# A vengeful nutjob with a gun is coming for you RIGHT NOW. **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 10, 2015, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-vengeful-nutjob-with-a-gun-is-coming-for-you-right-now/727424 "2015-08-10T03:40:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2015, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-vengeful-nutjob-with-a-gun-is-coming-for-you-right-now/727424/61 "2015-08-10T18:00:51Z")
OK, now it’s all over. Two possible outcomes, and what I do in each - [ul][li]The cops showed up before Mr. Nutjob could break in, and arrest him.[/li][list][li]I secure my weapons, tell my son to do the same (actually, he would tell me, as he has much more experience than I), my wife and daughter re-lock up the guns, and I describe the whole thing to the cops outside. What I say is “I knew he was coming, I was in fear of my life, thank God you stopped him.” [/li][li]I then go to the cop shop and sign out a complaint, or whatever is necessary, to make sure he is convicted.[/ul][_]Or, I have to shoot him.[ul][_]I also secure all the weapons.[_]I tell my son, wife, and daughter, very clearly and specifically, **that they do not answer any questions, no matter what. They give their names, address, and birth dates. They say absolutely nothing else, no matter what.** [_]I give the cops my name, address, and birthdate. I then state “I was in fear of my life. I do not wish to answer any further questions until I consult a lawyer.” Then I say nothing whatever.[/ul][/list][/li]Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![GusNSpot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gusnspot/32/436_2.png) [@GusNSpot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GusNSpot)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2015, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-vengeful-nutjob-with-a-gun-is-coming-for-you-right-now/727424/62 "2015-08-10T18:43:09Z")
Out here, you just have an extra shovel for the cop when he shows up to help you. No one after me is a stupid nutjob. They be smarter than that and so I will never get the 10 minute whistle. Just have to be ready. If I get 10 minutes, there will be a crowed waiting for the nutjob. neighbors will be their while the women are firing up the BBQ. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2015, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-vengeful-nutjob-with-a-gun-is-coming-for-you-right-now/727424/63 "2015-08-10T18:44:38Z")
Get in my car and start driving. How’s he going to find me? ---
**Author:** ![CannyDan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cannydan/32/548_2.png) [@CannyDan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CannyDan)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2015, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-vengeful-nutjob-with-a-gun-is-coming-for-you-right-now/727424/64 "2015-08-10T18:54:40Z")
**Airman** , IANA cop and IANA lawyer and I agree that neither of us knows exactly what a cop might be able to do – either legally and in full compliance with departmental guidelines, or otherwise. But… Cop could ask nutter what he’s doing there, even ask for ID. But as has been thoroughly hashed out in multiple other threads, as long as the nutter isn’t doing something that raises ‘articulable suspicion’ of criminal activity, those questions constitute a ‘consensual encounter’ that the nutter can refuse to participate in. And unless said cop can speedily develop some articulable suspicion, nutter walks away. Me telling the cops that my friend told me that in his opinion some other person is “gunning for me” may be enough of a credible threat to support a search, but I’m doubtful. Again, barring some overt act by the nutter, in the presence of the cop, our Constitution protects all of us, nutters included, from “fishing expeditions” by cops. At least, we hope it does. I’m pretty much with **Bricker** on this one. Call the cops, yes, and hope nutter does something nutty enough to get arrested. Short of killing me and mine, that is. I don’t have a basement, but take the SO to an interior room with some distance between us and the doorway, hunker down with one or another of my firearms. Maybe aim a bright light towards the door, with the switch or plug at my hand so I can turn it on as soon as someone breaks through the locked door, illuminating him and leaving me somewhere in the room, behind cover, in the dark (or at least gloom). And wait for the cops to call “all clear”. But again, if nutter is smart enough to go about apparently-normal business, seems like we’ve just delayed the inevitable. What then? Move? ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2015, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-vengeful-nutjob-with-a-gun-is-coming-for-you-right-now/727424/65 "2015-08-10T19:02:49Z")
No, repeat as necessary. If they can’t articulate why they need to check the guy out after the first incident, they won’t have any trouble doing so if they get called a second time. There are only three alternatives here: get the police involved, cap the guy off yourself, or die very messily. The only palatable option is to call the police as often as necessary. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2015, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-vengeful-nutjob-with-a-gun-is-coming-for-you-right-now/727424/66 "2015-08-10T19:18:39Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > I secure my weapons, tell my son to do the same (actually, he would tell me, as he has much more experience than I), my wife and daughter re-lock up the guns, Yeah, locking up the guns – that’s wimmin’s work. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2015, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-vengeful-nutjob-with-a-gun-is-coming-for-you-right-now/727424/67 "2015-08-10T19:21:51Z")
1. Send the family away. 2. Call the cops, tell them everything, and follow their advice. I _could_ just leave the premises without telling anybody, but I’d rather not feel the guilt if he got frustrated and started shooting neighbors and/or assorted passers-by. ---
