# Abortion Issue got me sleeping on the Couch **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 16, 2005, 9:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-issue-got-me-sleeping-on-the-couch/304041 "2005-05-16T09:11:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-issue-got-me-sleeping-on-the-couch/304041/101 "2005-05-17T17:03:54Z")
> [@Priceguy](#): > > By the way, in my last post I accidentally attributed a quote to **lezlers** that was really by **andros**. Apologies. Happens. ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-issue-got-me-sleeping-on-the-couch/304041/102 "2005-05-17T17:20:43Z")
> [@Priceguy](#): > > I don’t want any more apologies. I didn’t even want the one. I stopped responding to **fessie** when she stopped asking me questions. It was **Biggirl** , **andros** and **lezlers** (and now you) who kept it going. If no-one ever mentions this matter ever again I’ll be a happier man. > > By the way, in my last post I accidentally attributed a quote to **lezlers** that was really by **andros**. Apologies. See how perceptions can be so different? My take on this sidebar: fessie:Blah, blah some innocous comment on Priceguy’s post, blah, blah. Priceguy: That’s why I hate you, fessie! fessie:Huh? Sorry to have hurt your feelings. Didn’t mean to. Priceguy: Of course you hurt my feelings. That’s why I hate you. fessie: Well, sorry if I hurt your feelings. Priceguy: I don’t want your apology. That’s why I hate you! Everybody else: Damn, Priceguy. Take it down a notch. Priceguy: Hey, it aint me it’s all of YOU flying off the handle! Shut up about it already. O.K. NOW you can say I’m harping on it, Priceguy. ---
**Author:** ![Dunderman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ecb155/32.png) [@Dunderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dunderman)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-issue-got-me-sleeping-on-the-couch/304041/103 "2005-05-17T17:22:32Z")
> [@Biggirl](#): > > O.K. NOW you can say I’m harping on it, Priceguy. You’re harping on about it. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-issue-got-me-sleeping-on-the-couch/304041/104 "2005-05-17T20:07:04Z")
Fuck, there’s so much goddamn harping going on that I’m expecting posts from Chico and Groucho! And **three** hard-boiled eggs, GODDAMNIT! heh. I don’t even know what’s under discussion. ---
**Author:** ![Red\_Stilettos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/fbc32d/32.png) [@Red\_Stilettos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Red_Stilettos)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-issue-got-me-sleeping-on-the-couch/304041/105 "2005-05-17T20:10:01Z")
> [@lezlers](#): > > And **Priceguy** , I just call 'em as I see 'em. The fact that no one here has jumped to your aid should be a slight indicator that your reaction is a bit…over the top. OK, I’ll wade in on **Priceguy’s** side. I think **fessie** was the one jumping to conclusions here. Plenty of people have chimed in saying that banishing an SO to the couch is not for them. **Priceguy** just stated it a little differently. The problem is **fessie** has no idea how egregious the statement would have to be for **Priceguy** to boot his SO. He’s not saying that any disagreement is a banning offense. He’s just saying that there are only two choices: share the bed or leave the relationship. We have no idea where he draws that line. For all we know, statements that would have **fessie’s** SO on the couch would leave **Priceguy’s** SO still in the bed, though probably not all snuggly. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-issue-got-me-sleeping-on-the-couch/304041/106 "2005-05-17T20:14:48Z")
BTW, what IS the reason for “never go to bed angry?” What, in case one of you dies in your sleep? ---
**Author:** ![fessie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c37758/32.png) [@fessie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fessie)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-issue-got-me-sleeping-on-the-couch/304041/107 "2005-05-17T20:20:07Z")
> [@Red Stilettos](#): > > OK, I’ll wade in on **Priceguy’s** side. I think **fessie** was the one jumping to conclusions here. Plenty of people have chimed in saying that banishing an SO to the couch is not for them. **Priceguy** just stated it a little differently. The problem is **fessie** has no idea how egregious the statement would have to be for **Priceguy** to boot his SO. He’s not saying that any disagreement is a banning offense. He’s just saying that there are only two choices: share the bed or leave the relationship. We have no idea where he draws that line. For all we know, statements that would have **fessie’s** SO on the couch would leave **Priceguy’s** SO still in the bed, though probably not all snuggly. Really it brought to mind those Seinfeld episodes where a lover was AOK until they made some slip-up, then it was goodbye forever. Share the bed/leave the relationship seems rather black & white thinking, to me. YMMV. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-issue-got-me-sleeping-on-the-couch/304041/108 "2005-05-17T20:22:39Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > BTW, what IS the reason for “never go to bed angry?” What, in case one of you dies in your sleep? Well, to be tasteless for a moment, the lesson of Phil Hartman should be “Don’t make your spouse angry, and then go to bed.” ---
