# A word from SA regarding the "Insanity" thread **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 21, 2008, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-word-from-sa-regarding-the-insanity-thread/468853 "2008-10-21T04:00:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 7:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-word-from-sa-regarding-the-insanity-thread/468853/161 "2008-10-23T07:39:46Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > From Wiki: > > "Kennedy enacted policies providing political, economic, and military support **for the unstable French-installed South Vietnamese government** , The form of government was left behind by the French, but Diem was installed by the U.S. and he was at the top of a “U.S. supported” government–which is what I said, your misreadings of Wikipedia notwithstanding. (If you wish to rely on Wikipedia, you might want to read the article on [Diem](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ngo_Dinh_Diem).) > [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > You may note also that Kennedy appeared to be ready to wind down U.S. involvement in Vietnam whereas it was escalated by Johnson, thus supporting my contention that had Kennedy not been killed, the huge anti-war movement would most likely never have happened at all, dirty hippies (hi, \*\*luci \*\*;)) or no. Several of Kennedy’s friends have been pushing the “Kennedy wanted to get out” bit ever since the war got seriously unpopular. Maybe he did; maybe he didn’t. At any rate, Johnson had no desire to get more involved, either. He initially resisted calls from Bundy, McNamara, and others to get more involved. When the replacement government to Diem began to stumble over the next months and after the Gulf of Tonkin incident, Johnson was sucked into the situation. He did not leap in looking to enlarge the war. > [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > I never said (I think when it comes to you I’m just gonna keep that phrase in my clipboard; had I actually been able to post my response to your post last night the reason would be immediately obvious) that we should ignore those years. In fact, they fit right in with my contention that the so-called British invasion that began in 1963 played a large role in setting the nation’s youth of the time against the rest of society, the Vietnam war included. It is not what you have said, it is what you carefully imply. You initially claimed that the opposition to the war came in reaction to Johnson’s mishandling of it. When I pointed out that opposition to our involvement began while Kennedy was still president, you claimed that you are only talking about the later, noisy protests–a point you never actually made, earlier. That seems to be a pretty clear implication that the earlier period should be ignored, since that is when the protests began. > [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > > [@tomndebb](#): > > > > The protests by Buddhist monks were individual actions, not rallies of any sort. > > Exactly. Isn’t that pretty much what I said? > [Quote=tomndebb] > Their display across TV screens and news magazines across the U.S., however, led to a number of people beginning to question whether our involvement was a good idea. The number of people who considered U.S. involvement a bad idea grew steadily from the summer of 1963 through the spring of 1965. Again, just like I said. The movement was taking root at that time, but it easily could have died out had Kennedy not died and had not the baby-boom generation not become alienated from the rest of society as a result of Beatlemania morphing into the long-haired, dope-smoking anti-establishment hippie movement. [/quote] What I posted was not “just what you said.” You misinterpreted my statement–that the protests in the U.S. began as a reaction to the Buddhist suicides–to be a claim that the Buddhist suicides were small actions of little consequence. I responded with a fuller explanation of the entire sequence of events (that you are now chopping up and pretending that you had already said the same thing). > [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Where did I say folk music ‘initiated’ the anti-war movement? Nowhere, that’s where (and it’s beginning to come back to me now why I came to stop answering your posts to begin with; they almost never reflect what I actually said. If you keep this up I’m afraid I’m gonna have to resume that practice.) No, you merely said that you did not associate the protest movement with a few Buddhist monks or a few malcontents “inspired by” folk musicians. The clear point that I made was that the protests began much earleir than you wish to admit and that they were not as small as you wish to pretend–and that they certainly were not merely “inspired” by music. In fact, folk music–and folk music as a vehicle for social protests–goes back at least to the 1930s. The point, however, was that folk music did not lead anyone to protest the war; folk musicians simply added their voices to a growing opposition to the war. > [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Folk music was a relatively small element among the forces that eventually led to the huge anti-war movement of the late sixties, but it was hardly a major one, and again, it would likely have died on the vine in terms of societal impact had not the Beatles, hippiedom and