**Author:** ![G0sp3l](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c68b51/32.png) [@G0sp3l](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/G0sp3l)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2015, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-vengeful-nutjob-with-a-gun-is-coming-for-you-right-now/727424/68 "2015-08-10T21:57:36Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Or you could just not read my threads. It’s not like I force you too. There’s a winged monkey standing behind me with a shotgun saying otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2015, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-vengeful-nutjob-with-a-gun-is-coming-for-you-right-now/727424/69 "2015-08-10T22:23:09Z")
> [@G0sp3l](#): > > There’s a winged monkey standing behind me with a shotgun saying otherwise. What do you do? WHAT DO YOU DO??!!! ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2015, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-vengeful-nutjob-with-a-gun-is-coming-for-you-right-now/727424/70 "2015-08-10T22:31:21Z")
Clearly, those of you clinging to the idea of using a gun of your own just don’t get it. The same guy who stole the nutjob’s gun and killed him with it will do the same thing to you. Now that guy has two guns and any crimes he commits with them are YOUR fault. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2015, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-vengeful-nutjob-with-a-gun-is-coming-for-you-right-now/727424/71 "2015-08-10T22:33:41Z")
I’m still waiting for the OP to stop in and clarify things. I would have very different responses in a not-home-alone situation, depending on whether/how the nutjob would react if he saw my wife drive out of the neighborhood as he was driving in. If I’m home alone, I’m into the woods behind the house in seconds, armed only with my cell phone, leaving behind a locked-up house. I’ll call the cops from the woods and explain the situation, then move fast along trails that hardly anyone else knows. I can exit the woods in different places in my neighborhood, or my choice of three other neighborhoods that are miles from each other by road, though fairly close as the crow flies. With a 10 minute head start, no way he’ll catch me. Same deal if it’s just me and my son. The Firebug’s now 8, and he and I have been exploring the woods together since he was two and a half. He knows them almost as well as I do, and can run pretty fast. If it were both of us, I’d ask the police for a car to pick us up somewhere and take us down to the police officer station. Plans diverge depending on whether his intent to do me harm includes my loved ones if my wife is also with me, because in the woods, she’s a dead duck: a bad ankle, arthritic knees, you name it. The Firebug and I can move far and fast; she can do neither. If the nutjob isn’t going to try and hurt her/them, I’d send her and the Firebug away in the car, then revert to the home-alone plan for myself. If his hostile intent includes my loved ones, then that requires a different plan. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2015, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-vengeful-nutjob-with-a-gun-is-coming-for-you-right-now/727424/72 "2015-08-10T23:13:45Z")
> [@G0sp3l](#): > > There’s a winged monkey standing behind me with a shotgun saying otherwise. I have dispatched a Jenna Coleman-model slapbot to explain to you that the flying monkeys have been demobbed and are no longer my responsibility. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2015, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-vengeful-nutjob-with-a-gun-is-coming-for-you-right-now/727424/73 "2015-08-10T23:18:44Z")
Oh, and RTFirefly, I’m going to rule that you simply don’t know what the nutjob will do it he sees your family but not you. Nobody gets.perfect information. ---
**Author:** ![PatriotGrrrl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9dc877/32.png) [@PatriotGrrrl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotGrrrl)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2015, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-vengeful-nutjob-with-a-gun-is-coming-for-you-right-now/727424/74 "2015-08-10T23:24:16Z")
> [@GaryM](#): > > Call the Sheriff’s office and grab my Saiga 12ga and extra magazines. Call my neighbors for help. Go lie down in the field about 100 feet from the house. We only have a single lane gravel road into our subdivision, so unless he’s going to walk through 1/2 mile of woods he’s not sneaking in. Ohhh, much love for the Saiga. I’ve seen them at shows and considered getting one, but never did. (I have owned some AKs) Do you like it? ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2015, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-vengeful-nutjob-with-a-gun-is-coming-for-you-right-now/727424/75 "2015-08-10T23:29:27Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Armed, and with ten minutes warning, against one guy with a handgun? Virtually 100%, minus a tiny epsilon, that I can stop him before he kills or wounds anyone in my home. > > … > > Can you explain what factors you believe would thwart me? All I have to do is survive until the police arrive. They might not make ten minutes, but they’re going to be there in fifteen for sure. I start from the assumption that the OP is posing a question that is more complex than “would you prefer to kill someone in self defense or have the cops deal with it?” If this were a real life situation, I would immediately question the accuracy of the phone call. Am I certain there’s only one person coming for me? Am I certain there’s 10 minutes to put a plan together? Am I certain that he’s coming tonight and not 12 hours and 10 minutes later? I would take the threat seriously because of the specifics, but I wouldn’t bet my life that the specifics are perfectly accurate. Then we get to how this confrontation might transpire. Is it going to be as simple as me laying an ambush for him if he arrives before the police? I’ve heard that police often miss a lot of their shots in a firefight. Am I assured that I won’t do the same? Am I certain that he won’t have a split second to get off a lucky shot? Am I certain that I have laid a better trap for him than he for me? Am I certain I have outwitted him due to this tipoff? Is his only intent to shoot me with this Glock 19, or might he have another plan? What if he doesn’t intend to invade the house, but rather set it ablaze and wait for me to run out so that he has the drop on me? If I barricade myself in the attic with only one way in or out, who has the advantage - is it me because I know how he must come in, or him because he knows how I must come out? What happens if the police show up and they can’t find the guy? Do I stay up all night just in case? What about the next night? How do I know when the threat is over? I’m not trying to make a point that on the Internet, everyone is a Green Beret who can kill with ruthless efficiency. I’m saying that the enemy gets a vote, and this is a really complex situation, IMHO. In my opinion, the complexity of defending against a home invasion is seriously greater than getting out of there simplifies the situation tremendously. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2015, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-vengeful-nutjob-with-a-gun-is-coming-for-you-right-now/727424/76 "2015-08-10T23:38:13Z")
