# Abortion-clinic picketers. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 6, 2011, 5:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-clinic-picketers/580935 "2011-05-06T05:57:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-clinic-picketers/580935/81 "2011-05-06T17:23:29Z")
> [@classyladyhp](#): > > It is not the baby’s fault it was conceived. There is always adoption. And the dangers to the mothers health - well that’s just the price she pays for being a slut and getting raped. She was probably dressed like a slut and was asking for it. Good girls don’t get raped after all. ---
**Author:** ![classyladyhp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b5ac83/32.png) [@classyladyhp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/classyladyhp)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-clinic-picketers/580935/82 "2011-05-06T17:23:32Z")
> [@LavenderBlue](#): > > Both of you need lessons in biology. Conception does NOT equal baby. Many fertilized eggs cannot become babies. Believe me, after several chemical pregnancies and slightly later miscarriages I know this from bitter experience. > > Human reproduction is far more complex than the simplistic pieties allowed for by the anti-abortionists. I don’t need a lesson in biology. Thanks. I know what a chemical pregnancy is and there is no need to abort a chemical pregnancy as that pregnancy has already aborted itself. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-clinic-picketers/580935/83 "2011-05-06T17:24:29Z")
> [@stpauler](#): > > And remember that putting peanut butter and jelly on the same piece of bread… Whatever. The point is, if you support the _right to choose_, it doesn’t make sense to picket against any place helping pregnant women exercise their choice, whatever the choice is. They aren’t the ones producing the “abused children with fetal alcohol syndrome.” A woman choosing to not have an abortion is not “the other side” to a woman choosing to have an abortion. They are the same. ---
**Author:** ![classyladyhp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b5ac83/32.png) [@classyladyhp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/classyladyhp)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-clinic-picketers/580935/84 "2011-05-06T17:24:32Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > And the dangers to the mothers health - well that’s just the price she pays for being a slut and getting raped. She was probably dressed like a slut and was asking for it. Good girls don’t get raped after all. Wow. What is wrong with you? I didn’t say a woman who is raped is a slut. For goodness sakes:smack: ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-clinic-picketers/580935/85 "2011-05-06T17:30:17Z")
> [@classyladyhp](#): > > It is not the baby’s fault it was conceived. There is always adoption. Right. A woman is expected to go through pregnancy and children birthbirth, then hand the baby over like a sack of potatoes.. And she never suffers any bad effects from all of this. The local PP is opposite from the library, and I’ve witnessed what the protestors do and how disgusting they really are. I’ve seen them put their hands on women and actulally chase them down the street trying to hand them literature. They will not accept the fact that when someone says NO, they should give up. The lies I’ve heard from these people: Every women regrets an abortion. No woman regrets an adoption. Abortion causes breast cancer, suicide, infertility, etc. No doctors work there. They are only abortionists. All they do there is abortions. Don’t listen to her. She just wants you to have an abortion. God wants you to have your baby. ETA: My town held a rally to support Planned Parenthood last month. The local anti-abortion group agreed to speak after they did. Yet during the PP presentation, the anti-abortions group screamed and trie down out the PP supporters. When the antis had their say, the pros were totally quiet. So which side had the best manners? ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-clinic-picketers/580935/86 "2011-05-06T17:32:13Z")
[QUOTE=classyladyhp] If what they are doing happens to convince at least one woman not to kill her innocent baby then it’s worth it. [/quote] [QUOTE=classyladyhp] I don’t need a lesson in biology. [/QUOTE] :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-clinic-picketers/580935/87 "2011-05-06T17:32:48Z")
> [@classyladyhp](#): > > Wow. What is wrong with you? I didn’t say a woman who is raped is a slut. For goodness sakes:smack: Of course not. However, others here do seem to be able to mysteriously know the motivations of those that they have never met, except by moralizing to them on the sidewalk. Why should a woman be forced to carry the child of her rapist, damaging her physical and mental health? Is it just tough luck for her? ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-clinic-picketers/580935/88 "2011-05-06T17:36:56Z")
> [@WolfpackJeep](#): > > **Beniamino** , you’re aware that Planned Parenthood offers medical services other than abortion, right? This is the number one reason why I volunteer as an escort–most people going to women’s health/resource clinics are not going for an abortion and they don’t need the harassment and idiocy. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-clinic-picketers/580935/89 "2011-05-06T17:41:33Z")
> [@classyladyhp](#): > > It is not the baby’s fault it was conceived. There is always adoption. I consider adoption the most evil concept in the universe. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-clinic-picketers/580935/90 "2011-05-06T17:42:18Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > I consider adoption the most evil concept in the universe. Okay, you’re _also_ fucking stupid, though for different reasons. ---
**Author:** ![stretch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a6a055/32.png) [@stretch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stretch)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-clinic-picketers/580935/91 "2011-05-06T17:42:23Z")
I used to work near a women’s health clinic that provided abortions in addition to other services. Our building’s parking was in the lot next to the clinic. Some days I would get out of my car and immediately someone would walk up to me and tell me not to kill my baby. Everyday I was treated to the joys of gory pictures. Hey, folks, I just wanted to get to work. I didn’t chose to have to park there. I surely did not want to have to talk to these dimwits all the time. Also, I had been to that clinic for my own purposes as well as to provide support during a friend’s abortion. Being bothered on your way to getting a pap smear is just super fun! The picketers lack of care for the people using the clinic is appalling and makes it apparent that they only care about the women as a vehicle for carrying potential people. Once you are an actual person, you are shit on their shoes. ---
