# Abe Lincoln's Tax Reurns **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 25, 2017, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abe-lincolns-tax-reurns/794626 "2017-08-25T04:55:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 8\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Ace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/6bbea6/32.png) [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abe-lincolns-tax-reurns/794626/21 "2017-08-26T01:02:32Z")
We won’t see the records themselves, but I’m sure we’ll get the tasty tidbits when Mueller releases his final report. ---
**Author:** ![Reddy\_Mercury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/43a26b/32.png) [@Reddy\_Mercury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reddy_Mercury)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abe-lincolns-tax-reurns/794626/22 "2017-08-26T02:36:57Z")
My mother kept her tax returns going back to 1975. Was pretty cool to see. I grabbed a few (her first, second, two 1980s ones, and a 1990s one) as well as a bunch of other old documents from the 1980s-1990s she had saved (IE copies of checks, banking statements from like 1993 etc). They would’ve been thrown out if she hadn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abe-lincolns-tax-reurns/794626/23 "2017-08-26T02:53:39Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > The storage and search reality has changed. Society and especially our laws haven’t caught up to that change yet. > > A side consequence of the tech revolution is that some records now have shorter storage lives than they used to. … I do believe this to quite insightful and correct. Thank you. ---
**Author:** ![APB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8e8cbc/32.png) [@APB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/APB)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 9:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abe-lincolns-tax-reurns/794626/24 "2017-08-26T09:25:17Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > The best example of tax records “taking away” was the burning of the Palace of Westminster (i.e. the old Parliament buildings). > > For centuries, when the county tax collectors brought in the money they had collected, the royal officials in the Exchequer would make dual tally sticks: two sticks with marks cut in to show the pounds, shillings and pence brought in. They would give one of the tally sticks to the county tax official, and kept one for their own records. > > So what do you do with the tally sticks? Store them in the basements of the Palace of Westminster. > > Where they dry out. > > And then, when you need the space (per **Little Nemo** ), and decide to burn several centuries of dry tally sticks, they cause a chimney fire which rapidly gets out of control … > > Oh well, the replacement Parliament buildings are quite impressive. 🙂 But that example can just as easily be used to make the opposite point. The Exchequer officials were nothing if not bureaucrats to their very core and so they had always kept multiple records of every transaction. That meant that while the tally sticks could be used if necessary to authenticate their other half, they had never been the primary record of those payments. The decision in the 1830s to burn the tally sticks was made in the full knowledge that there were other, more detailed and easier-to-use records of that information. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abe-lincolns-tax-reurns/794626/25 "2017-08-26T20:41:34Z")
> [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](#): > > It would simply be wrong to keep them secret. Why would it be wrong? ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2017, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abe-lincolns-tax-reurns/794626/26 "2017-08-29T01:40:41Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > The data from some 1960s computer system stored on 1960s backup tapes has long since degraded into unreadability. As well there are no functioning tape drives that can read it any more. 1960’s magnetic tapes degraded unless copied and re-written. But some may still be readable with some care: people continue to do that for irreplaceable data. 1960’s magnetic tape drives are still available. 1960’s paper tapes are still in good condition. Paper tape drives are less common, but also more robust and easier to fix. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [August 29, 2017, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abe-lincolns-tax-reurns/794626/27 "2017-08-29T02:46:13Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > The data from some 1960s computer system stored on 1960s backup tapes has long since degraded into unreadability. As well there are no functioning tape drives that can read it any more. That’s why I keep all my 1960s code on 96-column punch cards. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2017, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abe-lincolns-tax-reurns/794626/28 "2017-08-30T02:22:10Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > That’s why I keep all my 1960s code on 96-column punch cards. 😃 When I learned FORTRAN in the 70’s, our tutor had his research project on the school mainframe. And he’d paid for a storage tape in the protected storage area. And since it represented 3 years of his life, he had the original punched cards in a box in his office on the other side of the campus. As the ultimate backup. So it came as an existential shock to me when the university got rid of it’s last card reader, and notified users that they would no longer be able to read cards. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abe-lincolns-tax-reurns/794626.md?page=1)