anti-establishmentarianism ensued. This seems merely wishful thinking on your part. As noted, folk music has been around a long time. (And if, as you now admit, it was not a major part of the movement, perhaps you should not have made your initial claim that it “inspired” the movement that was actually larger than you wish to admit.) > [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > My contention is that the society that existed at that time was one that functioned very well, all things considered, but it was one in which certain bad things did indeed exist (just like certain bad things exist now in this liberal-influenced society which liberals discount just as readily as you might accuse me of doing about society then). > > But all this is really just smoke and mirrors. The crux of the problem, and the catalyst for it, was the way the nation’s youth - the babyboom generation, a huge number of people - adopted wildly radical ways of dressing and behaving and found themselves at odds with the rest of society. The Vietnam war then provided them with a rallying point from which to rebel and coalesce into a cohesive movement in mindless opposition to the status quo. > Liberalism ensued, and the problems I’ve been describing the last few days are the very predictable result. More realistically, it was a society that was already sitting atop a number of social issues (not all of them problems) that was ready to erupt, regardless of the appearance of a few musicians from England. Part of it was influenced by the sheer size of the baby boom, but most of the disruptive elements were going to break out whether or not the generation born between 1946 and 1964 had been as populous as they were. Your claims about boomers seem to buy into some of the legends of the period without actually paying attention to what actually happened. For one thing, the boomers are not some sort of monolithic population that acted in some sort of lock step. Over half the names on the Vietnam Memorial are of boomers who served and died in Vietnam. Throughout the Vietnam War, [boomers consistently showed more support than any other demographic for the war](http://www.seanet.com/~jimxc/Politics/Mistakes/Vietnam_support.html). As I noted in one of [our earlier exchanges](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=10164974#post10164974) on this topic, the 1950s were _abnormally_ quiet and bore the seeds for much more disruption. > [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > [Quote=tomndebb] > In regards to my red-baiting comment: your denial that earlier speeches raising the blood of people to hate other people for their beliefs is, I’m afraid, one more example of a lack of historical curiosity. _Sigh_ I didn’t say that. And I disagree. You should as well, unless you think that type of behavior went on for forty years and served to separate the two political parties and ideologies into the intransigent and hate-filled entities they are today. The 1800s notwithstanding, relations between the two political parties and ideologies was much more civil and far less hate-filled than it has been since the advent of “racist”, “sexist,” “capitalist pig”, “selfish”, “uncaring”, “greedy”, “evil”, etc. began to define the standards of political discourse in this country starting in the late sixties. [/QUOTE] It seems to me that you not only did, originally, mean what I have paraphrased, but you have repeated it, here. For one thing, I do not see any significant difference in tone between the words you have highlighted and the words “commie,” “pinko,” “unAmerican,” “treasonous,” “duped,” “uppity,” “inferior race,” or any of the other epithets that were common in American political discourse before the ones at which you take so much umbrage. For that matter, the relations between the two parties remained cordial well into the 1980s (when the Religious Right began chipping away at civility in that arena) and did not become openly hostile until the 1994 Congressional elections. The difference being that while name-calling has always been a part of the American scene among rabble rousers along the fringes, it took the Gingrich revolution to bring that level of acrimony into the halls of Congress (once we got congresscritters to stop having duels and beating each other with canes in the early 19th century). Why you think that having anyone throughout the 1950s who proposed any sort of social program being branded a “commie” or anyone championing civil rights being called “race traitor” or “nigger lover” was less hateful than the words aimed at people opposing specific legislation regarding the rights of women or ethnic groups, I cannot imagine. If you attempt to claim that such was not the case prior to the late 1960s, I will simply have to conclude that you were not really there (or that you lived in some small enclave that was so vanilla that no one even bothered to address such issues in public). ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Svinlesha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/22d042/32.png) [@Mr.Svinlesha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Svinlesha)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 7:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-word-from-sa-regarding-the-insanity-thread/468853/162 "2008-10-23T07:48:17Z")
Oh, and I just have to respond to this really, really idiotic statement from **Starving Nutball** , here: > [@](#): > > _Now it’s become more than obvious to me that, after the initial horror people felt around here as a result of being boldly confronted with the ills that liberalism has wrought upon this society, everyone has decided to hang their hat on the allegation that I’m immune to facts and reason…especially facts and reason that attempt to let them off the hook in regard to the damage they’ve done._ I assure you that none of us regular posters have felt anything resembling “horror” at your piteous attempts to promote conservative ideology, here. Contempt, disgust, disbelief at the mind boggling stupidity, yes. Horror? No, I don’t think so. And the idea that we’ve never before been “boldly confronted with ills of liberalism” is laughable. You can’t hold a candle to old **december** , believe me. I’ve seen many a poster like you come and go over the years: full of pride and bluster, bloated on their own self-importance, “a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing,” to quote the Bard. That you believe yourself to be somehow special, because you waste our time posting your content-free rants, is really pathetic. Sad. You’re like one of those poor, lost street preachers, wandered into the SDMB and futilely trying to convince us, “Yes, but outside of this message board, there are some people who actually do like me!” :rolleyes: I certainly hope that’s the case, because as you’ve made abundantly clear, you need all the friends you can get. So no one here has decided to “hang their hat” on the allegation that you are utterly immune to logical argument and matters of fact. You quite literally demonstrate this yourself, in every post. That you are unable to understand this about yourself betokens nothing more than a stunning lack of personal insight on your part – which, by the way, is one of the salient characteristics of a typical high RWA. Then there’s the final little bit about the “damage we’ve done.” To start with, you know nothing of me or the damage I’ve done. As usual, these are from you nothing more than accusations without substance. But I think **Zoe** , in particular, needs to take note of the blind hatred and contempt with which **SA** really regards her. He actually believes, **Zoe** , that because of your political beliefs, you are **evil**. He says as much: > [@](#): > > \*I’ll hold up millions of deaths over the last 40 years due to the permissive society you champion from drugs and drug-related crimes, not to mention many millions more whose lives have been ruined when someone in their family becomes a drug addict or is killed in a drug-related murder; from people raped and killed by criminals and murderers set loose on society by liberal judges and correctional systems; from drive-by shootings in gang-related killings caused by gangs that have been allowed to flourish, grow and propogate by liberal resistance to having them outlawed because to do so would be ‘racist’; from AIDS…deaths that are directly attributable to widespread homosexual promiscuity condoned and even encouraged by liberals in the early eighties; by second and third term abortion of perfectly sentient little babies who, with a little care and stabilization in the hospital, could have survived and been taken home way prematurely just like a full-term baby, and who instead are subjected to some of the most horrific deaths imaginable by the very same people who wail that using drugs on torturing, raping murderers is cruel because, who knows, they might feel something before they die. > > Etc., etc., etc…ad fucking nauseum! > > So yeah, I think if anybody in this country could be called evil it would be you guys, because millions upon millions of people in this country have suffered and died over the last 40 years because of you!\* So, if you have any self-respect at all, **Zoe** , I think it is incumbent upon you to take a step back and see clearly who you are dealing with here, and what he’s really like, when he’s not pretending to be nice to you over some _object d’art_. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 8:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-word-from-sa-regarding-the-insanity-thread/468853/163 "2008-10-23T08:10:45Z")
I’m with you all the way, **Big Svin** , up until that last part. **Zoe** exhibits patience and generosity even to the unworthy, qualities that I can ardently admire without any intention of emulating. She has kept the true spirit, she turns away wrath with the kind word, and puts the flower down the gun barrel. Somebody’s got to do it, and I don’t think its going to be you, and I’m _damn_ sure it ain’t gonna be me. And **SA** , remember that Jesus loves you, even if everybody else thinks you’re an asshole. And **Tom** , damn! Hats off to a masterful performance, you marshall battallions of simple facts and set them to marching crunch crunch crunch. Hell, if I’d a known you were so smart, wouldn’t have said even half those things I said about you! Verily, thou rocketh. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Svinlesha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/22d042/32.png) [@Mr.Svinlesha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Svinlesha)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 8:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-word-from-sa-regarding-the-insanity-thread/468853/164 "2008-10-23T08:29:33Z")