**Author:** ![DogMom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e9c0ed/32.png) [@DogMom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DogMom)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-issue-got-me-sleeping-on-the-couch/304041/109 "2005-05-17T20:29:36Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > BTW, what IS the reason for “never go to bed angry?” What, in case one of you dies in your sleep? I think a lot of it is just the way some people handle their anger. For DogDad and me, if it’s important enough to be ANGRY about, then there’s no frigging way we’re sleeping anyway. And if we’re ANGRY about something, enough to need a cooling-off time, sleep isn’t going to come until the issue has been resolved. We’ll go outside, walk the dog, walk around the block, slam tools around in the garage, whatever - but we WON’Tgo to sleep. If we do try, we’ll just wind up thinking about it all night long, because there’s nothing to distract us from THE ISSUE, and if we DO get any sleep it’s going to be crappy and not at all restful. So we’ll wake up exhausted, and even MORE pissed-off than we were to begin with. At that point, there’s not a chance in hell that we’ll be able to discuss The Issue rationally, or “cooled-off”. Which is a long-winded way of saying, “If you can sleep and the whole “let it cool down overnight after a good night’s sleep” thing works for you, great. But for some, the issue will NOT improve over time, and it’ll just fester and grow into a HUGE ISSUE, instead of something that could’ve been resolved in a couple hours.” Hey, “don’t go to bed angry” has led to some 1-am discussions for us, but what the hell - we weren’t sleeping anyway. AND we got the issues resolved and got a GOOD, if short, night’s sleep. And, quite frankly, if I **can** actually get a good night’s sleep, then I’m not arguing with anyone, or the issue isn’t important enough to bring up in the morning. ---
**Author:** ![Red\_Stilettos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/fbc32d/32.png) [@Red\_Stilettos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Red_Stilettos)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-issue-got-me-sleeping-on-the-couch/304041/110 "2005-05-17T20:38:04Z")
> [@fessie](#): > > Really it brought to mind those Seinfeld episodes where a lover was AOK until they made some slip-up, then it was goodbye forever. Share the bed/leave the relationship seems rather black & white thinking, to me. YMMV. You’re still missing the point. He didn’t say one slipup and she’s gone. He said that if it were _bad enough_ to make him want to sleep separately, it would be too bad for the relationship to survive. You are assuming that means that a small transgression would end the relationship. Another possible assumption is that a huge transgression would have them still sharing a bed. My point is that you don’t know where **Priceguy** draws that line, so you jumped to a conclusion that he must be intolerant. His statements here could also support an argument that he is extremely tolerant. You don’t know enough to make that judgement. ---
**Author:** ![fessie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c37758/32.png) [@fessie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fessie)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-issue-got-me-sleeping-on-the-couch/304041/111 "2005-05-17T20:51:46Z")
Yep. You’re exactly right. My frame of reference, not **Priceguy’s**. ---
