got away without them so many previous times. Until the time when they don’t. That describes 100% of industrial safety. It’s always an impediment to productivity & convenience. And it’s always unnecessary until the time it isn’t & people are maimed or dead. It’s only mature management and mature workers and aggressive management and government enforcement that keep safety alive as a value. Since most farms are individually owned small businesses and “management” IOW the owner is often the main worker too, it’s an especially tough lift to keep safety awareness alive. With the result that farming is just about the highest risk job there is when we look at the actual stats about injuries, maims, and kills. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2025, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-u-s-marshals-scenario-and-real-world-consequences-bulk-grain-freighters/1025646/38 "2025-12-14T00:13:09Z")
Great cite! Thank you! That looks a lot easier to do on a warm sunny day in calm seas. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2025, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-u-s-marshals-scenario-and-real-world-consequences-bulk-grain-freighters/1025646/39 "2025-12-14T00:20:13Z")
Is the grain in those holds, or in grain silos or even grain railroad cars fumigated or otherwise chemically treated to suppress mold, insects, etc.? If so, how is it made safe for human consumption again? ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2025, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-u-s-marshals-scenario-and-real-world-consequences-bulk-grain-freighters/1025646/40 "2025-12-14T00:31:21Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > Since most farms are individually owned small businesses and “management” IOW the owner is often the main worker too, it’s an especially tough lift to keep safety awareness alive. Yup, exactly. There’s likely to be nobody there whose job it is to tell you to turn off the tractor before messing with the PTO equipment. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-u-s-marshals-scenario-and-real-world-consequences-bulk-grain-freighters/1025646.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-u-s-marshals-scenario-and-real-world-consequences-bulk-grain-freighters/1025646.md?page=3)