Yeah. He’s incredible. He’s like some kind of human computer. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 9:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-word-from-sa-regarding-the-insanity-thread/468853/165 "2008-10-23T09:36:37Z")
> [@Mr.Svinlesha](#): > > **december** \ \ ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 9:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-word-from-sa-regarding-the-insanity-thread/468853/166 "2008-10-23T09:37:19Z")
Okay, I have fucking had it! I just spent two and a half hours composing a point by point reply to **tomndebb’s** not so clever misrepresentations and lies. Two and a half fucking hours, including research to back up my claims and cites, just like a good little boy and like all you silly fuckers have been insisting upon! I complete the fucking post and click preview. I get a fucking dialog requesting log-in…you know, like we’ve been getting every five minutes for two days now! So I click it and get told I’m already logged in, go back and refresh. I do that, and my fucking post is gone! So, so much for the good fight! I have wasted a good three and a half hours over the last two nights composing posts to that disingenuous, supercilious asshole, and have nothing to show for it! So deal! You’re gettin’ nothing but sound bites out of my ass until this shit is well fixed and done! I’m out! ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Svinlesha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/22d042/32.png) [@Mr.Svinlesha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Svinlesha)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 9:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-word-from-sa-regarding-the-insanity-thread/468853/167 "2008-10-23T09:49:12Z")
I’ve had the same happen to me, and I know what a drag it is. But even if you didn’t get it posted, I want to tell you I appreciate the you would put effort into it. Also, a word of advice: **always** compose long, cite-filled posts in a word document first, and then copy 'n paste. I am at least very interested to see any evidence you’ve got to support your claims. I won’t promise that I’ll agree with you, put I do promise to consider your arguments with an open mind. ---
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 9:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-word-from-sa-regarding-the-insanity-thread/468853/168 "2008-10-23T09:51:43Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Okay, I have fucking had it! > > I just spent two and a half hours composing a point by point reply to **tomndebb’s** not so clever misrepresentations and lies. Two and a half fucking hours, including research to back up my claims and cites, just like a good little boy and like all you silly fuckers have been insisting upon! > > I complete the fucking post and click preview. I get a fucking dialog requesting log-in…you know, like we’ve been getting every five minutes for two days now! So I click it and get told I’m already logged in, go back and refresh. I do that, and my fucking post is gone! > > So, so much for the good fight! I have wasted a good three and a half hours over the last two nights composing posts to that disingenuous, supercilious asshole, and have nothing to show for it! > > So deal! You’re gettin’ nothing but sound bites out of my ass until this shit is well fixed and done! > > I’m out! Somehow I think you’re full of shit and lies as always, but fer fucks sake, Ctrl-C, Ctrl-V. How hard is this to figure out since you keep crying about this? Cripes, I caught on that this board is held together by duct tape and you need to do that back in the dark ages. I mean fuck, you making a post full of cites for 2 1/2 hours? When are the UFOs gonna appear, I mean I want to believe, but for some reason I’m skeptical. I wonder why - oh yeah, I still have a functioning brain. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 10:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-word-from-sa-regarding-the-insanity-thread/468853/169 "2008-10-23T10:07:55Z")
Suck my dick, asshole! Anybody who knows my history around here would know I would never stoop to such a stupid and pointless, not to mention dishonest, trick. Even if I were so inclined, what would it accomplish, shithead? The great thing about being honest is you don’t have to worry about whether any shitbugs believe you. I tell the truth. I could give a fuck if you believe it. And **Svin** …would you make up your fucking mind? Either be a good guy or an asshole. This constant flip-flopping is making it hard to get a bead on you. 😃 Regarding Word, I’ve never liked doing that because for some reason it seems harder to guage the flow as it will appear on the Dope’s page. I guess I’m gonna have to get used to it though. Damn, this is a pisser! Anyway, thanks for your post. I’ll see if I can reconstruct mine tomorrow. At least I know now where to find what I want. Here’s hoping tomorrow won’t be like today and that there won’t be fresh **tomndebb** epic bullshit that will supercede it. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Svinlesha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/22d042/32.png) [@Mr.Svinlesha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Svinlesha)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 10:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-word-from-sa-regarding-the-insanity-thread/468853/170 "2008-10-23T10:08:20Z")