**Author:** ![Beniamino](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bcef8e/32.png) [@Beniamino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beniamino)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-clinic-picketers/580935/92 "2011-05-06T17:42:52Z")
> [@](#): > > This is where the anti-abortion folks truly puzzle me. If you truly believe abortion is the murder of a baby, why on earth would you not work as hard as possible to get contraception into the hands of every sexually-active person in America? It’s going to be infinitely more effective than trying to shame the already-pregnant, yet pro-choice people (who don’t feel abortion is murder) are far more likely to promote birth control than pro-life people (who do). Why? > [@Giraffe](#): > > **classladyhp** , **Beniamino** : any comment on this? I’d be interested to hear your thoughts. Patience. We’re getting a bit swarmed here, as you can see. I think the simplest answer is that utilitarianism fails as a moral position. That is to say, there are lots of ways to reduce murder across the board – cut government funding of education and social welfare programs, and funnel all of the money into policing and monitoring citizens; mandatory psychological testing for all citizens, and confinement of those demonstrating violent tendencies; etc. But, clearly, the ends don’t always justify the means. These would not be desirable means. Now, I don’t think that anybody seriously advocates making contraception illegal, as it is an individual choice, which does not harm any other individual. But those of us who do not believe contraception or pre-marital sex to be a moral good cannot advocate it, even if it might, in some utilitarian sense (though this has not been proven), reduce the rates of abortion. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-clinic-picketers/580935/93 "2011-05-06T17:42:58Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > I consider adoption the most evil concept in the universe. Closely followed by hugs and teddy bears? ---
**Author:** ![classyladyhp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b5ac83/32.png) [@classyladyhp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/classyladyhp)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-clinic-picketers/580935/94 "2011-05-06T17:43:04Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > I consider adoption the most evil concept in the universe. Really? I consider murder to be more evil than adoption. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-clinic-picketers/580935/95 "2011-05-06T17:45:20Z")
> [@classyladyhp](#): > > It is not the baby’s fault it was conceived. There is always adoption. Neither is it the woman’s fault in case of rape–so why is it okay to punish her by making her carry the baby? Oh, it’s not punishment? Would you accept being locked up for nine months if you were assaulted? * * * Fundamentally speaking, it DOES hinge on when human rights attach. It’s my opinion, given that we permit the removal-from-life-support of comatose patients who are not expected to recover, that the current legal definition involves “mental function” and not “conception”. Which also strikes me as the moral difference between a tumor and a human (composed of cells grown from the same DNA). I don’t care “what it’s going to become”–certainly a human fetus will eventually, uninterrupted, become a human in most cases. I’m not allows to pre-emptively imprison a person who is (like, say, a homeless drug addict) likely to become a criminal in most cases. We do not in this country make legal decisions based on what could be, but what currently is. ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-clinic-picketers/580935/96 "2011-05-06T17:45:29Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Closely followed by hugs and teddy bears? Yeah, I think it goes (1) Adoption, (2) Ethnic Cleansing, (3) Hugs. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-clinic-picketers/580935/97 "2011-05-06T17:48:19Z")
> [@classyladyhp](#): > > Abortion is totally different from the scenario you just described. The unborn baby did not attach itself to the womb BY ITSELF. A certain act had to occur on the part of it’s parents in order for it to attach itslelf. It’s not the same thing at all. Many a criminal is aided in the commission of a crime by mistakes the victim made. That doesn’t mean we stop punishing burgulars because a door was left unlocked or let rapists go because the victim was too drunk to say no. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-clinic-picketers/580935/98 "2011-05-06T17:50:46Z")
> [@Jas09](#): > > Yeah, I think it goes (1) Adoption, (2) Ethnic Cleansing, (3) Hugs. Adoption is often a feature of ethnic cleansing. Infants from targeted minorities are given to members of the dominant group to adopt and raise as their own. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-clinic-picketers/580935/99 "2011-05-06T17:52:21Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > I consider adoption the most evil concept in the universe. > [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Okay, you’re _also_ fucking stupid, though for different reasons. I read the book of the proceedings that made abortion legal in NYS (pre-Roe v. Wade). They considered the idea that a woman could be pregant for nine months, give birth to a child, and then hand it over to strangers like a sack of potatoes to be “an abombination.” I concur. I also read “The Girls That Went Away,” a book of interviews with girls that were forced into surrending their babies pre-Wade. Many of them had subsequent abortions, not being able to bear the thought of losing another child. Adoption can be the answeer to an unwanted pregnancy. It can also be an exceptionally cruel thing. Either way, it should be decided by the pregnant woman, and their should be another option. If nothing else kept me pro-choice (aside from the violence, lies and impoliteness of such people), it would be their stance that adoption is a magical la-la land where nothing goes wrong. It is not! ---
**Author:** ![margin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/65b543/32.png) [@margin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/margin)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-clinic-picketers/580935/100 "2011-05-06T17:54:36Z")
> [@spark240](#): > > That seems like the best response. > > Of course the anti-abortionist’s camera, like the demonstration itself, is intended to be intimidating, or at least confrontational. That’s pretty much the point–though in fairness it must be acknowledged that there _have_ been threats of violence on all sides, so filming for potential evidentiary reasons isn’t a complete fantasy for anyone involved. > > So long as they’re not actually _preventing_ women from going in, they are and should be legal. So the appropriate reaction in a free society is to similarly meet that confrontation; that’s “clinic defense.” Threats of violence on all sides? Utter bullshit. The anti-choicers have been bombing, harassing, terrorizing, stalking, and _murdering_ abortion doctors for decades now. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-clinic-picketers/580935.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-clinic-picketers/580935.md?page=6)