**Author:** ![Excalibre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/898d66/32.png) [@Excalibre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Excalibre)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-issue-got-me-sleeping-on-the-couch/304041/112 "2005-05-17T21:09:54Z")
> [@fessie](#): > > Really it brought to mind those Seinfeld episodes where a lover was AOK until they made some slip-up, then it was goodbye forever. Share the bed/leave the relationship seems rather black & white thinking, to me. YMMV. Why? The point is that he’s willing to share a bed with someone, even if he’s a little pissed at them. I don’t see why that seems like a strange idea to you; I always thought banning someone to the couch was just a sitcome move. I didn’t know a lot of folks did that. It’s not like his girlfriend accidentally sticks a CD on the shelf out of alphabetical order once and the relationship’s over. You really are starting to look like you’re finding fault with something that’s an unresolvable matter of personal choice. Why do you think this is something worth arguing about? ---
**Author:** ![fessie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c37758/32.png) [@fessie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fessie)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-issue-got-me-sleeping-on-the-couch/304041/113 "2005-05-17T21:14:27Z")
> [@Excalibre](#): > > Why? The point is that he’s willing to share a bed with someone, even if he’s a little pissed at them. I don’t see why that seems like a strange idea to you; I always thought banning someone to the couch was just a sitcome move. I didn’t know a lot of folks did that. > > It’s not like his girlfriend accidentally sticks a CD on the shelf out of alphabetical order once and the relationship’s over. You really are starting to look like you’re finding fault with something that’s an unresolvable matter of personal choice. Why do you think this is something worth arguing about? Why are you continuing the discussion past **Red Stilettos** ’ point, which summed it up perfectly? ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-issue-got-me-sleeping-on-the-couch/304041/114 "2005-05-17T21:14:55Z")
At the risk of totally hijacking an already hijacked thread, I’ve got to agree with **Priceguy**. All he said is that if something was serious enough to him that he didn’t want someone sharing his bed, that it would be serious enough to end the relationship. That means, as far as I can see, that he just thinks that kicking someone out of bed isn’t to be used for minor things, and that if something is really major it’s a deal breaker anyways. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-issue-got-me-sleeping-on-the-couch/304041/115 "2005-05-17T21:17:45Z")
I’d wager he was continuing it, and so was I, because post 111 seemed rather sarcastic. If not then sure, it’s time to drop the issue. ---
**Author:** ![fessie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c37758/32.png) [@fessie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fessie)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-issue-got-me-sleeping-on-the-couch/304041/116 "2005-05-17T21:25:01Z")
I think that’s also true, **FinnAgain**. I’ll even extend the breadth of my apology - as **Red Stilettos** pointed out, I took **Priceguy** ’s statement as an indication of intolerance, rather than extreme tolerance, without knowing him from Adam. That was unfair. I was surprised that he responded so defensively, but perhaps that’s b/c he goes out of his way to avoid misogynistic behavior, as demonstrated by his first post in this thread (which I didn’t read that carefully the first time through). However, OTOH, it’s been my experience that in order for a relationship to last a number of years, major things (that could by themselves be deal-breakers) need to be survived as well. That in itself might be an interesting thread; I’d be interested to know if other couples have experienced the same. /on preview - I’m guessing post 111 was mine? Sarcastic? Sheeeeit, I’m not the only one making assumptions. ---
**Author:** ![Excalibre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/898d66/32.png) [@Excalibre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Excalibre)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-issue-got-me-sleeping-on-the-couch/304041/117 "2005-05-17T21:31:34Z")
> [@fessie](#): > > Why are you continuing the discussion past **Red Stilettos** ’ point, which summed it up perfectly? Apologies. I open up several tabs at once; it appeared not to be posted yet, and I didn’t remember to reload first like I usually do with particularly active threads. ---