**Gyrate:** > [@](#): > > \*\ > > \ \* No, no, that’s P **d** DS: Post-\*\*december \*\*Stress Disorder. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Svinlesha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/22d042/32.png) [@Mr.Svinlesha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Svinlesha)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 10:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-word-from-sa-regarding-the-insanity-thread/468853/171 "2008-10-23T10:48:35Z")
**SA:** My beef with you has a few different sources, but your stubborn unwillingness to support what you post with evidence – and reasonably address evidence against you – is certainly one of the biggest. It seems as if you are beginning to understand that, and I figure if you’re willing to do something to address the problem you’re making a step in the right direction, which should be lauded. (You also have the added advantage of proving me wrong, since I didn’t really think you were capable of changing.) We can’t have a dialog, or any sort of meaningful discussion, if all you do is accuse me of fucking up American on the sole basis of your (in your own mind) unassailable opinion. I’m really not such a bad guy, but I’m fed up with many of the conservatives around here, who constantly pull this kind of shit. They do X, then deny doing it and accuse their opponents of doing it instead. **Shodan** is the absolute master of this technique: one of the single most bone-headed, opinionated, disingenuous partisan hacks on these boards, who does little more than cruise into other threads and accuse everyone who disagrees with him of being a bone-headed, opinionated, disingenuous partisan hack. You have to understand that I’ve hung around in these parts for a long time, and it didn’t always used to be like this. There was a time when this board sported a fairly large community of conservatives. During the run up to the Iraq war, they treated those of us who opposed the invasion like complete shit. They were really disingenuous, haughty, and insulting. Then, once the war got rolling and it began to become apparent that they were all horribly, horribly wrong about so many things, they began to slink off. As **Airman Doors** noted once, long ago, they simply retired rather than sticking around trying to defend the indefensible. Then the board starting charging for membership, and things kinda went belly up. I quit posting not because of the cost – which was really a pittance – but because all the interesting conversations/debates seemed to dry up. If everybody pretty much agrees with each other, and there’s no “contest of ideas” to generate interest, then what’s the point? Anyway, _my_ point is simply that the board has not always been so skewed to the center-left, even if the center-left has always had a majority presence here (from my perspective, Obama is a right-winger). It’s moved more in that direction over time (IMHO), because the last eight years have demonstrated so clearly the hypocrisy and hollowness of the right’s political philosophy that only a few dead-enders are left to try to defend it: people like you, **Shodan** , **Carol Steam** , and so on. What you see as a bastion of leftist opinion is really the end result of a long process in which many people like you came to the boards with opinions like yours, and either 1) gradually changed their stripes, 2) slunk off in defeat, or 3) behaved in such an unacceptable manner that they got themselves banned. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 11:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-word-from-sa-regarding-the-insanity-thread/468853/172 "2008-10-23T11:06:09Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Okay, I have fucking had it! > > I just spent two and a half hours composing a point by point reply to **tomndebb’s** not so clever misrepresentations and lies. Two and a half fucking hours, including research to back up my claims and cites, just like a good little boy and like all you silly fuckers have been insisting upon! > > I complete the fucking post and click preview. I get a fucking dialog requesting log-in…you know, like we’ve been getting every five minutes for two days now! So I click it and get told I’m already logged in, go back and refresh. I do that, and my fucking post is gone! > > So, so much for the good fight! I have wasted a good three and a half hours over the last two nights composing posts to that disingenuous, supercilious asshole, and have nothing to show for it! > > So deal! You’re gettin’ nothing but sound bites out of my ass until this shit is well fixed and done! > > I’m out! The dog ate your homework, is it? ---
**Author:** ![jali](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ecae2f/32.png) [@jali](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jali)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 12:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-word-from-sa-regarding-the-insanity-thread/468853/173 "2008-10-23T12:44:19Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > The dog ate your homework, is it? Twice in the same thread. ---
**Author:** ![fluiddruid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@fluiddruid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fluiddruid)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-word-from-sa-regarding-the-insanity-thread/468853/174 "2008-10-23T13:09:19Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Fixed that for ya. 🙂 Starving Artist, you’ve been around long enough to know that this isn’t acceptable. You do not make changes to attributed quotes on this board. If you want to change matter in a quote tag, do not attribute it to a specific user. This is a warning. Do not do this again. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-word-from-sa-regarding-the-insanity-thread/468853/175 "2008-10-23T14:33:48Z")
Two rhetorical questions here, for the consideration of readers: could **S\_A** ’s attitude towards liberalism and persons who identify with any of liberalism’s tenets be fairly described as bigotry? If so, is there ever a case where bigotry is an acceptable position? ---
