# A very clear presentation of the Gospel of Jesus Christ. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 22, 2001, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-very-clear-presentation-of-the-gospel-of-jesus-christ/55414 "2001-02-22T03:12:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 5\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![More\_Cowbell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5a626/32.png) [@More\_Cowbell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/More_Cowbell)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2001, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-very-clear-presentation-of-the-gospel-of-jesus-christ/55414/141 "2001-02-28T19:09:13Z")
JerseyDiamond > [@](#): > > That’s why I get so angry when people who claim to read the Bible take verses and twist it so it fits his/her beliefs. So we can agree that a relationship is a two way street. One searches for God, and in turn, he calls out to us. Of course, you were too busy accusing me (yet again) of “claiming” to read the Bible and “twisting” verses around. Sorry to break this to you, but every verse Christianity uses to show that Jesus was the Messiah because he fullfilled OT “prophesy” is taken out of context and twisted around, as is the principle of the Trinity and the existance of a Satan that fell from heaven and is opposed to God. So, if you want to talk about twists and out of context verses, please proceed. > [@](#): > > John 3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him. You could quote the The Scarlet Letter here. I don’t put much credence into the NT. > [@](#): > > Funny thing, you come off as very arrogant and intolerant to me. This board always stresses how everyone is entitled to his or her own opinion, so how can you get so mad when I voice mine? I think you are confusing this with my anger. An opinion is one thing, condemnation is another. I never said what you believed is wrong, I never questioned the validity of your experiences or your faith, and I never claimed that my beliefs are right and there is no tolerance for any other beliefs. > [@](#): > > Believe me I don’t expect you to respect what I believe, cause I sure don’t respect Most of what I read. Again, I never claimed to not respect your beliefs, I am opposed to your attacks on my experiences, my beliefs, and the genuineness of my experiences. And if you respect almost nothing about what you read, why should you expect respect in return. Oops, lets just forget about that Golden Rule thing. > [@](#): > > this is what Someone told me: “there is 2 types of tongues, there is the Gift of tongues which is one of the gifts of the spirit and there is the heavenly tongue that we recieve when we are baptised in the Holy Ghost, it is the gift of tongues that I think Paul is talking about”. I’m not to sure on this So you’ll respect the thoughts of people when they agree with you, but not of those who don’t. _Interesting._ Well, here is something for you do research on. Augustine said around 150 C.E. (or A.D. if you prefer) that the gifts of the spirit (charims, which include tongues) fulfilled their purpose for establishing the church and have ended. 110 years after Jesus, 3 generations, and there were no more tongues. But yet you say they are still active, or “aren’t sure about it”. THERE is an informed faith! So, if 1900 years later, you know people who speak in tongues, then where does those tongues come from? Maybe you’ve been fooled by those wolves you claim we are. By the way, cessation of the gifts can be supported Biblically. So, what do those experiences mean now? Notice I didn’t say they were wrong, but asked you to use your mind as well as your emotions. Why don’t I see you doing that? Why do I see you being one of the disciples outside the door chastising Jesus for talking with prostitutes and lepers? Andros (below is IMHO): Well, first off I think one can be inspired by God without having to be taken literally. Literalist are a fairly new breed (I believe it developed around the Scopes trial, but don’t hold me to it). I think the OT is a collection of God inspired stories to show that there are consequences for all actions, for inspiration through triumph and defeat, and also shows the history of a people who based their lives around certain principles. The words aren’t as important as the message. I think that is one of the things Jesus was trying to say. It not about who can follow the most rules, it’s about loving people. Love one another, and the rules will be followed. So which is “most correct”. Doesn’t really matter, it’s just words. It’s the spirit of the words that are important. People are too busy saying “look what God did here and here, killing all those people” and don’t look at the meaning of the story in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![jab1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ee7513/32.png) [@jab1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jab1)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2001, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-very-clear-presentation-of-the-gospel-of-jesus-christ/55414/142 "2001-03-01T01:21:40Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Holly \* > **JerseyDiamond: You cannot possibly know (unless you can see the future) that you will not someday lose your faith.** I guess she has faith that she will always have faith. ---
**Author:** ![jab1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ee7513/32.png) [@jab1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jab1)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2001, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-very-clear-presentation-of-the-gospel-of-jesus-christ/55414/143 "2001-03-01T01:36:35Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Freyr \* > **typical of Christians, especially the Fundamentalist types. They casually dismiss what they can’t or won’t understand.** Fine examples of folks who suffer from [cognitive dissonance,](http://www.britannica.com/bcom/eb/article/9/0,5716,25059+1+24662,00.html) wouldn’t you say? (But **freyr** , I remind you that I am an athiest; I don’t believe Wiccan mythology any more than I do the Christian one. I don’t believe ANY mythology.) ---
**Author:** ![jab1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ee7513/32.png) [@jab1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jab1)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2001, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-very-clear-presentation-of-the-gospel-of-jesus-christ/55414/144 "2001-03-01T01:46:02Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Polycarp \* > The only reasonable conclusion from how God operates vis-a-vis humanity is that our mortal lives are supposed to be **learning experiences** , from which we grow. And those who don’t learn get tossed into the lake o’ fire? Even if it’s only 5%, that’s still too many. No one deserves that kind of torment. And what if what we’re expected to learn makes no freaking sense whatsoever? > [@](#): > > **What His purpose is in doing things this way, I have not a clue. But I’m confident there is one.** I’d also daresay you might be a bit afraid that there is not one? It takes more courage to face the world without a god than with one. It means there are no easy answers and you sometimes have to rely on yourself for comfort. ---
**Author:** ![JerseyDiamond](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/8491ac/32.png) [@JerseyDiamond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JerseyDiamond)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2001, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-very-clear-presentation-of-the-gospel-of-jesus-christ/55414/145 "2001-03-01T03:24:57Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Triskadecamus \* > \*\*Jersey, > > The Lord promises you that you shall be judged by the measure with which you judge others. For the benefit of your own soul, lighten up. Your right Tris, 🙂 I will lighten up. Sorry everyone! Talk to you all later. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-very-clear-presentation-of-the-gospel-of-jesus-christ/55414.md?page=7)