**Author:** ![Lilairen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8491ac/32.png) [@Lilairen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lilairen)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2005, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-issue-got-me-sleeping-on-the-couch/304041/118 "2005-05-17T22:12:45Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > BTW, what IS the reason for “never go to bed angry?” What, in case one of you dies in your sleep? If I sleep on an emotion it tends to become ingrained; also, if I am seriously distressed by something, the only way I’m liable to be able to get to sleep is to shift to an emotional situation where I have given up on resolution. So basically, if I go to bed angry, I either wind up with a near-permanent grudge or having given up on whatever situation it was that provoked the anger – which, if it’s a Big Relationship Issue, means the relationship. ---
**Author:** ![Dunderman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ecb155/32.png) [@Dunderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dunderman)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2005, 5:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-issue-got-me-sleeping-on-the-couch/304041/119 "2005-05-18T05:59:03Z")
**Red Stilettos** , **Excalibre** and **FinnAgain** : Thanks for sticking up for me while I got some sleep (alone). > [@Guinastasia](#): > > BTW, what IS the reason for “never go to bed angry?” If I were to go to bed angry about a fight with Pricegal (especially if I were banished from the bed), I’d lie there tossing and turning, mulling it over in my head, growing madder and madder, getting more and more bitter, getting some non-satisfying sleep and the next day it would sit so deep in me that it’d never go away. In my experience, snuggling solves many problems. If only people would snuggle more, the world would be a beautiful place. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2005, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-issue-got-me-sleeping-on-the-couch/304041/120 "2005-05-18T13:40:38Z")
> [@What Is Schwa](#): > > A harmless comment to my girlfriend avalanched into an all out argument tonight. I stated that in my utopian society I would like to see abortion disapear to be replaced by fantastic support agencies for a pregnant woman (such as adoption, etc) The following argument has led me to the conclusion on the subject. > > Women just want to fuck like a man. > > Ok, sure, that’s cool, but that is asking to have your cake and fucking eat it too. > > Women are the gatekeepers of sex. They learn this at a young age and realize its awesome potential. With great power comes great responsibility. > > Hmn, in a society where half your population cannot do something the other half can is there freedom? > > So shut the fuck up about “Reproduction Freedom.” It’s a reproductive PRIVALEDGE. I can’t have a baby, the closest I can get is to swallow a marble. Men don’t turn this into a power struggle, women do. Wherever a fetus swims in a uterus a man and woman got together and did the horizontal mambo. Republicans aren’t beating your door down and impregnating you with a turkey baster. Don’t frame this argument saying “Don’t tell a woman what to do!” Must I educate a woman how a baby is formed? The conception part doesn’t happen without a preceding choice… (don’t you DARE bring up rape/incest issues. Any human being understands there is no such thing as a black a white issue. Certain circumstances call for differntiating procedure.) > > Oh, yeah, it’s a real life changing event. Hey guess what? Every time I have sex with a woman I face the potental of getting a life altering disease. I can take as many precautions as I like but if i’m fucking, I might get unlucky. Beleive me, that’ll change my life. Abortion gives you all the benefits of fucking like a man with no drawbacks. Don’t talk to me about fairness, that is bullshit. > > So you want to have the sexual power over men? You want the beautiful gift of carying a child inside you? WELL THEY COME WITH A PRICE! Don’t give me that “I didn’t choose to be a woman” bullshit. Dress conservativly if you don’t want men looking at your tits. Admit it, you like feeling sexy (just like a man). > > \ I’m really not this conservative. My undies get in a bundle every time a neo-con or Transformers bad guy tells me what to do. I’ve participated in pro-choice rallies and vote accordingly. But don’t make me sleep on the fucking couch for not tolerating poor arguments. > > Or I really am an asshole… Hmmm. I don’t agree with your views on men & women & sex but I’d like to think I can admit to that w/o being an asshole about it. Men have responsibility for sex too, a child is theirs jsut as much as the womans. The men just drop out of the picture easier because they aren’t biologically tied to the child for 9 months like the woman is, that doesn’t make it right for them either. Overall, abortion may be for the best if you are talking about a child where neither parents wants him/her. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-issue-got-me-sleeping-on-the-couch/304041.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/abortion-issue-got-me-sleeping-on-the-couch/304041.md?page=7)