**Author:** ![Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e47c2d/32.png) [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffy_the_Elephant_Shrew)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-word-from-sa-regarding-the-insanity-thread/468853/176 "2008-10-23T14:45:13Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > Two rhetorical questions here, for the consideration of readers: could **S\_A** ’s attitude towards liberalism and persons who identify with any of liberalism’s tenets be fairly described as bigotry? No. To describe it as such would be to fall into the same fallacy that the right uses to accuse the left of “intolerance” when we oppose their viewpoints. ETA: I know you said it was rhetorical, but I think it’s worth addressing. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-word-from-sa-regarding-the-insanity-thread/468853/177 "2008-10-23T15:01:59Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > I’m not going to make any more arguments, because i honestly have no interest in dealing with you any longer. I simply can’t and won’t engage with someone who eschews all logic and reason, who apparently has no idea what the word “probative” means, and who considers any evidence that contradicts his worldview and his personal experience to be obfuscatory. > > I withdraw not in acrimony or animosity, but merely out of exhaustion. And i don’t mean this thread alone. I’ve decided that it is literally as if we are speaking different languages; we have no common understanding of what constitutes evidence and fact and reason and debate, so no purpose is served by further communication on issues where those things are important. Welcome to the club. I concluded years ago that **SA** ’s brain quite literally does not work right, and stopped trying to engage him in rational discourse. Instead, I stand on the sidelines and make wisecracks. It’s hardly honorable, and sometimes I feel a little dirty. Still, I can’t deny that it’s fun, and it doesn’t negatively impact the quality of the discussion, because **SA** is quite literally impervious to the back-and-forth of normal human conversation, and these threads not only don’t go anywhere, they never even have the potential of going anywhere. So in the absence of any other options, I try to liven things up with jokey asides. I should probably just leave these threads alone, and stop getting my jollies by poking the autistic bear cub with a stick, but hey, I never said I was perfect. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-word-from-sa-regarding-the-insanity-thread/468853/178 "2008-10-23T15:10:44Z")
> [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](#): > > No. To describe it as such would be to fall into the same fallacy that the right uses to accuse the left of “intolerance” when we oppose their viewpoints. > > ETA: I know you said it was rhetorical, but I think it’s worth addressing. Sure, that’s fine. I’m open to other opinions on this. ---
**Author:** ![Jenaroph](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e8c25b/32.png) [@Jenaroph](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jenaroph)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-word-from-sa-regarding-the-insanity-thread/468853/179 "2008-10-23T15:38:15Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > The dog ate your homework, is it? My life experience tells me this is the case. I have never experienced the board logging me out, ergo anyone else’s stated experience is anecdotal and valueless. A singular report of such a small scale event clearly should carry no weight. Don’t bother pointing out **Mr. Svinlesha’s** post that it’s happened to him too; I’ve already read it and I think it’s an example of the pervasive liberal ideology that nothing is the individual poster’s fault, and that somebody else needs to take care of the problem. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2008, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-word-from-sa-regarding-the-insanity-thread/468853/180 "2008-10-23T15:44:16Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > …plus like I said, if all liberals were like you the country would be much better off. I don’t see the kind of anti-conservative rhetoric coming out of you that leads posters such as me to say things in the way we do. Do you take any personal responsibility for the things you say to people here, or are you powerless not to follow the lead of liberals? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-word-from-sa-regarding-the-insanity-thread/468853.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-word-from-sa-regarding-the-insanity-thread/468853.md?page=10)