> [@PatriotGrrrl](#): > > Ohhh, much love for the Saiga. I’ve seen them at shows and considered getting one, but never did. (I have owned some AKs) Do you like it? I have some experience with them. They are cool looking. In terms of things one actually does with a shotgun, they offer little or nothing over a more conventional 12 or 20 gauge autoloader. The ones I fired were reliable, as one would expect from an AK derivative. They were generally less ergonomic than conventional pump or autoloading shotguns. Haven’t priced one in a while, but they used to be cheap, which was a point in their favor compared to something like a Benelli autoloader. ---
**Author:** ![GaryM](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/garym/32/241_2.png) [@GaryM](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GaryM)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2015, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-vengeful-nutjob-with-a-gun-is-coming-for-you-right-now/727424/77 "2015-08-11T00:16:38Z")
> [@PatriotGrrrl](#): > > Ohhh, much love for the Saiga. I’ve seen them at shows and considered getting one, but never did. (I have owned some AKs) Do you like it? It’s not my only shotgun, but fun to shoot. I brought it to a sporting clays course where on of the stations is rabbit doubles. Five sets of two. Loaded a 10 round magazine and asked the trapper to go as fast as he could. Each set was about 15 seconds apart. Lots of fun. Everybody wanted to try it. But it’s not as nice a gun as a Browning Citori by any means. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2015, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-vengeful-nutjob-with-a-gun-is-coming-for-you-right-now/727424/78 "2015-08-11T00:48:58Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Oh, and RTFirefly, I’m going to rule that you simply don’t know what the nutjob will do it he sees your family but not you. Nobody gets.perfect information. OK, then, does he know what my wife looks like well enough to recognize her as she’s driving by in a car? (IRL, I’d likely know whether he did or didn’t.) Hell, does he know what we drive these days? Since he knows my name, he can find my address easily enough, but he’d actually have to have been spying on us already to know our cars, and that seems like the sort of thing that would be in your OP if it were true. I’m not asking if he’d shoot my loved ones if they were present in the house either with or without me; I agree that IRL, I just wouldn’t know. But I’d know whether or not he knew my wife, and from when. ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2015, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-vengeful-nutjob-with-a-gun-is-coming-for-you-right-now/727424/79 "2015-08-11T01:04:51Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > I’m still waiting for the OP to stop in and clarify things. I would have very different responses in a not-home-alone situation, depending on whether/how the nutjob would react if he saw my wife drive out of the neighborhood as he was driving in. > > If I’m home alone, I’m into the woods behind the house in seconds, armed only with my cell phone, leaving behind a locked-up house. I’ll call the cops from the woods and explain the situation, then move fast along trails that hardly anyone else knows. I can exit the woods in different places in my neighborhood, or my choice of three other neighborhoods that are miles from each other by road, though fairly close as the crow flies. With a 10 minute head start, no way he’ll catch me. > > Same deal if it’s just me and my son. The Firebug’s now 8, and he and I have been exploring the woods together since he was two and a half. He knows them almost as well as I do, and can run pretty fast. If it were both of us, I’d ask the police for a car to pick us up somewhere and take us down to the police officer station. > > Plans diverge depending on whether his intent to do me harm includes my loved ones if my wife is also with me, because in the woods, she’s a dead duck: a bad ankle, arthritic knees, you name it. The Firebug and I can move far and fast; she can do neither. If the nutjob isn’t going to try and hurt her/them, I’d send her and the Firebug away in the car, then revert to the home-alone plan for myself. If his hostile intent includes my loved ones, then that requires a different plan. I’m in SoCal and there is no natural camouflage. Would that change your view at all? ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2015, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-vengeful-nutjob-with-a-gun-is-coming-for-you-right-now/727424/80 "2015-08-11T01:17:16Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > OK, then, does he know what my wife looks like well enough to recognize her as she’s driving by in a car? (IRL, I’d likely know whether he did or didn’t.) Hell, does he know what we drive these days? Since he knows my name, he can find my address easily enough, but he’d actually have to have been spying on us already to know our cars, and that seems like the sort of thing that would be in your OP if it were true. > > I’m not asking if he’d shoot my loved ones if they were present in the house either with or without me; I agree that IRL, I just wouldn’t know. But I’d know whether or not he knew my wife, and from when. If he knows your address, I’d certainly assume he knows what car you drive and what your wife looks like. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-vengeful-nutjob-with-a-gun-is-coming-for-you-right-now/727424.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-vengeful-nutjob-with-a-gun-is-coming-for-you-right-now/727424.md?page=5)